Florida Teen Shot

[kallend 2,027]

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No, I want him to go to court because he killed an unarmed teenager.

That had doubled back on him, and was beating the shit out of him while telling him he was going to die. Let's not leave that very important part out.

Well, that's Z's version of the events. I wonder what TM's version is?

Our prisons are full of people who proclaim their innocence. Do you believe all of them?

Haven't you argued the exact opposite when discussing the death penalty?

Nope.

http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=3051768#3051768

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After the UK abolished the death penalty the authorities actually took the time to investigate a number of the troubling cases, and discovered a remarkable number of miscarriages of justice. Posthumous pardons, however, don't do much for the wrongly executed

That is FACT about a handful of "troubling cases", not an argument for believing all felons who plead "not guilty".

If that's the best you can do, then you've lost.

Just like if we were being chased by a bear. I don't have to out run the bear, I only have to out run you. Clearly you have posted information in the past that indicates you think their is a lot of miscarriages of justice which landed innocent people in jail. This is at odds with your current claim.

+1 Gravitymaster/0 Kallend

Poor logic for more than one reason (I'll leave you to figure them out).

Gravitymaster: F for logic, A+ for demonstrating the Dunning-Kruger effect.

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The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[normiss 801]

Are we ready for a Mistrial! yet?

Defense attorney had just announced this week filing for a Stand Your Ground hearing...and now the State drops the ball.



This case is worse than Casey Anthony.
Stupid Florida.













j/k

[SkydiveJonathan 0]

The attorney for the man who shot and killed unarmed Florida teenager Trayvon Martin said on Monday he would seek to get the case dismissed using a traditional self-defence argument and not the state's "stand your ground" statute.

Mark O'Mara, who is defending George Zimmerman against a second-degree murder charge after the fatal February shooting, said the traditional self-defence approach was appropriate because the facts suggested his client could not retreat from a beating Martin was giving him.

Zimmerman's attorneys said last week they would use Florida's controversial "stand your ground" law, which allows people to use deadly force – rather than retreat – if they believe their lives are in danger.

"The facts don't seem to support a 'stand your ground' defence," O'Mara said.

[rushmc 23]

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The attorney for the man who shot and killed unarmed Florida teenager Trayvon Martin said on Monday he would seek to get the case dismissed using a traditional self-defence argument and not the state's "stand your ground" statute.

Mark O'Mara, who is defending George Zimmerman against a second-degree murder charge after the fatal February shooting, said the traditional self-defence approach was appropriate because the facts suggested his client could not retreat from a beating Martin was giving him.

Zimmerman's attorneys said last week they would use Florida's controversial "stand your ground" law, which allows people to use deadly force – rather than retreat – if they believe their lives are in danger.

"The facts don't seem to support a 'stand your ground' defence," O'Mara said.

Just as many here said would happen

This is not a stand your ground case

It is a self defense case

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[normiss 801]

Defense subpoenas school records

Some of the info listed I have not seen before.

Last week the judge recused himself as well.
Judge number three step up!

[popsjumper 2]

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... the only correct forum for a decision on the facts of the case is a jury trial.

Holy shit. do you really think that way?
That strongly supports a police state where police arrest in all cases regardless of evidence. YOU will then have to got to trial and pay for the privilege regardless of the "facts".

OMG in heaven....please...for the sake of all of us...never get involved with anything related to the legal profession.

My reality and yours are quite different.
I think we're all Bozos on this bus.
Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239

[normiss 801]

I still think it's quite sad this case did exactly that - thanks to political caving.

[rushmc 23]

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I still think it's quite sad this case did exactly that - thanks to political caving.

.....caused by politically correct race baiters

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[kallend 2,027]

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... the only correct forum for a decision on the facts of the case is a jury trial.

Holy shit. do you really think that way?

That's why a jury is called the "decider of fact".

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The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[normiss 801]

So the neighborhood claims you have committed a crime and make petitions, news drops, constant complaints.
You're arrested and charged based simply on public opinion.

THIS is ok to you???

[sundevil777 102]

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... the only correct forum for a decision on the facts of the case is a jury trial.

Holy shit. do you really think that way?

That's why a jury is called the "decider of fact".

Don't you recognize the responsibility of investigators and prosecutors to decide when they should not proceed? That is a key part of their job.

People are sick and tired of being told that ordinary and decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired. I’m certainly not, and I’m sick and tired of being told that I am

[DanG 1]

That's what a grand jury is for. Although it is often a rubber stamp, the prosecutor can't proceed if the grand jury does not agree that there is sufficient evidence.

- Dan G

[kallend 2,027]

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So the neighborhood claims you have committed a crime and make petitions, news drops, constant complaints.
You're arrested and charged based simply on public opinion.

That can work in both directions. That's why a jury is called the "decider of fact".

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The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[normiss 801]

Amazing what the cost of defending innocence is becoming.

[mirage62 0]

+1

Kevin Keenan is my hero, a double FUP, he does so much with so little

[kallend 2,027]

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Amazing what the cost of defending innocence is becoming.

I hear that most criminals plead "not guilty", which is why we have trials with juries in the first place - to be the decider of fact.

If police and prosecutors were infallible, no trials would be necessary.

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The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[normiss 801]

Ah I see.
Now they're all 'criminals'.

That clears it right up.

I hope you're never on a jury.

[rushmc 23]

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Amazing what the cost of defending innocence is becoming.

I hear that most criminals plead "not guilty", which is why we have trials with juries in the first place - to be the decider of fact.

If police and prosecutors were infallible, no trials would be necessary.

Cool

Then somebody can claim you kicked their kid

You can hire a lawyer and a jury can decide just how bad a criminal you are or are not

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[lurch 0]

I think the whole legal system has been so thoroughly corrupted its become an absurd dark joke that eats people. "Heads we win, tails you lose." I do not fear criminals, street thugs, terrorism or natural disasters. I DO fear cops and anything that can drag you into a legal situation of any kind. Innocence or guilt has become completely irrelevant when even if you beat all the charges and "win" your pyrrhic victory, you'll be hopelessly financially crippled and enslaved by trying to pay off the quarter million dollar legal fees and income loss you took defending yourself.

I know some guys busted for an attempted BASE jump. They did no damage, caused no harm. Whats the first thing the law does? Charge em with what they actually DID? Hell, no. They charge em with that, plus 2 or 3 made-up bullshit bonus charges as customary procedure to either coerce them into not fighting or guarantee a "win" for the prosecutor by creating a situation where they get threatened with max penalties on all counts or allowing them to "plead down" to only one or two.

The purpose of the system is no longer justice, the purpose is to strip any victim inducted into the system of any and all possible resources, and, if possible, their freedom as well, then finish making a profit by selling their captured ass to a corporate prison. "One way or another you'll lose everything, become our property and make a profit for us."

I've never committed a jailable crime in my life. I live clean, I cause no harm. And I live in fear of our so-called "justice system" because innocent or guilty, if it grabs me on ANY pretext, (give a cop a funny look? Dare to talk back or argue? I love youtube. Shows uncounted thousands of such "isolated incidents". Thats a beating, a tasing, a gassing, and then some made up charges to make sure I get a felony rap as a lesson not to show the slightest sign of defiance) it will methodically render me helpless, powerless, moneyless, and then it will eat me. Best case scenario, I'm released months later, completely impoverished, jobless, homeless, utterly enslaved by legal debts of a 5 to 6 figure scale I can never pay off in a decade or more, and stripped of all possible hope of getting back to normal.

And thats if I'm found "innocent."
Scared to death, waiting and hoping the system collapses under its own weight Soviet style.
Hope it happens soon before these people finish turning this country into a jail.
-B

Live and learn... or die, and teach by example.

[kallend 2,027]

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Ah I see.
Now they're all 'criminals'.

That clears it right up.

I hope you're never on a jury.

Nice distortion of what I wrote.

We use juries because police and prosecutors, over the centuries, have proven to be both fallible and corruptible. The jury system is the best that any society on Earth has yet devised to determine guilt or innocence.

I hope you're never a prosecutor.

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The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[normiss 801]

THIS is where it's at.

It's not a system of justice.
If you still think that, then you've never been swept into it's cesspool of dishonesty.

[kallend 2,027]

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Amazing what the cost of defending innocence is becoming.

I hear that most criminals plead "not guilty", which is why we have trials with juries in the first place - to be the decider of fact.

If police and prosecutors were infallible, no trials would be necessary.

Cool

Then somebody can claim you kicked their kid

You can hire a lawyer and a jury can decide just how bad a criminal you are or are not

Nobody is claiming that TM is dead. He IS dead, shot by Z.

I hope nobody ever shoots your family member dead, claims self defense, and so the police decide to let the shooter go.

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The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[rushmc 23]

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Amazing what the cost of defending innocence is becoming.

I hear that most criminals plead "not guilty", which is why we have trials with juries in the first place - to be the decider of fact.

If police and prosecutors were infallible, no trials would be necessary.

Cool

Then somebody can claim you kicked their kid

You can hire a lawyer and a jury can decide just how bad a criminal you are or are not

Nobody is claiming that TM is dead. He IS dead, shot by Z.

I hope nobody ever shoots your family member dead, claims self defense, and so the police decide to let the shooter go.

Hey, he said you kicked their kid

Get you lawyer and go to trial

PERIOD!

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[normiss 801]

I hope nobody in my family ever attacks someone and gets their ass shot off.


Or even dies in a situation the world will never know the truth about and MANY people's life are terribly and innocently altered by for that matter.

The way the law is written, Zimmerman should not have been charged. As was the case until racism was screamed in front of tv cameras.

Let's just go back to public justice and stonings.
That's what this case is anyway.

[kallend 2,027]

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Amazing what the cost of defending innocence is becoming.

I hear that most criminals plead "not guilty", which is why we have trials with juries in the first place - to be the decider of fact.

If police and prosecutors were infallible, no trials would be necessary.

Cool

Then somebody can claim you kicked their kid

You can hire a lawyer and a jury can decide just how bad a criminal you are or are not

Nobody is claiming that TM is dead. He IS dead, shot by Z.

I hope nobody ever shoots your family member dead, claims self defense, and so the police decide to let the shooter go.

Hey, he said you kicked their kid

Get you lawyer and go to trial

PERIOD!

Why don't you tell us what you think the perfect method of determing guilt or innocence is in disputed cases, since clearly you don't like jury trials.

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The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.