Florida Teen Shot

[DougH 270]

I like this, fantasy scenario theater.

Where is the evidence that Zimmerman had his gun drawn before having Martin sitting on his chest bashing his head?

If some one said you're going to die, and then turned there back to me and walked away from me and to their vehicle I would not run back towards them and attack them. I would get my ass out of dodge.

Heck I have a CCW permit and I would still put as much distance between themselves and me as possible. Closing the distance after a threat is not a good defense strategy. It is something you would do when your pissed off and angry, but that isn't self defense.

That would not be a good stratedgy for survival, regardless of whether the action was legally right or wrong.

Of course we don't know what was said between the two.

We also don't have proof that Zimmerman said anything threatening, or acted physical before the fatal shot.

"The restraining order says you're only allowed to touch me in freefall"
=P

[mirage62 0]

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What do you say about these two.

I'd say that was older news (in fast breaking news) that today the Orlando newspaper has an artical that another witness is saying that Zimmerman was the one crying for help. It's been post HERE on these threads.

As of today 3/26/12 you can PICK wichever side your on and there are news reports to support yourside.

How anyone can be SO sure of what happen right now is beyond me.

Kevin Keenan is my hero, a double FUP, he does so much with so little

[kallend 2,027]

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What do you say about these two.

I'd say that was older news (in fast breaking news) that today the Orlando newspaper has an artical that another witness is saying that Zimmerman was the one crying for help. It's been post HERE on these threads.

As of today 3/26/12 you can PICK wichever side your on and there are news reports to support yourside.

How anyone can be SO sure of what happen right now is beyond me.

I'm quite sure the kid, armed only with some groceries, is dead, shot by Zimmerman.

Maybe Zimmerman took Monty Python too seriously.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[Gravitymaster 0]

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I'm sure one of your whimsical reasons will suffice.

Good. As long as you acknowledge that they exist, your ridiculous point falls flat.

Great, then you acknowledge your arguments are mostly whimsical fantasies with no basis in reality. Fair enough.

Not at all. If you think my reasons suffice then they must be based in reality.

But seriously - to demonstrate how ridiculous your attempted point was, can you honestly think of no way in which an unarmed person can be threatened by another person who does not have a gun? Seriously, think about it. It should take you about 5 seconds, even at your speed.

(And if you can't think of any, please let us know, so I can point and laugh.)

Your whimsical fantasies are entertaining enough.

Before you get too invested in this, you do realise that I didn't actually state any of the many reasons, right? So, all these whimsical theories are entirely of your own imagining. You do get that, right?

And if you are in fact stating that you cannot think of any way in which an unarmed (or thought to be) man can threaten another unarmed man...

Still waiting on your "plausable reasons".

[devildog 0]

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Calling it an empty baggie seems as misleading

Didn't mean to be misleading, but the empty baggie was the reported violation of the drug policy.

It wasn't completely empty. They found trace amounts of pot.

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-201_162-57404664/pot-traces-behind-trayvon-martin-suspension/


And it seems he's had a few run ins prior to that as well. The jewelry and screwdriver possession is of particular note.
http://www.miamiherald.com/2012/03/26/2714778/thousands-expected-at-trayvon.html

You stop breathing for a few minutes and everyone jumps to conclusions.

[DougH 270]

I don't think that has been debated.

Those facts alone are not enough to convict Zimmerman of murder or manslaughter with no other supporting evidence.

Because of the law in FL they weren't even enough to legally arrest him.

Now the legal system needs to go through all of the evidence and determine if the shooting was justified as self defense.

Of course we could do away with that legal system and hand him over to the new black panthers.

"The restraining order says you're only allowed to touch me in freefall"
=P

[jakee 1,490]

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What eyewitness reports state that Martin attacked Zimmerman? Second time of asking.

The one in post 256. You made a response to post 255 15 minutes later, so I'm pretty sure you saw it. You also responded to post 270 by devildog which re-iterated it and linked to the eyewitness report.

Wrong.

Nothing in that story indicates the existence of an eyewitness who saw the start of the physical conflict, yet you have explicitly stated that such witnesses exist. Source?

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[jakee 1,490]

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Still waiting on your "plausable reasons".

Yes, you are. So how do you know they're whimsical? You must be going for some kind of contradiction record.

But seriously, can you think of no way that an unarmed man can threaten another unarmed man? Just a yes or a no. You can do it.

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[jclalor 12]

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How anyone can be SO sure of what happen right now is beyond me.

[billvon 2,991]

>Where is the evidence that Zimmerman had his gun drawn before having Martin sitting
>on his chest bashing his head?

None. Nor is there evidence he didn't. We do know that he took his gun when he initiated the confrontation.

>We also don't have proof that Zimmerman said anything threatening, or acted physical
>before the fatal shot.

Nor do we have any proof that the teen did.

[mnealtx 0]

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Nor do we have any proof that the teen did.

"When I got upstairs and looked down, the guy who was on top beating up the other guy, was the one laying in the grass, and I believe he was dead at that point," John said.

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706

[billvon 2,991]

Thirdhand Internet claims generally don't constitute proof. At least for most people.

[rushmc 23]

Following up

Just saw a FOX report that stated TM had ZERO criminal record

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[mnealtx 0]

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Thirdhand Internet claims generally don't constitute proof. At least for most people.

Eyewitness reports to the police (such as the one I posted) generally do, however.

Guess your mileage varies.

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706

[rushmc 23]

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If the eyewitness reports are true, Martin closed on Zimmerman and knocked him to the ground, initiating the attack.

What eyewitness reports?

Google the Orlando Sentential news paper

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[jakee 1,490]

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If the eyewitness reports are true, Martin closed on Zimmerman and knocked him to the ground, initiating the attack.

What eyewitness reports?

Google the Orlando Sentential news paper

No.

I have paid attention to the news reports and I am aware of no eyewitnesses who back up Zimmermans claim of how the altercation started. If you know of one, post it. If not, you have nothing to add here.

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[rushmc 23]

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What eyewitness reports state that Martin attacked Zimmerman? Second time of asking.

The one in post 256. You made a response to post 255 15 minutes later, so I'm pretty sure you saw it. You also responded to post 270 by devildog which re-iterated it and linked to the eyewitness report.

Wrong.

Nothing in that story indicates the existence of an eyewitness who saw the start of the physical conflict, yet you have explicitly stated that such witnesses exist. Source?

there are multiple news stories talking about multiple witnesses supporting Zimmerman's version

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[rushmc 23]

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If the eyewitness reports are true, Martin closed on Zimmerman and knocked him to the ground, initiating the attack.

What eyewitness reports?

Google the Orlando Sentential news paper

No.

I have paid attention to the news reports and I am aware of no eyewitnesses who back up Zimmermans claim of how the altercation started. If you know of one, post it. If not, you have nothing to add here.

I already posted a link

You need to catch up

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[kallend 2,027]

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What eyewitness reports state that Martin attacked Zimmerman? Second time of asking.

The one in post 256. You made a response to post 255 15 minutes later, so I'm pretty sure you saw it. You also responded to post 270 by devildog which re-iterated it and linked to the eyewitness report.

Wrong.

Nothing in that story indicates the existence of an eyewitness who saw the start of the physical conflict, yet you have explicitly stated that such witnesses exist. Source?

there are multiple news stories talking about multiple witnesses supporting Zimmerman's version

So the neighbors are circling the wagons. Got it.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[jakee 1,490]

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What eyewitness reports state that Martin attacked Zimmerman? Second time of asking.

The one in post 256. You made a response to post 255 15 minutes later, so I'm pretty sure you saw it. You also responded to post 270 by devildog which re-iterated it and linked to the eyewitness report.

Wrong.

Nothing in that story indicates the existence of an eyewitness who saw the start of the physical conflict, yet you have explicitly stated that such witnesses exist. Source?

there are multiple news stories talking about multiple witnesses supporting Zimmerman's version

Pay attention Rush.

Mike claimed there were eyewitness reports corroborating Zimmerman's claim that Martin approached him from behind and punched him first without provocation. OK?

Eyewitness reports stating that Martin was winning the ensuing fight do not qualify. We are talking about how the fight started not how the fight ended.

If you know of any such reports, post them. If not, leave it alone and stop muddying the waters. Ok?

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[rushmc 23]

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What eyewitness reports state that Martin attacked Zimmerman? Second time of asking.

The one in post 256. You made a response to post 255 15 minutes later, so I'm pretty sure you saw it. You also responded to post 270 by devildog which re-iterated it and linked to the eyewitness report.

Wrong.

Nothing in that story indicates the existence of an eyewitness who saw the start of the physical conflict, yet you have explicitly stated that such witnesses exist. Source?

there are multiple news stories talking about multiple witnesses supporting Zimmerman's version

So the neighbors are circling the wagons. Got it.

You got it alright

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[rushmc 23]

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What eyewitness reports state that Martin attacked Zimmerman? Second time of asking.

The one in post 256. You made a response to post 255 15 minutes later, so I'm pretty sure you saw it. You also responded to post 270 by devildog which re-iterated it and linked to the eyewitness report.

Wrong.

Nothing in that story indicates the existence of an eyewitness who saw the start of the physical conflict, yet you have explicitly stated that such witnesses exist. Source?

there are multiple news stories talking about multiple witnesses supporting Zimmerman's version

Pay attention Rush.

Mike claimed there were eyewitness reports corroborating Zimmerman's claim that Martin approached him from behind and punched him first without provocation. OK?

Eyewitness reports stating that Martin was winning the ensuing fight do not qualify. We are talking about how the fight started not how the fight ended.

If you know of any such reports, post them. If not, leave it alone and stop muddying the waters. Ok?

Catch up

you got a ways to go

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[kallend 2,027]

Fact is, the investigation was bungled from the very start.

A month after the event has given so-called "eyewitnesses" plenty of time to collaborate in fabricating a consistent story in support of their guy (whichever guy that was).

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[jakee 1,490]

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If the eyewitness reports are true, Martin closed on Zimmerman and knocked him to the ground, initiating the attack.

What eyewitness reports?

Google the Orlando Sentential news paper

No.

I have paid attention to the news reports and I am aware of no eyewitnesses who back up Zimmermans claim of how the altercation started. If you know of one, post it. If not, you have nothing to add here.

I already posted a link

No, you have not.

You have posted a link about how Zimmerman said it started. You have posted nothing which indicates there were any eyewitnesses to the start of the altercation.

If you know of one, post it, if not, stop muddying the waters. OK?

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[rushmc 23]

BTW

I posted links, from the Orlando paper where, police told the paper they (the police) had witnesses come forward the day of the shooting (over a month ago) where those witnesses backed up Zimmerman's version of what happened.

that was why he was not arrested

Now, stop

Please

stop

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln