Florida Teen Shot

[DougH 270]

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And being a 17 year old fit football player... I'd most likely run like hell and put as much distance between me and the other guy as I could.

Mr Miaggi, "Best defense, don't be there"

So, why didn't he?

I know why I wouldn't have when I was a 17 year old football player. I was bullet proof and bomb proof (or so I thought) and like most 17 year old kids I didn't always have the best reasoning.

Back then if someone was following me I would have closed the distance and asked them what their problem was.

"The restraining order says you're only allowed to touch me in freefall"
=P

[SkyDekker 1,465]

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But this is still more than the "peaceful protest" you claimed he was suspended for earlier.

Didn't claim that. Somebody suggested you had to do something pretty serious to get suspended for 5 days. That statement is obviously not true.

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And vandalizing school property, truancy, and (according to the local paper) not only an empty bag, but also a pipe with resin..... Should remove the "good school kid" image the media and others were trying to paint of this kid.

Also doesn't paint a picture of somebody agressive enough to iniate a fight with a total stranger for no reason.

So, my question remains: Why would a 17 year old without a violent history attack somebody without any reason?

[SkyDekker 1,465]

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I know why I wouldn't have when I was a 17 year old football player. I was bullet proof and bomb proof (or so I thought) and like most 17 year old kids I didn't always have the best reasoning.

Back then if someone was following me I would have closed the distance and asked them what their problem was.

Other people have said that as well. I would have run away and put distance between me and that person.

DaVinci claims he would have done the same thing. That's why I was asking him.

[billvon 2,991]

>Yes, I'm sure he had someone smash his head against a sidewalk and break his
>nose the next day as directed by the Police to cover up this huge racist conspiracy.

Cutting one's face seems a small price to pay to escape a long jail sentence. People have done far worse for far lesser risks.

[DaVinci 0]

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Just watched the footage of Zimmerman being brought into the police station. For a man who just had his nose broken and the back of his head pounded into the ground, not a drop of blood, abrasion, or any signs of a what he described happened to him are visible.

So you are claiming that he lied, the police lied, and the paramedics that treated him at the scene lied?

Ever have a bloody nose or a scalp wound? They bleed like hell, and when they are stopped, very little visible blood remains.

[SkyDekker 1,465]

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Ever have a bloody nose or a scalp wound? They bleed like hell, ...

Right, which is why people are wondering where the blood on his clothes is? And, if he was allowed to change his clothes, why? Would that be normal procedure?

[billvon 2,991]

>He sure didn't look like someone who'd been beaten up to the extent of believing his
>life in danger.

Nor did the kid look like he did any beating.

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Funeral director: No injuries on Trayvon’s hands
By Stephen Loiaconi
updated 6:07 PM EDT, Wed March 28, 2012

The funeral director who prepared Trayvon Martin’s body for burial told HLN’s Nancy Grace Wednesday that he did not see any cuts or bruises on the teen’s hands that would have been indicative of a struggle with George Zimmerman, the man who shot and killed the Florida teen.

Richard Kurtz of Roy Mizell and Kurtz Funeral Home in Fort Lauderdale said there appeared to be a gunshot wound in Martin’s upper chest area, but he received the body after the autopsy was completed so it was difficult to tell whether he had other injuries. He also could not determine the bullet’s entry or exit point.

“As for his hands and knuckles, I didn’t see any evidence he had been fighting anybody,” Kurtz said.
=================

[Gravitymaster 0]

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>Yes, I'm sure he had someone smash his head against a sidewalk and break his
>nose the next day as directed by the Police to cover up this huge racist conspiracy.

Cutting one's face seems a small price to pay to escape a long jail sentence. People have done far worse for far lesser risks.

Of course, the Police would have to be in on the cover-up also.

[jclalor 12]

Every broken nose I have seen bleeds like hell, where's the blood on the front of his shirt?

[davjohns 1]

Wow.

This whole thing just seems like a conspiracy theory to me. The police on the scene refused to arrest. There is at least one corroborating witness. The young man has a history. I've seen no indication the shooter had racist tendancies. He was the neighborhood watch captain, so he seems civic minded. His story matches the facts as far as we can know them right now. The police don't seem to have an issue with his story.

So...it's a coverup to protect the hispanic guy? Not enough blood? Why didn't the police make him go to the hospital? Sloppy police work?

Geez.

I don't know what happened. I wasn't there. But I see no evidence that the police gummed it up or that there is a conspiracy. No evidence of racism. Even the pictures of the cute little boy are misleading. Give it a rest.

I know it just wouldnt be right to kill all the stupid people that we meet..

But do you think it would be appropriate to just remove all of the warning labels and let nature take its course.

[billvon 2,991]

>Of course, the Police would have to be in on the cover-up also.

True. Which is unlikely, unless the police force in question had been complicit in cover-ups before. And of course if it looked like it happened again here, you'd at least expect the police chief to be put on leave while an outside agency investigates.

[DaVinci 0]

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He sure didn't look like someone who'd been beaten up to the extent of believing his life in danger.

And you base this on your extensive experience with fight club?

You channeling the dead Dr. Freud and being able to diagnose a persons mental state several hours removed from the incident by a low res video tape with no sound?

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If his injuries were so bad (broken nose, cuts), why wasn't he taken to an emergency room?

He didn't want to go.... A person can deny treatment.

Ever actually been in a fight and had your nose hit hard enough to bleed? I'd really like to know where you got your expertise in this field.

[SkyDekker 1,465]

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This whole thing just seems like a conspiracy theory to me.

Not to me, just wondering what happened.

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The police on the scene refused to arrest.

Really? They were told to, but they refused? This is news.

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There is at least one corroborating witness.

Supposedly a friend of the shooter, plus eye witness accounts are very unreliable.

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The young man has a history.

A history of smoking dope and writing graffiti on a school locker. Maybe as a former cop and current lawyer you can explain how that is in any way relevant?

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The police don't seem to have an issue with his story.

That means nothing to me. Stories galore of shitty police work. Not like these are all highly intelligent and neutral specimens of the human race. As a matter fo fact, our resident cop just finished posting how easy it is for cops to get jaded.

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Not enough blood?

No visible blood, which would be inconsistent with the reported "facts". Why?

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Sloppy police work?

I don't know, but there is no reason to take it off the table as an option.

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Give it a rest.

Yup a kid is dead, nothing to see here, move along.

Wow indeed.

[DaVinci 0]

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So, why didn't he?

I don't know why Trayvon didn't call the police and run away.

[SkyDekker 1,465]

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I don't know why Trayvon didn't call the police and run away.

He did run away supposedly, but then alledgedly came back, confronted and attacked Zimmerman.

[Gravitymaster 0]

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So, why didn't he?

I don't know why Trayvon didn't call the police and run away.

Good point. We know he had a cell phone with him.

[DaVinci 0]

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Every broken nose I have seen bleeds like hell, where's the blood on the front of his shirt?

Don't know... I do know that from the story given that he was laying on his back after being punched. If so, then blood would have run over too the back of his head, not his shirt.

Also, I have had a bloody nose more than once... I didn't get any on my gi. So it can happen.

[DaVinci 0]

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He did run away supposedly, but then alledgedly came back, confronted and attacked Zimmerman.

Then if you know this... Why are you asking me why he didn't run? You claimed he did run.

[SkyDekker 1,465]

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Why are you asking me why he didn't run?

Maybe that wasn't clear. Why would he run, come back, confront and attack Zimmerman? He didn't have a violent history.

[rehmwa 2]

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>Richard Kurtz of Roy Mizell and Kurtz Funeral Home in Fort Lauderdale said there appeared to be a gunshot wound in Martin’s upper chest area, but he received the body after the autopsy was completed so it was difficult to tell whether he had other injuries. He also could not determine the bullet’s entry or exit point.

“As for his hands and knuckles, I didn’t see any evidence he had been fighting anybody,” Kurtz said.
=================

WOW, just wow. This is completely unprofessional for a funeral home to give private info to the press. I don't care if the statement support either side or not at all.

So even the funeral home abused the kid's dead body with their own amateur autopsy....

this is such an out of control media feeding frenzy

this kid's parents should be outraged at the complete disregard for their family's privacy

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[kelpdiver 2]

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Ever have a bloody nose or a scalp wound? They bleed like hell, ...

Right, which is why people are wondering where the blood on his clothes is? And, if he was allowed to change his clothes, why? Would that be normal procedure?

Why wouldn't it be? Is he supposed to walk around with soiled clothing for the rest of the day? Given our (correct) fear of infectious diseases, why would we want him leaving a trail on the police car or in the station?

Should they have kept any such clothing? Again, for what purpose? There was no question of whose clothing it was, or whose blood it was. And police don't collect evidence to prove someone is innocent, they collect evidence to prove a crime.

this is some pretty clumsy monday morning QBing going on.

[DaVinci 0]

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Maybe that wasn't clear. Why would he run, come back, confront and attack Zimmerman? He didn't have a violent history.

You know he didn't have a violent history? Or you know he was never *caught* with a violent personality?

Don't you claim that one of the big dangers of easy gun ownership is you never know who is going to snap and when?

http://www.brutallyhonest.org/brutally_honest/2012/03/trayvon-martins-tweets.html

From his twitte handle, “NO_LIMIT_NIGGA”:

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I'll beat the Pu**y up up up up up up up up

Fu*k these haters I'll kimm 'em all if I could!

2 glock 40's... bitch you got 80 problems

At least one tweet to him makes reference to him "swinging on a bus driver"

Maybe he is just one of those dangerous folks that have not been in trouble yet you keep talking about?

[SkyDekker 1,465]

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this is some pretty clumsy monday morning QBing going on.

Asking a question is the same as monday morning QBing?

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And police don't collect evidence to prove someone is innocent, they collect evidence to prove a crime.

Re-read that and let me know if you still think the same. If you do, please let me know how the police would establish the existence or non-existence of a crime without collecting evidence.

[kelpdiver 2]

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this is some pretty clumsy monday morning QBing going on.

Asking a question is the same as monday morning QBing?

it was a really stupid question.

[SkyDekker 1,465]

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You know he didn't have a violent history? Or you know he was never *caught* with a violent personality?

I know no evidence has been presented. Up thread I even suggested it could be his first violent offence.

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Don't you claim that one of the big dangers of easy gun ownership is you never know who is going to snap and when?

No

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From his twitte handle, “NO_LIMIT_NIGGA”:


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I'll beat the Pu**y up up up up up up up up

Fu*k these haters I'll kimm 'em all if I could!

2 glock 40's... bitch you got 80 problems

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At least one tweet to him makes reference to him "swinging on a bus driver"

Maybe he is just one of those dangerous folks that have not been in trouble yet you keep talking about?

Maybe he is. I wouldn't use somebody's tweets alone as a precursor to violent behaviour. I would suggest it is a pretty dangerous precendent. I would be very surprised if you of all people would not agree with that.