2405 shot dead since Tucson

[kallend 2,027]

So you admit being mistaken about the airplane analogy.

OK, that's progress.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[wsd 0]

Answer instead of weaseling around and you would get more respect as a person of integrity.

[hwt 0]

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www.newsweek.com/2011/03/13/2-405-shot-dead-since-tucson.html

_______________________________________________
It's no wonder there are so many people being shot in Mexico,
The government was dealing guns to the Mexican cartels ...
http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-31727_162-20058589-10391695.html

[kallend 2,027]

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Answer instead of weaseling around and you would get more respect as a person of integrity.

Irony score 10/10, Mr No Name Entered, "wsd did not set a location yet.", "No home dropzone entered."

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[wsd 0]

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Answer instead of weaseling around and you would get more respect as a person of integrity.

Irony score 10/10, Mr No Name Entered, "wsd did not set a location yet.", "No home dropzone entered."

Once again, I did not get asked a question pertaining to this thread that I did not answer,

Weaseling away the night eh?

Just answer and prove us all wrong.


I dare you

[kallend 2,027]

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Answer instead of weaseling around and you would get more respect as a person of integrity.

Irony score 10/10, Mr No Name Entered, "wsd did not set a location yet.", "No home dropzone entered."

Once again, I did not get asked a question pertaining to this thread that I did not answer,

Weaseling away the night eh?

Just answer and prove us all wrong.


I dare you

You could try looking in the archives instead of being lazy, Mr No Name Entered. This forum existed long before you registered 2 weeks ago.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[Amazon 7]

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Answer instead of weaseling around and you would get more respect as a person of integrity.

Irony score 10/10, Mr No Name Entered, "wsd did not set a location yet.", "No home dropzone entered."

Once again, I did not get asked a question pertaining to this thread that I did not answer,

Weaseling away the night eh?

Just answer and prove us all wrong.


I dare you

You could try looking in the archives instead of being lazy, Mr No Name Entered. This forum existed long before you registered 2 weeks ago.

John I think wsd is probably a long timemember of the usual suspects using another name... based on his post #247

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It is all he ever does...

Ask him a direct question such as "what firearms do you think should be outlawed?" and he will sing and dance but never answer.

He will also never how he would decide who should and should not own a firearm, his answer is no nutters and felons, he will not tell you how the decision is to be made on excluding those persons.

[DaVinci 0]

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So you admit being mistaken about the airplane analogy.

As soon as you admit that anything that shoots a projectile is a gun and therefore protected by the 2nd... We might be finally getting somewhere.

BTW why no response on this yet?

Still waiting on YOU to answer this one

Still waiting... you keep saying that the SC is the final say here in the US.

Do you have a problem with the phrase "Shall not be infringed"?

You love to claim that the SC is the final say.... Cool.

But I have shown, using ONLY SC cases, the SCOTUS has said that an individual is allowed an M-16.

You have not been able to counter that claim.

United States v. Miller: "The Second Amendment protects only the ownership of military-type weapons appropriate for use in an organized militia."

DC v Heller: that it is "an individual right to possess a firearm unconnected with service in a militia,"

"The Amendment’s prefatory clause announces a purpose, but does not limit or expand the scope of the second part, the operative clause"

McDonald v. Chicago: that it applies to the States

You have shown that it is not an unlimited right.... Yes, and to cite the SC they mentioned prohibitions 'against felons and the insane'.

But the fact remains that the SC has ruled that it is an individual right to own a 'military-type weapon' in all of the United States.

Can you provide a SINGLE SCOTUS quote that proves your position against my comment?

Remember, "Shall not be infringed" is already there as well.

[DaVinci 0]

Interesting comment in your link: "We know that guns can contribute to a community’s safety, and yet we acknowledge that none of the 18 mass shootings since May 2007 was stopped by a legal-handgun carrier. "

OK, so lets look at a list I quickly "googled"

-- In April 1999, two teenage schoolboys shot and killed 12 schoolmates and a teacher at Columbine High School in Littleton, Colorado, before killing themselves.
* criminal records/known mental issues
* not able to buy the guns legally
* not allowed to have guns at a school

-- In July 1999, a stock exchange trader in Atlanta, Georgia, killed 12 people including his wife and two children before taking his own life.
* Killed his family with a hammer, not a gun.
* all the other murders were at a business that didnt allow firearms.

-- In September 1999, a gunman opened fire at a prayer service in Fort Worth, Texas, killing six people before committing suicide.
* also used a pipe bomb
* lets not forget Jeanne Assam http://www.denverpost.com/breakingnews/ci_7683781

-- In October 2002, a series of sniper-style shootings occurred in Washington DC, leaving 10 dead.
*Muhammad was arrested on federal charges of violating the restraining order against him by possessing a weapon. Under federal law, those with restraining orders are prohibited to purchase or possess guns as per the Lautenberg Amendment to the Gun Control Act of 1968
* Malvo was 17, not able to buy a weapon.

-- In August 2003 in Chicago, a laid-off worker shot and killed six of his former workmates.
* Chicago has a hundgun ban
* Tapia had been arrested 12 times. He has an arrest record dating back to 1989, including counts of domestic battery, gun violations, aggravated assault and driving while intoxicated.
* IL has no concealed carry permit.

-- In November 2004 in Birchwood, Wisconsin, a hunter killed six other hunters and wounded two others after an argument with them.
* rumor is the good ol boys in Wisconsin had a personal issue with Chai Soua Vang.
* Both the Minneapolis and St. Paul police departments have records of several calls about domestic violence at the Vang residences.

-- In March 2005, a man opened fire at a church service in Brookfield, Wisconsin, killing seven people.

-- In October 2006, a truck driver killed five schoolgirls and seriously wounded six others in a school in Nickel Mines, Pennsylvania before taking his own life.
* guns are not allowed on a school.

-- In April 2007, a student shot and killed 32 people and wounded 15 others at Virginia Tech in Blacksburg, Virginia, before shooting himself, making it the deadliest mass shooting in the United States after 2000.
* Guns not allowed in a school.
* Cho was not allowed to own a firearm, but was never reported.

-- In December 2007, a 20-year-old man killed nine people and injured five others in a shopping center in Omaha, Nebraska.
* An hour before the shootings the police had a note from him that said, ""I just want to take a few peices [sic] of shit with me... just think tho [sic], I'm gonna be fuckin [sic] famous."
* The day after he turned 14, he was sent to a mental health treatment center for threatening to kill his stepmother Candace Hawkins with an axe. He had undergone two psychiatric hospitalizations, and was diagnosed with attention deficit disorder, an unspecified mood disorder, oppositional defiant disorder, and parent-child relationship problems

-- In December 2007, a woman and her boyfriend shot dead six members of her family on Christmas Eve in Carnation, Washington.
* Police will also investigate why two sheriff's deputies, who responded to the 911 call from the family's trailer home at 5:13 p.m. on Christmas Eve, left the scene without confirming there was nothing wrong inside.

-- In February 2008, a shooter who is still at large tied up and shot six women at a suburban clothing store in Chicago, leaving five of them dead and the remaining one injured.
* Robbery gone wrong.
* No CHL program

-- In February 2008, a man opened fire in a lecture hall at Northern Illinois University in DeKalb, Illinois, killing five students and wounding 16 others before laying down his weapon and surrendering.
* Gun Ban in Chicago
* Guns not allowed on school grounds.
* No CHL program in IL
* 1998, during which he was treated temporarily for mental illness at the Elk Grove Village Thresholds-Mary Hill House psychiatric center
* He enlisted in the United States Army in September 2001, and was discharged before completing basic training in February 2002 for lying on his application about his mental illness

-- In September 2008, a mentally ill man who was released from jail one month earlier shot eight people in Alger, Washington, leaving six of them dead and the rest two wounded.
* The suspected shooter had been on a Skagit County Sheriff's Office watch list
* History of mental illness.

-- In December 2008, a man dressed in a Santa Claus suit opened fire at a family Christmas party in Covina, California, then set fire on the house and killed himself. Police later found nine people dead in the debris of the house.

* used a homemade flamethrower as well as a gun.
* At least three victims' deaths were caused by gunshot wounds alone, while four others died from a combination of both gunshot wounds and fire; two other deaths stemmed from the fire alone

-- In March 2009, a 28-year-old laid-off worker opened fire while driving a car through several towns in Alabama, killing 10 people.

-- In March 2009, a heavily-armed gunman shot dead eight people, many of them elderly and sick people, in a private-owned nursing home in North Carolina.
* nursing home patients and workers are not allowed to carry a weapon.

-- In March 2009, six people were shot dead in a high-grade apartment building in Santa Clara, California.

-- In April 2009, a man shot dead 13 people at a civic center in Binghamton, New York.
* NY has gun registration... The guns were registered to him.
* NY does not allow carry "It is a crime to possess any rifle, shotgun or handgun in or upon a building or grounds, used for educational purposes,"

-- In November 2009, U.S. army psychologist Major Nidal Hasan opened fire at a military base in Fort Hood, Texas, leaving 13 dead and 42 others wounded.
* History of Mental illness
* Troops are NOT allowed to carry on post.

-- In January 2011, a gunman opened fire at a public gathering outside a grocery in Tuscon, Arizona, killing six people including a nine-year-old girl and wounding at least 12 others. Congresswoman Gabrielle Giffords was severely injured with a gunshot to the head.
* History of mental illness.

So:

* 10 of those 21 cases were in places where guns were not allowed. Of the remaining 11, 3 were family killings and the police knew of violence in some of them before.

* 11 of the shooters were not legally allowed to own a weapon.

[SkyDekker 1,465]

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Simple, that you want to claim that a any gun is a gun, but not any plane is a plane.

Uhmm, never said that. Now, let's see if I can do my version of a "DaVinci":

Provide some proof that I said that, or admit you are nothing but a liar and made it all up.

Your tendency to make things up has been called.

Yup, that sounds like you.

[DaVinci 0]

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Your tendency to make things up has been called.

Ah, yes, you have never admitted that you made it up... So now you are just trying to distract from that FACT.

Face it, you tried to make up things and were called on it. Your position is devoid of any logic and you are playing with semantics and BS.

[SkyDekker 1,465]

Ah yes, the old, I know what you are, but what am I retort.

But, you have yet to provide proof of my double standard, or admit you are a liar.

Your imaginary attribution of positions reminds me of watching my daughter play with barbies. But then, she too sometimes uses the, I know what you are but what am I line of logic.

[DaVinci 0]

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Ah yes, the old, I know what you are, but what am I retort.

Yes, that is exactly what you tried to use.

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But, you have yet to provide proof of my double standard, or admit you are a liar.

Wrong, you want to claim that all guns are in one pile, but flying machines for man is not.

I have proved it, you decided to try and play semantics. When out of logical debate, that is a pretty common tactic.

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Your imaginary attribution of positions reminds me of watching my daughter play with barbies. But then, she too sometimes uses the, I know what you are but what am I line of logic

Ah, another lightly hidden attack. Never forget that YOU made a claim that YOU were unable to support.

Fact is that since you are unable to debate with facts... Attacks are all you clearly have left.

[SkyDekker 1,465]

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Wrong, you want to claim that all guns are in one pile,

Prove it. Show me where I said that, or admit you are a liar.

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YOU made a claim that YOU were unable to support.

Indeed.

[DaVinci 0]

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Prove it. Show me where I said that, or admit you are a liar.

Are you going to prove where you said I think looines should be allowed to have guns?

Why should *I* be held to a standard YOU will not hold yourself to?

Prove your "quote" first (Or admit that you lied) and then I'll follow suit.

[SkyDekker 1,465]

So you got nothing, got it.

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Why should *I* be held to a standard YOU will not hold yourself to?

You must really look up to me if you use me as the baseline for your standards

[DaVinci 0]

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So you got nothing, got it.

Still waiting for you to back the claim YOU made FIRST.

Just admit you were lying and we can move on... We all already know it to be true.

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You must really look up to me if you use me as the baseline for your standards

No, just pointing out how you lie and then run when called on it.

[DaVinci 0]

BTW why no response on this yet?

Still waiting on YOU to answer this one

Still waiting... you keep saying that the SC is the final say here in the US.

Do you have a problem with the phrase "Shall not be infringed"?

You love to claim that the SC is the final say.... Cool.

But I have shown, using ONLY SC cases, the SCOTUS has said that an individual is allowed an M-16.

You have not been able to counter that claim.

United States v. Miller: "The Second Amendment protects only the ownership of military-type weapons appropriate for use in an organized militia."

DC v Heller: that it is "an individual right to possess a firearm unconnected with service in a militia,"

"The Amendment’s prefatory clause announces a purpose, but does not limit or expand the scope of the second part, the operative clause"

McDonald v. Chicago: that it applies to the States

You have shown that it is not an unlimited right.... Yes, and to cite the SC they mentioned prohibitions 'against felons and the insane'.

But the fact remains that the SC has ruled that it is an individual right to own a 'military-type weapon' in all of the United States.

Can you provide a SINGLE SCOTUS quote that proves your position against my comment?

Remember, "Shall not be infringed" is already there as well.

[DanG 1]

How many cut and pastes of this before you realize he's ignoring you? Just curious.

- Dan G

[normiss 800]

or that it even matters.

[david3 0]

Or that he has become a bore.

[DaVinci 0]

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How many cut and pastes of this before you realize he's ignoring you? Just curious.

He is only ignoring me on this topic... since he knows he is out of his element.

But hey, you are free to not read ANYTHING I post. And you are free to not reply as well.

[jumpwally 0]

I agree with your post entirely but it won't come to that,,,,gun makers have strong lobbyists....very strong. they will do anything to not lose market share....

smile, be nice, enjoy life
FB # - 1083

[rushmc 23]

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So you admit being mistaken about the airplane analogy.

OK, that's progress.

Dont know about him

But I do know you support banning guns except for a few you see fit

Even though you will not admit that you would do it in an underhanded back door way using lists and the like

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[wsd 0]

It's tough for him to be honest when questioned in the real world, when he is at his place of employment he can cause a person a great amount of problems for questioning him.

So when he is asked here and says "do a search" he really means I have never actually come clean and told people why I am in favor on gun bans, I just am and I won't be honest about it.

So then we have him using red herrings and other types of fallacies to support his position.