billvon 3,009 #276 December 28, 2010 >Ok - I will retype the same questions he refuses to answer every >time then. is that acceptable? No. No spamming. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
turtlespeed 221 #277 December 28, 2010 Quote>Ok - I will retype the same questions he refuses to answer every >time then. is that acceptable? No. No spamming. Then how would you suggest he be reminded that the question still remains unanswered.I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Belgian_Draft 0 #278 December 28, 2010 QuoteQuoteSure you can have your thoughts but to be so forcefull that they are all wrong while you are totally correct is bs. it is obvious to the majority of us that the super rich (and their children) do not pay their fair share of taxes. you can wriggle as much as you want but if you think otherwise you are in the democratic minority. They pay a larger percentage of their income to the government in taxes. They spend more so they pay more sales tax. How do you figure they aren't paying "their fair share"? Maybe you figure they pay enough when you don't have to pay any.HAMMER: Originally employed as a weapon of war, the hammer nowadays is used as a kind of divining rod to locate the most expensive parts adjacent the object we are trying to hit. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rushmc 23 #279 December 28, 2010 Quote Quote Quote Sure you can have your thoughts but to be so forcefull that they are all wrong while you are totally correct is bs. it is obvious to the majority of us that the super rich (and their children) do not pay their fair share of taxes. you can wriggle as much as you want but if you think otherwise you are in the democratic minority. They pay a larger percentage of their income to the government in taxes. They spend more so they pay more sales tax. How do you figure they aren't paying "their fair share"? Maybe you figure they pay enough when you don't have to pay any. We will not be able to understand any answer he gives to your questions until he answers to what he thinks is fair and who is the us majority he keeps posting to"America will never be destroyed from the outside, if we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." Abraham Lincoln Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dreamdancer 0 #280 December 29, 2010 QuoteHow do you figure they aren't paying "their fair share"? if they had been paying their fair share of taxes then the banks wouldn't have froze and we (the majority) wouldn't have had to bail the super rich (the minority) out...stay away from moving propellers - they bite blue skies from thai sky adventures good solid response-provoking keyboarding Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
winsor 236 #281 December 29, 2010 QuoteQuoteHow do you figure they aren't paying "their fair share"? if they had been paying their fair share of taxes then the banks wouldn't have froze and we (the majority) wouldn't have had to bail the super rich (the minority) out... The idea that you can give money to the gov't faster than they can waste it is absurd, on a par with the idea that you can hit it big in a casino if you have a sufficient line of credit. The reason our government is terminally in hock is not because of any failure to tax everything in sight, and the idea that the core problem is that people who have managed to turn a profit are holding out is truly asinine. Tell you what, you make a few million and donate it to the treasury; show us how it's done. Put up or shut up. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dreamdancer 0 #282 December 29, 2010 QuoteThe reason our government is terminally in hock is not because of any failure to tax. if the super rich paid their fair share of taxes then the government wouldn't have to tax the rest of us so much. surely that's not too mathematically advanced for you?stay away from moving propellers - they bite blue skies from thai sky adventures good solid response-provoking keyboarding Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mirage62 0 #283 December 29, 2010 He's beat............but living "the dream" (LTD)Kevin Keenan is my hero, a double FUP, he does so much with so little Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Belgian_Draft 0 #284 December 29, 2010 Quote Quote How do you figure they aren't paying "their fair share"? if they had been paying their fair share of taxes then the banks wouldn't have froze and we (the majority) wouldn't have had to bail the super rich (the minority) out... Yep, I was right. You want the upper 10% to support everyone.HAMMER: Originally employed as a weapon of war, the hammer nowadays is used as a kind of divining rod to locate the most expensive parts adjacent the object we are trying to hit. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dreamdancer 0 #285 December 29, 2010 QuoteYou want the upper 10% to support everyone. just pay their fair share of taxes. and their children do their fair share of the work same as the rest of us... (now about those tax havens for the super rich - how do they support us)stay away from moving propellers - they bite blue skies from thai sky adventures good solid response-provoking keyboarding Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
champu 1 #286 December 29, 2010 QuoteEstate taxes are a form of capital gains tax, imposed when tangible assets like land, and/or intangible assets like large investment portfolios, move on to new ownership. Land that was bought thirty, fifty, or 100 years ago increases in value due to the public construction of roads, improved access to utilities and water, which are all government funded improvements. Real estate does not increase in value in a vacuum, unaffected by the rest of society. Nether do investment portfolios, are businesses. It's similar to the concept of having a tax on unrealized capital gains. Sure the value of properties and portfolios increase over time, but unless you liquidate it, that increase in value is meaningless. If the heir wants to sell some of the estate to get the money then yes, they should pay capital gains relative to the cost to the original owner, if they continue to produce income from the estate then yes, they should pay income tax on that. That is what could be considered their "fair share" that everyone keeps complaining isn't getting paid. Having to pay tax on unrealized capital gains would wreak havoc on long-term investing and just about any kind of real-estate ownership. Creating an estate to leave to your heirs is just an example of a really-long-term investment. But as I've said before, this isn't about "fair shares", this is about a loathing of the idea of "old money" and a mistrust of the always-ill-defined "super-rich". This is the same poor state of mind that brought us real gems like the AMT (which is completely and utterly broken at this point.) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rushmc 23 #287 December 29, 2010 Quote Quote Quote How do you figure they aren't paying "their fair share"? if they had been paying their fair share of taxes then the banks wouldn't have froze and we (the majority) wouldn't have had to bail the super rich (the minority) out... Yep, I was right. You want the upper 10% to support everyone. I think he just does not want there to be an upper 10% His green side is still showing"America will never be destroyed from the outside, if we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." Abraham Lincoln Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dreamdancer 0 #288 December 29, 2010 Quote Quote Quote Quote How do you figure they aren't paying "their fair share"? if they had been paying their fair share of taxes then the banks wouldn't have froze and we (the majority) wouldn't have had to bail the super rich (the minority) out... Yep, I was right. You want the upper 10% to support everyone. I think he just does not want there to be an upper 10% a mathematically meaningless statement - not that you'll be able to work that out (why do you hate the poor - do tell)stay away from moving propellers - they bite blue skies from thai sky adventures good solid response-provoking keyboarding Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rushmc 23 #289 December 29, 2010 Quote Quote Quote Quote Quote How do you figure they aren't paying "their fair share"? if they had been paying their fair share of taxes then the banks wouldn't have froze and we (the majority) wouldn't have had to bail the super rich (the minority) out... Yep, I was right. You want the upper 10% to support everyone. I think he just does not want there to be an upper 10% a mathematically meaningless statement - not that you'll be able to work that out (why do you hate the poor - do tell) Actually I am a advocate to help the poor but the fact remains you wish a gov to take something and give to people like you for one of two reasons To give the stolen money to those whom YOU think need it or Give it yourself because you think you need it The programs you support only serve to keep the poor poor, which is dispicable sir. Safety nets? Ya we need them But again A principaled stance it my money is mine and their money is theirs and I have no right to it Why do you want to keep the poor so poor? Power?"America will never be destroyed from the outside, if we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." Abraham Lincoln Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dreamdancer 0 #290 December 29, 2010 QuoteActually I am a advocate to help the poor. good, you'll agree with me then that the super rich should pay their fair share of taxes which would definitely help the poor and the rest of us.stay away from moving propellers - they bite blue skies from thai sky adventures good solid response-provoking keyboarding Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rushmc 23 #291 December 29, 2010 QuoteQuoteActually I am a advocate to help the poor. good, you'll agree with me then that the super rich should pay their fair share of taxes which would definitely help the poor and the rest of us. No But I will agree that they already do (pay their fair share if not more) and you and yours are not entittled to any more of it than you already get Who is us? Specificall sir Who is this mystical us in many of your posts?"America will never be destroyed from the outside, if we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." Abraham Lincoln Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,032 #292 December 29, 2010 Quote Actually I am a advocate to help the poor Very funny. Next you'll be telling us that you are appalled at how the gap between rich and poor in the USA has been increasing dramatically for the past 30 years. And we won't believe you on that either.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
winsor 236 #293 December 29, 2010 QuoteQuoteThe reason our government is terminally in hock is not because of any failure to tax. if the super rich paid their fair share of taxes then the government wouldn't have to tax the rest of us so much. surely that's not too mathematically advanced for you? I understood there would be no math. Your implied supposition that we operate under a zeo-sum system of taxation is terminally flawed - as are all of your other arguments. Keep it up, however, since you provide a classic case in point of the inanity of the the causes you espouse (which could very well be your point). Any time someone uses terms like "fair share," their logic is suspect. The "super rich" of my acquaintance pay orders of magnitude more taxes than do the "middle class," while the "poverty stricken" pay nothing, absorb resources, and procreate in sufficient quantity to ensure the continued cycle of poverty. Whether you have noticed or not, what the government spends has nothing to do with how much comes in in the form of taxes. It amazes me that anyone in the government could take exception to Bernie Madoff or Enron, since they are all cut from the same cloth. If, by "fair share," you mean anything along the lines of a flat rate, you have my attention. Nobody is penalized or subsidized, and everyone pays precisely the same percentage of income. If you sit around, smoke pot and listen to Ten Years After, the idea of no "rich" may seem idyllic. In practice, however, all that is accomplished by those with an excess of egalitarian zeal is to put us all out of business. Anything you recommend has been tried - with remarkably uniform results. You may wish to continue to do the same things and expect different results, though you should note that this is a classic definition of insanity. BSBD, Winsor Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rushmc 23 #294 December 29, 2010 QuoteQuote Actually I am a advocate to help the poor Very funny. Next you'll be telling us that you are appalled at how the gap between rich and poor in the USA has been increasing dramatically for the past 30 years. And we won't believe you on that either. Yes You are funny"America will never be destroyed from the outside, if we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." Abraham Lincoln Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
winsor 236 #295 December 29, 2010 QuoteQuote Actually I am a advocate to help the poor Very funny. Next you'll be telling us that you are appalled at how the gap between rich and poor in the USA has been increasing dramatically for the past 30 years. And we won't believe you on that either. For the past 30 years we have been paying the poor to breed. With kids as a cash crop, the population on the lowest tier has blossomed geometrically and unsustainably. This all falls into the law of unintended consequences; the road to hell being paved with good intentions and all that. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rhaig 0 #296 December 29, 2010 QuoteQuoteYou want the upper 10% to support everyone. just pay their fair share of taxes. and their children do their fair share of the work same as the rest of us... (now about those tax havens for the super rich - how do they support us) you keep saying "fair share" without having defined it. Until you say otherwise, it looks lik you really do want them to pay 100% of the tax in the US and the non-super rich (presumably you included) pay nothing.-- Rob Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bolas 5 #297 December 29, 2010 Quote Quote Quote Actually I am a advocate to help the poor Very funny. Next you'll be telling us that you are appalled at how the gap between rich and poor in the USA has been increasing dramatically for the past 30 years. And we won't believe you on that either. For the past 30 years we have been paying the poor to breed. With kids as a cash crop, the population on the lowest tier has blossomed geometrically and unsustainably. This all falls into the law of unintended consequences, the road to hell being paved with good intentions and all that. +1. Saving people from themselves has a very low long term success rate and most times just leads to more and more help needed. Stupidity if left untreated is self-correcting If ya can't be good, look good, if that fails, make 'em laugh. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,009 #298 December 29, 2010 >if the super rich paid their fair share of taxes then the >government wouldn't have to tax the rest of us so much. And if the middle class paid more of their share of taxes then the government wouldn't have to tax the rest of us so much. So what? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dreamdancer 0 #299 December 29, 2010 Quote Saving people from themselves has a very low long term success rate and most times just leads to more and more help needed. like the help of a timely unearned inheritance for the super rich...stay away from moving propellers - they bite blue skies from thai sky adventures good solid response-provoking keyboarding Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dreamdancer 0 #300 December 29, 2010 QuoteFor the past 30 years we have been paying the poor to breed. who's 'we'? (and why do you hate the bottom 10% of society - but fawn over the top 10%)stay away from moving propellers - they bite blue skies from thai sky adventures good solid response-provoking keyboarding Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
