The latest push in the War on Women . . .

[rushmc 23]

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He will take no hits from this at all because his audience is his focus

Not money or advertisers

Could you really be that naive?

You need to get of that leftist teat

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[rushmc 23]

Ya
She is a liar

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Then they sandbagged the Republicans. They asked, too late, for Fluke to be subbed in for Lynn, then told Lynn not to bother showing up. When the hearing took place, Rep. Carolyn Maloney (this columnist's congressman, but don't blame us) demanded: "Where are the women?" Although it was the Dems who chose Lynn over Fluke and the second panel of witnesses included two female members, liberal media dutifully propagated the "Republican sexism" charge. A week later, House Democrats held a mock hearing where Fluke testified.

Like Cindy Sheehan, Fluke was a left-wing activist cast in the role of everywoman (or as much of an "everywoman" as a student at an elite law school can be). "Fluke has a long history of feminist advocacy," reports the Daily Caller: "While [an undergraduate] at Cornell, Fluke's organized activities centered on the far-left feminist and gender equity movements. Fluke participated in rallies supporting abortion, protests against war in Iraq and efforts to recruit other womens' [sic] rights activists to campus." She even got a bachelor's degree in something called "Feminist, Gender, & Sexuality Studies."

"Without insurance coverage, contraception, as you know, can cost a woman over $3,000 during law school," Fluke said in her testimony. But last Tuesday The Weekly Standard's John McCormack debunked the claim:

Fluke's testimony was very misleading. Birth control pills can be purchased for as low as $9 per month at a pharmacy near Georgetown's campus. According to an employee at the pharmacy in Washington, D.C.'s Target store, the pharmacy sells birth control pills--the generic versions of Ortho Tri-Cyclen and Ortho-Cyclen--for $9 per month. "That's the price without insurance," the Target employee said.
Nine dollars a month amounts to $324 over three years of law school.

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[livendive 8]

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So, if she researched the health plans before enrolling and found they did not meet her needs as a student, why did she decide to go with Georgetown over another school that was more suited to her needs?

As a member of LSRJ, isn't Georgetown exactly the kind of school she'd want to go to? I mean, if she's looking to fight something she perceives as injustice, it's only logical that she place herself somewhere near the battle. If she went to Berkely while fighting for the rights of students at Georgetown, well then you'd all accuse her of being related to Al Gore.

Blues,
Dave

"I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!"
(drink Mountain Dew)

[billvon 2,996]

>She is a liar

So far she's a liar, a slut, an attention seeker and a whore.

I guess the right can't respond to what she said - so they have no choice other than to attack her personally. How do you figure that will play with women and student voters? (the ones who aren't liars, sluts, attention seekers and whores of course)

[muff528 3]

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So, if she researched the health plans before enrolling and found they did not meet her needs as a student, why did she decide to go with Georgetown over another school that was more suited to her needs?

As a member of LSRJ, isn't Georgetown exactly the kind of school she'd want to go to? I mean, if she's looking to fight something she perceives as injustice, it's only logical that she place herself somewhere near the battle. If she went to Berkely while fighting for the rights of students at Georgetown, well then you'd all accuse her of being related to Al Gore.

Blues,
Dave

EXACTLY!! That is my point! Thanks!

[muff528 3]

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>She is a liar

So far she's a liar, a slut, an attention seeker and a whore.

I guess the right can't respond to what she said - so they have no choice other than to attack her personally. How do you figure that will play with women and student voters? (the ones who aren't liars, sluts, attention seekers and whores of course)

I have developed my tentative opinion of Ms. Fluke and her motivations by actually trying to find out who this person is. I did not really have an opinion before doing a little research. ...a little suspicious bias maybe but I tried to have an open mind about it. I've supported my arguments with evidence taken from various internet sites. Not the best resource but that's what we have for these kind of discussions. Some of the sources were quite sympathetic to her activism and others were not. But all led me to my opinion of what her agenda really is. I really did try to find sources that spread across the ideological spectrum. Your final response was to accuse me of resorting to just calling her a liar while not being able to "speak to the topic".

Your side of the discussion has been to refute my comments with anecdote, hypothetical scenarios and your own unsupported opinions about her agenda and her reasons for attending a school that she might find hostile to her ideology. Your only supporting argument is that she said she was "absolutely not willing to compromise the quality of my education in exchange for my health care" and presumably implying that the only institution that is capable of meeting that level of quality is a university that is affiliated with a religious institution that is wholly hostile to her own beliefs.

I actually expected you to counter any points that I or other posters have made in this thread with your own sources and your own interpretation of that evidence. Instead you decided to disregard us as unmoving, right wing ideologues.

The topic I was "speaking to" was this imagined "War on Women" angle and the true agenda of Ms. Fluke. I did incidentally state my stance on the sub-topic of whether contraceptives should or should not be included in a health policy to provide insight as to where I stood in the spirit of openness.

Also, Her decision to go to Georgetown in the face of "hostile" health care policy is quite different than coping with the weather in Boston. From what I understand it's getting warmer up there anyway.

[rushmc 23]

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>She is a liar

So far she's a liar, a slut, an attention seeker and a whore.

I guess the right can't respond to what she said - so they have no choice other than to attack her personally. How do you figure that will play with women and student voters? (the ones who aren't liars, sluts, attention seekers and whores of course)

Ah come on now Bill
Since I HAVE responded to what she said
And shown her to be less than truthful

But, what is good for the goose I guess
Since all of there women were treated so nicely

Clinton Misogyny - Sex
Juanita Broaddrick (AR)- rape
Eileen Wellstone (Oxford) - rape
Elizabeth Ward Gracen - rape - quid pro quo, post incident intimidation
Regina Hopper Blakely - "forced himself on her, biting, bruising her"
Kathleen Willey (WH) - sexual assault, intimidations, threats
Sandra Allen James (DC) - sexual assault
22 Year Old 1972 (Yale) - sexual assault
Kathy Bradshaw (AK) - sexual assault
Cristy Zercher - unwelcomed sexual advance, intimidations
Paula Jones (AR) - unwelcomed sexual advance, exposure, bordering on sexual assault
Carolyn Moffet -unwelcomed sexual advance, exposure, bordering on sexual assault
1974 student at University of Arkansas - unwelcomed physical contact
1978-1980 - seven complaints per Arkansas state troopers
Monica Lewinsky - quid pro quo, post incident character assault
Gennifer Flowers - quid pro quo, post incident character assault
Dolly Kyle Browning - post incident character assault
Sally Perdue - post incident threats
Betty Dalton - rebuffed his advances, married to one of his supporters
Denise Reeder - apologetic note scanned

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[billvon 2,996]

>Your side of the discussion has been to refute my comments with anecdote,
>hypothetical scenarios and your own unsupported opinions about her agenda . . .

Her actual words are not "unsupported opinions about her agenda." I think she's an activist law student, which is what she claims to be. You think she's a lying, that she's misleading people and that she's not what she appears to be. The burden of proof is on you.

And quoting right wing websites don't count as "proof." Nor do Limbaugh's opinions.

>presumably implying that the only institution that is capable of meeting that level of
>quality is a university that is affiliated with a religious institution that is wholly
>hostile to her own beliefs.

I went to an all catholic boy's high school by choice. It was hostile to many of my beliefs and stunted my social development. I did it because I wanted a good education. Am I an evil activist who went there only to mislead people?

I jumped at Brown Field for years even though I strongly disagreed with Buzz's AAD mandate. Am I an evil activist skydiver who went there only to be able to bitch about it, and thus do not have a valid opinion about AAD's?

>Also, Her decision to go to Georgetown in the face of "hostile" health care policy is
>quite different than coping with the weather in Boston.

To a typical graduate student, hostile weather is a bigger issue than the predicted future details of a health care system.

[rushmc 23]

It is good reading

Really
http://alamo-girl.com/0262.htm

Since the left is trying to change to focus I thought I would join the attempt

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[billvon 2,996]

>Since the left is trying to change to focus

Hmm. I could have sworn that Limbaugh was the one that called her a whore and a slut and started the whole shitstorm. Has he become a lefty?

[rushmc 23]

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>Since the left is trying to change to focus

Hmm. I could have sworn that Limbaugh was the one that called her a whore and a slut and started the whole shitstorm. Has he become a lefty?

Remember
He apologizes for lowering himself to the level of the left so, yes at the time he made the comments, he was acting as a lefty.

He has since rasied himself back to a better and higher standard

Oh, and the shitstorm was started by the left and their fake show that they sucked her (Fluke)into

(she will be discarded like Sheehan once all is out about her)

You really need to keep your time line straight

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[billvon 2,996]

>He apologizes for lowering himself to the level of the left so, yes at the time he
>made the comments, he was acting as a lefty. He has since rasied himself back
>to a better and higher standard

Excellent! So he calls a law student a whore and a slut - but it wasn't really his fault, a lefty did it, and it just demonstrates what high standards he has! And his namecalling wasn't the issue, it's that evil lefties noticed that he called her a whore.

No wonder he's the de facto leader of the GOP.

[Shotgun 1]

Aside from all this talk about who is a slut or not, and who wants to pay for other people's health care or not, etc.......

One thing I find confusing: It seems that anyone who is strongly against abortion, that they would be strongly for any plan to reduce the number of abortions that happen. And providing free birth control to all women definitely seems like a way to reduce the number of abortions. But it seems like a lot of the people who are strongly against abortion are also against providing birth control to women, which doesn't make much sense to me.

[billvon 2,996]

>But it seems like a lot of the people who are strongly against abortion are also
>against providing birth control to women, which doesn't make much sense to me.

If your goal is "as many of our kind as possible" it's a pretty good strategy. Increase the odds of accidental pregnancy and reduce the availability of abortion. Result - more of "our kind" born.

[muff528 3]

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......
Her actual words are not "unsupported opinions about her agenda." I think she's an activist law student, which is what she claims to be.

"I am not a crook!" ~R. Nixon

You think she's a lying, that she's misleading people and that she's not what she appears to be. The burden of proof is on you.

Nope. I think she has been/is being misrepresented by her advocates and by elements of the media. I have not tried to "prove" anything ....only reach a reasonable conclusion based on available evidence. I could be wrong about her and I have no problem with that.

And quoting right wing websites don't count as "proof." Nor do Limbaugh's opinions.

lsrj.org, california.feministblogs.org and the Washington Post are hardly "right wing websites". If you think they are then you are farther "out there" than I imagined.

>presumably implying that the only institution that is capable of meeting that level of
>quality is a university that is affiliated with a religious institution that is wholly
>hostile to her own beliefs.

I went to an all catholic boy's high school by choice. It was hostile to many of my beliefs and stunted my social development. I did it because I wanted a good education. Am I an evil activist who went there only to mislead people?

I jumped at Brown Field for years even though I strongly disagreed with Buzz's AAD mandate. Am I an evil activist skydiver who went there only to be able to bitch about it, and thus do not have a valid opinion about AAD's?

>Also, Her decision to go to Georgetown in the face of "hostile" health care policy is
>quite different than coping with the weather in Boston.

To a typical graduate student, hostile weather is a bigger issue than the predicted future details of a health care system.

All that really is irrelevant to the "topic". However that now makes 2 Catholic schools that provide such a high quality of education that it overshadows what might be a student's aversion to a perceived hostile environment.

[billvon 2,996]

>However that now makes 2 Catholic schools that provide such a high quality of
>education that it overshadows what might be a student's aversion to a perceived
>hostile environment.

And that is exactly the point. You have implied that she must have gone to that university just to complain about healthcare, that she was "looking for a fight." Yet many people (myself included) choose schools for reasons other than their healthcare provisions. I can guarantee you that the people who I went to school with did not consider the school's healthcare coverage as a primary factor; I strongly suspect Georgetown students are no different.

[rushmc 23]

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>He apologizes for lowering himself to the level of the left so, yes at the time he
>made the comments, he was acting as a lefty. He has since rasied himself back
>to a better and higher standard

Excellent! So he calls a law student a whore and a slut - but it wasn't really his fault, a lefty did it, and it just demonstrates what high standards he has! And his namecalling wasn't the issue, it's that evil lefties noticed that he called her a whore.

No wonder he's the de facto leader of the GOP.

You are desperate sir

He admitted he was wrong

He said the name calling was a mistake on his part

You need a break

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[rushmc 23]

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Aside from all this talk about who is a slut or not, and who wants to pay for other people's health care or not, etc.......

One thing I find confusing: It seems that anyone who is strongly against abortion, that they would be strongly for any plan to reduce the number of abortions that happen. And providing free birth control to all women definitely seems like a way to reduce the number of abortions. But it seems like a lot of the people who are strongly against abortion are also against providing birth control to women, which doesn't make much sense to me.

Got nothing to do with anything you post here

It is about the power of the fed gov and religous freedom

Period

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[Shotgun 1]

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>But it seems like a lot of the people who are strongly against abortion are also
>against providing birth control to women, which doesn't make much sense to me.

If your goal is "as many of our kind as possible" it's a pretty good strategy. Increase the odds of accidental pregnancy and reduce the availability of abortion. Result - more of "our kind" born.

That doesn't make sense either. If you're preventing women (who would otherwise use birth control or possibly have an abortion) from having easy access to birth control or abortions, then the result is more of "them."

[Gravitymaster 0]

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>But it seems like a lot of the people who are strongly against abortion are also
>against providing birth control to women, which doesn't make much sense to me.

If your goal is "as many of our kind as possible" it's a pretty good strategy. Increase the odds of accidental pregnancy and reduce the availability of abortion. Result - more of "our kind" born.

That doesn't make sense either. If you're preventing women (who would otherwise use birth control or possibly have an abortion) from having easy access to birth control or abortions, then the result is more of "them."

So you are saying a 30 year old college student can't afford $9 per month for birth control pills? Really???

[Shotgun 1]

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So you are saying a 30 year old college student can't afford $9 per month for birth control pills? Really???

No, I didn't say that.

[rushmc 23]

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>But it seems like a lot of the people who are strongly against abortion are also
>against providing birth control to women, which doesn't make much sense to me.

If your goal is "as many of our kind as possible" it's a pretty good strategy. Increase the odds of accidental pregnancy and reduce the availability of abortion. Result - more of "our kind" born.

That doesn't make sense either. If you're preventing women (who would otherwise use birth control or possibly have an abortion) from having easy access to birth control or abortions, then the result is more of "them."

So you are saying a 30 year old college student can't afford $9 per month for birth control pills? Really???

This 30 year old "student" said is cost her 3K per year

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[Stumpy 284]

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>He apologizes for lowering himself to the level of the left so, yes at the time he
>made the comments, he was acting as a lefty. He has since rasied himself back
>to a better and higher standard

Excellent! So he calls a law student a whore and a slut - but it wasn't really his fault, a lefty did it, and it just demonstrates what high standards he has! And his namecalling wasn't the issue, it's that evil lefties noticed that he called her a whore.

No wonder he's the de facto leader of the GOP.

You are desperate sir

He admitted he was wrong

He said the name calling was a mistake on his part

You need a break

And he would not have said any of those things had his sponsors not pulled out. Says a lot about him, and those like you who support him.

Never try to eat more than you can lift

[billvon 2,996]

>And he would not have said any of those things had his sponsors not pulled out.

Agreed. Unfortunately for him his new attack (i.e. his "apology") didn't fly - advertisers are still pulling out.

[Shotgun 1]

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This 30 year old "student" said is cost her 3K per year

I believe she said $3K over the course of three years, but that still seems a bit high. (Though I don't know; maybe it is expensive up there?)

Out of curiosity, I glanced through Georgetown's health plan: http://studentaffairs.georgetown.edu/insurance/premierplanbooklet.pdf, and it looks like there are a lot of exclusions (fertility drugs, Viagra, skydiving accidents, etc.). And the students can opt out of paying for the university's health insurance if they provide their own health insurance.

Seems like they're in a pretty good situation, at a good school, with reasonably good health insurance, and likely a good career in the future. Which is more than most people in the country can say. So I just can't seem to get upset about the Georgetown students having to pay for their own contraception.