I have jobs, but no one wants them

[sfzombie 3]

i have to speak up here. if you follow your conclusions, you are correct in your figures to a point. when you are drawing unemployment, you are not travelling anywhere, eating lunch out, and incurring no additional expenses. the price of gas alone with a 25 mile one-way trip to work 5 days a week puts a dent in the take home pay as does the deduction of taxes. in wv, you have the option to have 10% taken out of unemployment, but it is a choice, not mandatory. don't know about other states. i had the option of drawing unemployment or working for $10 an hour and chose unemployment for these reasons.

http://kitswv.com

[marks2065 0]

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So the discussion is what is a "working" wage?
The idea is that unemployment should be such that you are uncomfortable but not destitute and stealing from others so that you may live.

That's only the case if you're still living like a college student with a $300 sublet room. Peoples' rent and mortgage payments don't magically drop when they become unemployed.

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However minimum wage is designed to be a step above unemployment benefits?
Thus perhaps it can be argued that the system is now upside down?
That one is better off financially being unemployed than gainfully employed at minimum wage?

It depends on what you were making before becoming unemployed and how long you'll be unemployed for.

1) In the states that I'm aware of you get no more than 50% of what you were making before up to some limit (in California that happens at a $49,400 annual salary). If you were making less than double minimum wage you're better off working if you can get a job.

2) There are total benefit limits. In California it's about 26 weeks worth of benefits and Colorado it's similar. Don't work at all, you don't get a dime after six months, and if you were at or above the wage limit you'd make $2700 less in your first year of unemployment than you would have at a minimum wage job.

There is a dollar for dollar reduction in benefits if you are working, but that means the benefits stretch out longer.

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And before you start ranting against unemployment benefits, please look around the safe secure nation we live in, this is greatly impart due to our unemployment system.

Your employer pays about $500 a year in Federal and State unemployment insurance taxes unless they make a habit of laying off people in which case they pay more. Provided that you don't become unemployed very often or for very long more goes into the system on your behalf than you take out.

wrong, you employer pays about $250 - $1000 per employee per year to unemployment. My Rate is something I protect to keep my expenses down. a company with a high rate and over 50 employees could be in trouble financially just from these fees. the longer and more money someone collects on unemployment the higher your rate goes.

[marks2065 0]

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i have to speak up here. if you follow your conclusions, you are correct in your figures to a point. when you are drawing unemployment, you are not travelling anywhere, eating lunch out, and incurring no additional expenses. the price of gas alone with a 25 mile one-way trip to work 5 days a week puts a dent in the take home pay as does the deduction of taxes. in wv, you have the option to have 10% taken out of unemployment, but it is a choice, not mandatory. don't know about other states. i had the option of drawing unemployment or working for $10 an hour and chose unemployment for these reasons.

Staying on unemployment because you don't like working for less is wrong. This causes increases to the products you buy by raising costs to the bisiness. Unemployment is a bridge to get you to your next job not to support you in a way that makes you more confortable.

[kallend 2,027]

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W/O using the words lazy, what do you guys think?
http://money.cnn.com/galleries/2012/smallbusiness/1203/gallery.employees/index.html

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And we offer a competitive wage: $8.50 to $9.50 an hour. The $8.50 is just the starting wage. After 90 days we increase it to $9.50 to $10 an hour.

But many people add up their constantly renewed unemployment, food stamps and housing assistance and realize that they can make as much not working, as working.

"Elsewhere in the world, workers have a survival mentality. They know they have to give 110% to keep their jobs. In this country, we give public assistance and unemployment. That allows us not to be as driven. "

Yeah, just like the sweatshops in Asia. What a clueless turd.

mh

And all those who make claims about "giving 110%" need a course in basic math.

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The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[Rick 67]

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I protect to keep my expenses down. a company with a high rate and over 50 employees could be in trouble financially just from these fees. the longer and more money someone collects on unemployment the higher your rate goes.

I also have seen it become harder to fight an ex-employee over benefits. At least here in Florida. Which like you say will drive up the companies insurance cost after too many claims.

You can't be drunk all day if you don't start early!

[kallend 2,027]

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i have to speak up here. if you follow your conclusions, you are correct in your figures to a point. when you are drawing unemployment, you are not travelling anywhere, eating lunch out, and incurring no additional expenses. the price of gas alone with a 25 mile one-way trip to work 5 days a week puts a dent in the take home pay as does the deduction of taxes. in wv, you have the option to have 10% taken out of unemployment, but it is a choice, not mandatory. don't know about other states. i had the option of drawing unemployment or working for $10 an hour and chose unemployment for these reasons.

Staying on unemployment because you don't like working for less is wrong. This causes increases to the products you buy by raising costs to the bisiness. Unemployment is a bridge to get you to your next job not to support you in a way that makes you more confortable.

Doesn't help that there are 4 people looking for jobs for every job available.

We also have a serious mismatch between skills available and skills needed.

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The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[marks2065 0]

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i have to speak up here. if you follow your conclusions, you are correct in your figures to a point. when you are drawing unemployment, you are not travelling anywhere, eating lunch out, and incurring no additional expenses. the price of gas alone with a 25 mile one-way trip to work 5 days a week puts a dent in the take home pay as does the deduction of taxes. in wv, you have the option to have 10% taken out of unemployment, but it is a choice, not mandatory. don't know about other states. i had the option of drawing unemployment or working for $10 an hour and chose unemployment for these reasons.

Staying on unemployment because you don't like working for less is wrong. This causes increases to the products you buy by raising costs to the bisiness. Unemployment is a bridge to get you to your next job not to support you in a way that makes you more confortable.

Doesn't help that there are 4 people looking for jobs for every job available.

We also have a serious mismatch between skills available and skills needed.

tell the dems to allow projects like the pipeline and the mine in wisc, that would takes tens of thousands off the unemployment lines and improve the economy, then we wouldn't even be having this discussion.

[kallend 2,027]

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i have to speak up here. if you follow your conclusions, you are correct in your figures to a point. when you are drawing unemployment, you are not travelling anywhere, eating lunch out, and incurring no additional expenses. the price of gas alone with a 25 mile one-way trip to work 5 days a week puts a dent in the take home pay as does the deduction of taxes. in wv, you have the option to have 10% taken out of unemployment, but it is a choice, not mandatory. don't know about other states. i had the option of drawing unemployment or working for $10 an hour and chose unemployment for these reasons.

Staying on unemployment because you don't like working for less is wrong. This causes increases to the products you buy by raising costs to the bisiness. Unemployment is a bridge to get you to your next job not to support you in a way that makes you more confortable.

Doesn't help that there are 4 people looking for jobs for every job available.

We also have a serious mismatch between skills available and skills needed.

tell the dems to allow projects like the pipeline and the mine in wisc, that would takes tens of thousands off the unemployment lines and improve the economy, then we wouldn't even be having this discussion.

That ass-umes that the millions of unemployed are qualified for those jobs. Mismatch of skills IS one of the problems we face.

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The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[marks2065 0]

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i have to speak up here. if you follow your conclusions, you are correct in your figures to a point. when you are drawing unemployment, you are not travelling anywhere, eating lunch out, and incurring no additional expenses. the price of gas alone with a 25 mile one-way trip to work 5 days a week puts a dent in the take home pay as does the deduction of taxes. in wv, you have the option to have 10% taken out of unemployment, but it is a choice, not mandatory. don't know about other states. i had the option of drawing unemployment or working for $10 an hour and chose unemployment for these reasons.

Staying on unemployment because you don't like working for less is wrong. This causes increases to the products you buy by raising costs to the bisiness. Unemployment is a bridge to get you to your next job not to support you in a way that makes you more confortable.

Doesn't help that there are 4 people looking for jobs for every job available.

We also have a serious mismatch between skills available and skills needed.

tell the dems to allow projects like the pipeline and the mine in wisc, that would takes tens of thousands off the unemployment lines and improve the economy, then we wouldn't even be having this discussion.

That ass-umes that the millions of unemployed are qualified for those jobs. Mismatch of skills IS one of the problems we face.

Maybe that is because the people are taining for jobs they want instead of jobs that are available or they can actually get and do. Maybe the colleges need to offer jobs skills classes instead of basket weaving and discussing our favorite auther 101.

[kallend 2,027]

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i have to speak up here. if you follow your conclusions, you are correct in your figures to a point. when you are drawing unemployment, you are not travelling anywhere, eating lunch out, and incurring no additional expenses. the price of gas alone with a 25 mile one-way trip to work 5 days a week puts a dent in the take home pay as does the deduction of taxes. in wv, you have the option to have 10% taken out of unemployment, but it is a choice, not mandatory. don't know about other states. i had the option of drawing unemployment or working for $10 an hour and chose unemployment for these reasons.

Staying on unemployment because you don't like working for less is wrong. This causes increases to the products you buy by raising costs to the bisiness. Unemployment is a bridge to get you to your next job not to support you in a way that makes you more confortable.

Doesn't help that there are 4 people looking for jobs for every job available.

We also have a serious mismatch between skills available and skills needed.

tell the dems to allow projects like the pipeline and the mine in wisc, that would takes tens of thousands off the unemployment lines and improve the economy, then we wouldn't even be having this discussion.

That ass-umes that the millions of unemployed are qualified for those jobs. Mismatch of skills IS one of the problems we face.

Maybe that is because the people are taining for jobs they want instead of jobs that are available or they can actually get and do. Maybe the colleges need to offer jobs skills classes instead of basket weaving and discussing our favorite auther 101.

Of course, that ignores the FACT that unemployment among those with college education is far less than among those without. Apparently colleges are doing something right.

www.bls.gov/emp/ep_chart_001.htm

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The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[marks2065 0]

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i have to speak up here. if you follow your conclusions, you are correct in your figures to a point. when you are drawing unemployment, you are not travelling anywhere, eating lunch out, and incurring no additional expenses. the price of gas alone with a 25 mile one-way trip to work 5 days a week puts a dent in the take home pay as does the deduction of taxes. in wv, you have the option to have 10% taken out of unemployment, but it is a choice, not mandatory. don't know about other states. i had the option of drawing unemployment or working for $10 an hour and chose unemployment for these reasons.

Staying on unemployment because you don't like working for less is wrong. This causes increases to the products you buy by raising costs to the bisiness. Unemployment is a bridge to get you to your next job not to support you in a way that makes you more confortable.

Doesn't help that there are 4 people looking for jobs for every job available.

We also have a serious mismatch between skills available and skills needed.

tell the dems to allow projects like the pipeline and the mine in wisc, that would takes tens of thousands off the unemployment lines and improve the economy, then we wouldn't even be having this discussion.

That ass-umes that the millions of unemployed are qualified for those jobs. Mismatch of skills IS one of the problems we face.

Maybe that is because the people are taining for jobs they want instead of jobs that are available or they can actually get and do. Maybe the colleges need to offer jobs skills classes instead of basket weaving and discussing our favorite auther 101.

Of course, that ignores the FACT that unemployment among those with college education is far less than among those without. Apparently colleges are doing something right.

www.bls.gov/emp/ep_chart_001.htm

How many of those with college degrees are actually working in the field they trained for? How many went to college and are now unemployed because the field they trained in was saturated. How many could have saved tens of thousands of $s by going to a trade school and learned a trade that is currantly looking for people to fill the employment gaps?

[kallend 2,027]

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i have to speak up here. if you follow your conclusions, you are correct in your figures to a point. when you are drawing unemployment, you are not travelling anywhere, eating lunch out, and incurring no additional expenses. the price of gas alone with a 25 mile one-way trip to work 5 days a week puts a dent in the take home pay as does the deduction of taxes. in wv, you have the option to have 10% taken out of unemployment, but it is a choice, not mandatory. don't know about other states. i had the option of drawing unemployment or working for $10 an hour and chose unemployment for these reasons.

Staying on unemployment because you don't like working for less is wrong. This causes increases to the products you buy by raising costs to the bisiness. Unemployment is a bridge to get you to your next job not to support you in a way that makes you more confortable.

Doesn't help that there are 4 people looking for jobs for every job available.

We also have a serious mismatch between skills available and skills needed.

tell the dems to allow projects like the pipeline and the mine in wisc, that would takes tens of thousands off the unemployment lines and improve the economy, then we wouldn't even be having this discussion.

That ass-umes that the millions of unemployed are qualified for those jobs. Mismatch of skills IS one of the problems we face.

Maybe that is because the people are taining for jobs they want instead of jobs that are available or they can actually get and do. Maybe the colleges need to offer jobs skills classes instead of basket weaving and discussing our favorite auther 101.

Of course, that ignores the FACT that unemployment among those with college education is far less than among those without. Apparently colleges are doing something right.

www.bls.gov/emp/ep_chart_001.htm

How many of those with college degrees are actually working in the field they trained for? How many went to college and are now unemployed because the field they trained in was saturated. How many could have saved tens of thousands of $s by going to a trade school and learned a trade that is currantly looking for people to fill the employment gaps?

Find out and report back to us.

Until you do that we'll just have to go with the data we have, which is that a college education leads to lower unemployment rates and higher income.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[marks2065 0]

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i have to speak up here. if you follow your conclusions, you are correct in your figures to a point. when you are drawing unemployment, you are not travelling anywhere, eating lunch out, and incurring no additional expenses. the price of gas alone with a 25 mile one-way trip to work 5 days a week puts a dent in the take home pay as does the deduction of taxes. in wv, you have the option to have 10% taken out of unemployment, but it is a choice, not mandatory. don't know about other states. i had the option of drawing unemployment or working for $10 an hour and chose unemployment for these reasons.

Staying on unemployment because you don't like working for less is wrong. This causes increases to the products you buy by raising costs to the bisiness. Unemployment is a bridge to get you to your next job not to support you in a way that makes you more confortable.

Doesn't help that there are 4 people looking for jobs for every job available.

We also have a serious mismatch between skills available and skills needed.

tell the dems to allow projects like the pipeline and the mine in wisc, that would takes tens of thousands off the unemployment lines and improve the economy, then we wouldn't even be having this discussion.

That ass-umes that the millions of unemployed are qualified for those jobs. Mismatch of skills IS one of the problems we face.

Maybe that is because the people are taining for jobs they want instead of jobs that are available or they can actually get and do. Maybe the colleges need to offer jobs skills classes instead of basket weaving and discussing our favorite auther 101.

Of course, that ignores the FACT that unemployment among those with college education is far less than among those without. Apparently colleges are doing something right.

www.bls.gov/emp/ep_chart_001.htm

How many of those with college degrees are actually working in the field they trained for? How many went to college and are now unemployed because the field they trained in was saturated. How many could have saved tens of thousands of $s by going to a trade school and learned a trade that is currantly looking for people to fill the employment gaps?

Find out and report back to us.

Until you do that we'll just have to go with the data we have, which is that a college education leads to lower unemployment rates and higher income.

I say you are wrong, Self determination, good choices on schooling, competitive drive in the work place and pride in ones self leads to lower unemployment and higher income. Schooling is just a tool in ones tool box to achieve a goal. Picking the right tool is what is needed and to many people are picking the wrong tool and expect society to just drop the entitlements into their laps.

[kallend 2,027]

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Maybe that is because the people are taining for jobs they want instead of jobs that are available or they can actually get and do. Maybe the colleges need to offer jobs skills classes instead of basket weaving and discussing our favorite auther 101.

Of course, that ignores the FACT that unemployment among those with college education is far less than among those without. Apparently colleges are doing something right.

www.bls.gov/emp/ep_chart_001.htm

How many of those with college degrees are actually working in the field they trained for? How many went to college and are now unemployed because the field they trained in was saturated. How many could have saved tens of thousands of $s by going to a trade school and learned a trade that is currantly looking for people to fill the employment gaps?

Find out and report back to us.

Until you do that we'll just have to go with the data we have, which is that a college education leads to lower unemployment rates and higher income.

[marks2065 0]

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Maybe that is because the people are taining for jobs they want instead of jobs that are available or they can actually get and do. Maybe the colleges need to offer jobs skills classes instead of basket weaving and discussing our favorite auther 101.

Of course, that ignores the FACT that unemployment among those with college education is far less than among those without. Apparently colleges are doing something right.

www.bls.gov/emp/ep_chart_001.htm

How many of those with college degrees are actually working in the field they trained for? How many went to college and are now unemployed because the field they trained in was saturated. How many could have saved tens of thousands of $s by going to a trade school and learned a trade that is currantly looking for people to fill the employment gaps?

Find out and report back to us.

Until you do that we'll just have to go with the data we have, which is that a college education leads to lower unemployment rates and higher income.

I say you are wrong,

[kelpdiver 2]

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No that doesn't prove it, it proves that those with the qualities I described, college worked for them and some it did not work for. It shows that those that did not complete the programs they started started did worse than those that did. I don't have a college eduacation And I make almost 80% more than that of the average college graduate (46K). I learned a trade in 6 months and saved over 50k in college tuition. college was not the correct route for me and is not the correct route for many that are in college. College is a tool to use not the cause for employment and higher wages. Learning a trade that is in demand and your desire to sucede in life is more important that any college eduacation.

Your experience is not proof. The NBA is full of guys with one year of college or less, making tens of millions. But it's not a recipe for success, esp when you count how many Div I basketball players do not pan out.

There is fairly striking research that concludes that for the most successful, it doesn't matter which college they go to, because the attributes they possess are the key (though networking at elites can help). This is near the point you are trying to make.

[kallend 2,027]

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Maybe that is because the people are taining for jobs they want instead of jobs that are available or they can actually get and do. Maybe the colleges need to offer jobs skills classes instead of basket weaving and discussing our favorite auther 101.

Of course, that ignores the FACT that unemployment among those with college education is far less than among those without. Apparently colleges are doing something right.

www.bls.gov/emp/ep_chart_001.htm

How many of those with college degrees are actually working in the field they trained for? How many went to college and are now unemployed because the field they trained in was saturated. How many could have saved tens of thousands of $s by going to a trade school and learned a trade that is currantly looking for people to fill the employment gaps?

Find out and report back to us.

Until you do that we'll just have to go with the data we have, which is that a college education leads to lower unemployment rates and higher income.

I say you are wrong,

However, the data prove me right.

www.mymoneyblog.com/unemployment-rates-vs-level-of-education.html
www.bls.gov/emp/ep_chart_001.htm
steadfastfinances.com/blog/2010/03/05/education-versus-unemployment-rate/
www.deptofnumbers.com/unemployment/demographics/
www.bls.gov/news.release/empsit.t04.htm

[Darius11 12]

I think it has a lot to with the cost of living not being taken in too effect.

8.50 x 40 (if they give you full time) = 340 after taxes and all the other shit you would be lucky to take home 280.00 280x 52 / 12 = $1213.00 Month. Can you survive on that??? That's what employers who want good employees need to ask. There is this disconnect for some reason the employers seem to understand there expense but a simple look at rent and cost of living should make it clear as day that NO ONE can live on what is being paid.

A working wage would have to do with location, and who can do the work. Is it a job for high school kids who live at home, or do you need adults with adult exps.

If you want adults then guess what you have to look at your location and at minimum figure out what would someone need to survive. Rent, Food transpiration.

This is not even being a good employer this should be the bare minimum, cause at the end of the day who wants to just survive. Its just sad that its gotten to the point that minimum wage is not even enough to survive on.

Also I have seen many jobs for a dollar or two over minimum wage that aren't factory or simple work. They require someone to keep appearance, have skills, knowledge.

Living wage for where I live is 15 Bucks again that's not living large its rent for a single room place, food, transportation and other expenses that you would need, Car ins. Electricity heat. Water.

If i am hiring someone i want them to not have to worry about if they can eat dinner or pay there electricity bill. I want them to have the metal energy to do there work not just think its better then nothing.

I'd rather be hated for who I am, than loved for who I am not." - Kurt Cobain

[Darius11 12]

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However, the DATA are overwhelming in showing that unemployment is lower and incomes higher for those with college degrees. Arguing otherwise is absurd.

Education is key you right on that.

I do wish you could get a degree that is needed without having 100K or more in depth.

A few of my friends have over 120K in student loans they basically have to pay $1200 a month for there 4 years of school.
They do have ok jobs they make 50-80k a year but that depth is basically a mortgage.

If you want to invest in the country and make it a better place I think education is the way to go.

Unfortunately its not something that will improve this quarter numbers but in the long run (which no one seems to care about) it will make it better for everyone

I'd rather be hated for who I am, than loved for who I am not." - Kurt Cobain

[DrewEckhardt 0]

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I do wish you could get a degree that is needed without having 100K or more in depth.

95% of college students taking student loans manage to stay below $100K. Over 40% don't rack up $10K in debt and the bottom 2/3 are still under $26K.

State school tuition and fees someplace like CU Boulder is about $11,000 a year.

4 x 11,000 = $44,000

Of course, your degree still says "CU Boulder" when you get core classes out of the way first at Front Range Community college which runs only $105 per credit hour or about $3150 a year. Doing so doesn't even preclude graduating summa cum laude.

2 x 3,150 + 2 x $11000 = 28,300. Fees add a few hundred more so you might round to $30K.

Some of the guys I know did this recently and they're not drowning in debt.

[kelpdiver 2]

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State school tuition and fees someplace like CU Boulder is about $11,000 a year.

4 x 11,000 = $44,000

don't forget you have to live somewhere and eat, so add another 10k / year (can vary substantially on where you are and how you choose to live). I think part time work wages should correlate to this expense, so it's probably back to your 4 years of state or 2 year of CC + 2 years of CU. Living at home may be an option, but again comes down to where your home is. IMO, if you can leave the home, it's a better experience for both you and your parents. Hopefully you can avoid boommeranging.

The 100k club is a different matter - it has the doctor types, who had many more years of very expensive school, those who went to overpriced diploma mills or privates, and unfortunately, those who didn't understand basic finance.

[wmw999 2,447]

In the 1970's I made it through a private university with only $3000 in debt (self-supported the last two years).

In the last few years my son made it through university with no debt. His first 4 years had tuition paid (but he took longer to graduate); he adjusted his living expenses to reduce his needs.

It's surprising what you can do with a reduced standard of living.

However, that's anecdotal -- that's the problem. You can't count on everyone deciding that they can live on less ot save for the future. They won't. Just as they won't decide not to eat crap, or smoke, or drive that really cool truck or SUV, to have a better future for themselves.

Heck -- you can rent tires here in Houston. I still find that hard to imagine.

Wendy P.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[kallend 2,027]

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In the 1970's I made it through a private university with only $3000 in debt (self-supported the last two years).

.

Yes, but today's students have to have G4 phones, iPads, HD TVs, ... etc., in their dorm rooms. Stuff you and I went without.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[kelpdiver 2]

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In the 1970's I made it through a private university with only $3000 in debt (self-supported the last two years).

.

Yes, but today's students have to have G4 phones, iPads, HD TVs, ... etc., in their dorm rooms. Stuff you and I went without.

while walking in the snow...yeah, we know.

College costs are in a whole different ballpark then either of you went to school, or even when I did in the early 90s. They've been increasing faster than inflation for a long while, and public funding for the "public" universities is now a scant portion of their operating budget.

[quade 4]

I'm only guessing here, but I think Professor Kallend might be sort of aware of the current cost of college tuition.

Perhaps even painfully so.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver