Congressional Hearings on BATFEs " Fast and furious"

[Darius11 12]

Anyone been following this?

Just read an article in the American Rifleman.

This is a huge deal. We are talking about the authorities knowingly allowing criminals to buy guns.

Any one got any more info on this or an opinion.

First I read about it, you would think this would be a huge story.

I'd rather be hated for who I am, than loved for who I am not." - Kurt Cobain

[wayneflorida 0]

Nothing to see, move along.

[rushmc 23]

Quote

Anyone been following this?

Just read an article in the American Rifleman.

This is a huge deal. We are talking about the authorities knowingly allowing criminals to buy guns.

Any one got any more info on this or an opinion.

First I read about it, you would think this would be a huge story.

It is a big deal

Two of the main characters just got promoted by their superiors

The cover up and finger pointing is huge

Here is a google link to congressional hearings on the topic

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&source=hp&q=fast+and+furious+congressional+hearings&aq=1&aqi=g3g-m3g-b2&aql=&oq=fast+and+furious+congre

News link to the cover up

http://www.cnsnews.com/news/article/grassley-sees-doj-cover-fast-and-furious

Plenty out there

Murders linked to weapons from the fast and furious program

http://www.azcentral.com/12news/news/articles/2011/06/24/20110624ATF-gunsd-smuggling-062411.html

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[rushmc 23]

Quote

Nothing to see, move along.

REally?

You being investigated or something?

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[Darius11 12]

Well ok so I am not insane.
I thought it was a huge deal.

I read this and thought how come this is not the top news story until we get to the bottom of it.


This was done with intent would be great to find out what that intent was. I can take a few guesses but would rather know who gave the order and why.

I'd rather be hated for who I am, than loved for who I am not." - Kurt Cobain

[Darius11 12]

Thanks for the links

I'd rather be hated for who I am, than loved for who I am not." - Kurt Cobain

[funjumper101 15]

This is the program started under ShrubCo and continued by the Obama administration. It was a bad idea then and it continued to be a bad idea now. Credit where credit is due, correct?
Not if you are an RWC.

I am quite confident that this little pearl of FACT has been completely ignored by the Right Wing biased corporate media. RWCs are swallowing the revisionist history as presented by the folks who think for them, hook, line, and sinker. What else is new? Facts and knowlege have no place in the modern RWC world. Only opinions, especially those that are based in the fantasyland presented by the Reicht Wing media that is truthful and factual at all times. NOT!

[rushmc 23]

Quote

This is the program started under ShrubCo and continued by the Obama administration. It was a bad idea then and it continued to be a bad idea now. Credit where credit is due, correct?
Not if you are an RWC.

I am quite confident that this little pearl of FACT has been completely ignored by the Right Wing biased corporate media. RWCs are swallowing the revisionist history as presented by the folks who think for them, hook, line, and sinker. What else is new? Facts and knowlege have no place in the modern RWC world. Only opinions, especially those that are based in the fantasyland presented by the Reicht Wing media that is truthful and factual at all times. NOT!

I know when it was started and why

But it was co-opted to make a gun control argument

One of the plans was the multiple purchase report that is there is a big fight over

Best part was I presented some articles and links

You provided the bullshit and played the blame game


So thanks

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[mnealtx 0]

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This is the program started under ShrubCo and continued by the Obama administration.

Um...no. Gunrunner was under Bush and they actually arrested the straw purchasers.

Gunwalker/Fast and Furious is all Obama's.

Your "FACT" is, in fact, your normal bullshit.

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706

[rushmc 23]

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Quote

This is the program started under ShrubCo and continued by the Obama administration.

Um...no. Gunrunner was under Bush and they actually arrested the straw purchasers.

Gunwalker/Fast and Furious is all Obama's.

Your "FACT" is, in fact, your normal bullshit.

The crazy damn thing here was no blame was laid anywhere

Google links were provided and Darius could make his own opinions on this

but old funny bunny is so afraid his chozen one is getting blamed for something I guess he feels the need to jump it

I say

Let him

It would be funny if it were not so sad

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[hwt 0]

The main stream media will keep it under wraps .
after 2012 you will hear a lot about it.

[JohnRich 4]

Quote

Just read an article in the American Rifleman.
This is a huge deal. We are talking about the authorities knowingly allowing criminals to buy guns.
Any one got any more info on this or an opinion.
First I read about it, you would think this would be a huge story.

What are you doing reading that right-wing extremist NRA magazine? Yes, it's a big deal. There are plenty of opinions already in this forum about it, as it's already been brought up and discussed. The reason it's not a huge national scandal is because the media provides cover for the Obama administration and doesn't want them to look bad. And the media also only likes to print things that make guns look BAD, and this story makes guns look neutral, like they actually are, and makes the government look like the bad guy. So, since it doesn't make gun owners look bad, it's not newsworthy.

[wayneflorida 0]

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Nothing to see, move along.

REally?

You being investigated or something?

Just passing on for the DOJ, ATF, MSM, etc..

Investigated - no. But watched - yes. Strange vans parked outside all the time with little periscopes; silent black things flying overhead; flying insects inside the house; strange noises on the phone; and who knows where all these 1's and 0's from my computer go.

[Kennedy 0]

U.S. Government Used Taxpayer Funds to Buy, Sell Weapons During 'Fast and Furious,' Documents Show

So what jackass thought this was a good idea?

edit to add:

Lawyers, Guns, and Money

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Last December, U.S. border patrol agent Brian Terry was murdered in a firefight with three Mexican nationals in Arizona. Two guns recovered at the crime scene were traced back to an ongoing Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives (ATF) investigation, informally known under the code names “Gunwalker” and “Fast and Furious.”

snip

On last week’s conference call, Issa confirmed that Mexican attorney general Marisela Morales believes at least 200 murders in Mexico have been linked to Fast and Furious weapons. Over on the U.S. side of the border, authorities announced earlier this month that the alleged perpetrators of a March 2010 assault against police detectives in Phoenix used two guns linked to the scandal. More than 1,400 of the guns involved in the ATF operation have yet to be recovered.

snip

et cetera ad absurdum

witty subliminal message
Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards.
1*

[skybill 22]

Hi Dari, Kenny and the rest a' ya'll,
Go to by Mike Vanderboegh and War on Guns by Dave Codrea, 'Ya can link to Daves blog from sipsey. If you really want some info on the subject, go ask Brian Terry, Border Patrol Agent, and Jamie Zapatta, ICE agent, they'll fill you in. Hmmmmmmmmm?? Funny though, it's the way Barry likes it,"Dead men tell no tales!!!" Buddy, this ain't "Watergate!!"

SCR-2034, SCS-680

III%,
Deli-out

[kallend 2,027]

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U.S. Government Used Taxpayer Funds to Buy, Sell Weapons During 'Fast and Furious,' Documents Show

Government agency uses taxpayer funds - isn't this a bit like "dog bites man"?

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[JohnRich 4]

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U.S. Government Used Taxpayer Funds to Buy, Sell Weapons During 'Fast and Furious,' Documents Show

Government agency uses taxpayer funds - isn't this a bit like "dog bites man"?

Dogs don't buy weapons and then turn around and sell them to cats.

[billvon 2,991]

>Dogs don't buy weapons and then turn around and sell them to cats.

But cats bite dogs. So your point is . . . just as silly as mine.

[Kennedy 0]

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U.S. Government Used Taxpayer Funds to Buy, Sell Weapons During 'Fast and Furious,' Documents Show

Government agency uses taxpayer funds - isn't this a bit like "dog bites man"?

Finishing the sentence helps. The point, dear professor, is that while it's bad for the government to let folks commit crimes and go unpunished, it's far worse to actually fund those crimes with taxpayer's money.

witty subliminal message
Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards.
1*

[DougH 270]

You would rather them use slush funds that they have ceased during other agency business?

"The restraining order says you're only allowed to touch me in freefall"
=P

[Kennedy 0]

I'd rather the BATFE close it's doors and be absorbed into the Treasury and FBI. And taking the DEA with it might not be a bad idea.

witty subliminal message
Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards.
1*

[popsjumper 2]

What's the big deal?

LE all over the country at every level does this all the time and nobody bitches. Hell, we even support the idea when...

-Confiscated drugs are sold to suckers who are then arrested for buying them.

-Cars are set up and watched for some poor sucker to come along and rip it.

-Speed traps are set up for some poor sucker to bust through unwittingly.

LE loading up a baited hook and going fishing is allowed and we have no problem with it...unless if involves guns. Is it because the bad guys will actually use them? Geez....whatever gave the bad guys THAT idea?

My reality and yours are quite different.
I think we're all Bozos on this bus.
Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239

[JohnRich 4]

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What's the big deal?

LE all over the country at every level does this all the time and nobody bitches. Hell, we even support the idea when...

-Confiscated drugs are sold to suckers who are then arrested for buying them.
-Cars are set up and watched for some poor sucker to come along and rip it.
-Speed traps are set up for some poor sucker to bust through unwittingly.

LE loading up a baited hook and going fishing is allowed and we have no problem with it...unless if involves guns. Is it because the bad guys will actually use them? Geez....whatever gave the bad guys THAT idea?

The big deal is that, unlike the examples you listed where the criminal is arrested immediately as the transaction is completed, in this Fast & Furious scheme the criminals were knowingly allowed to walk away with their illegal weapon purchases, go anywhere they want with them, and kill people. Including some of our own law enforcement.

It would be like setting up a drunk-driving checkpoint, finding drunks, and then letting them go ahead and drive away drunk. Or using government funds to buy bait cars, letting the car theives steal them, and keep them.

[DaVinci 0]

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What's the big deal?

LE all over the country at every level does this all the time and nobody bitches. Hell, we even support the idea when...

-Confiscated drugs are sold to suckers who are then arrested for buying them.

-Cars are set up and watched for some poor sucker to come along and rip it.

-Speed traps are set up for some poor sucker to bust through unwittingly.

LE loading up a baited hook and going fishing is allowed and we have no problem with it...unless if involves guns. Is it because the bad guys will actually use them? Geez....whatever gave the bad guys THAT idea?

The problem would be if cops set up a sting to sell drugs and then used those transactions to try and show how much the drug problem is and proposed new laws that really did nothing to stop the problem and impeded on honest citizens.

So if say cops started setting up stings at Walgreens to encourage people to buy more than one pack of Pseudoephedrine and when the shop called 911 about it they were told to ignore it and sell it anyway.... THEN the cops used the higher traffic of Pseudoephedrine to make it so you could only buy one pill at a time.

That is the problem. Not that there was a sting... There WASNT a sting. The ATF allowed guns to be smuggled into Mexico. Those guns were used to kill a lot of people to include Americans... Then the ATF tries to use the higher volume of guns to MX as an excuse to require US citizens to jump through more hoops.