Julian Assange gets asylum

[muff528 3]

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........

You really think every phone or in-person conversation is memorialized in writing?

Making a joke ...forgot the "". Sorry.

[Andy9o8 2]

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You really think every phone or in-person conversation is memorialized in writing?

Making a joke ...forgot the "". Sorry.

Oh.
I need my morning coffee.

[masterrig 1]

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Thanks for that. I still think, he should face his accusrs. The longer he runs, the worse things get for him.

Not from where I see it.

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The statement by his attorney that there is collusion between Sweden and the U.S. could just be a ploy on the part of his attorney. Where's his proof? Throwing in 'the death penalty' adds to the effect. Chuck

It's more than just a couple of people who suspect this. As for proof, quiet collusion between nations happens all the time, but the hard proof of it rarely is in the public light of day while the events are still in play.

With no real proof of collusion, then it's a contrived conclusion introduced by his attorney to protect his client.
We know how you attornies work!


Chuck

[champu 1]

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hmm...will this be the end of it all?

I hope so. The US and the UK need to let Assange fade away into obscurity like the fart in the wind that he is.

Something a lot of folks on this board, not necessarily you kelp, have had difficulty with is remembering that Bradley Manning and Julian Assange are not the same person, nor are their situations all that similar.

Assange held a Q&A session about what he did and simply stroked his own ego and insulted anyone who opposed, he claimed to have redacted stuff he thought was dangerous but did a poor job at it, and later incompetently released the un-redacted versions and tried to throw someone else under the bus over it. But given all that I've still always said he shouldn't have weird unrelated allegations trumped up to get back at him for it. I just find it disgusting that people actually laud him for taking advantage of Manning and others when it's pretty clear his only goal is promoting himself.

[masterrig 1]

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hmm...will this be the end of it all?

I hope so. The US and the UK need to let Assange fade away into obscurity like the fart in the wind that he is.

Something a lot of folks on this board, not necessarily you kelp, have had difficulty with is remembering that Bradley Manning and Julian Assange are not the same person, nor are their situations all that similar.

Assange held a Q&A session about what he did and simply stroked his own ego and insulted anyone who opposed, he claimed to have redacted stuff he thought was dangerous but did a poor job at it, and later incompetently released the un-redacted versions and tried to throw someone else under the bus over it. But given all that I've still always said he shouldn't have weird unrelated allegations trumped up to get back at him for it. I just find it disgusting that people actually laud him for taking advantage of Manning and others when it's pretty clear his only goal is promoting himself.

Maybe, the sexual assault charges are 'real' but other than that, you pretty much summed it up. The guy is just an arrogant shit who refuses to take responsibility for his own actions, sounds like to me.

If, the U.S. oes have a case against him, we need to have the opportunity to try him.

http://home.myhughesnet.com/news/read.php?rip_id=%3CDA0OEKA81%40news.ap.org%3E&ps=1018



Chuck

[Skyrad 0]

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Its the Falklands, always has been always will be. Unless the islanders change their flag of course

Or the British decide to bring them home when they can no longer protect them. Threatening to storm the embassy seems to be backfiring.

They're already home

When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy.
Lucius Annaeus Seneca

[Skyrad 0]

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Its the Falklands, always has been always will be. Unless the islanders change their flag of course

Or the British decide to bring them home when they can no longer protect them. Threatening to storm the embassy seems to be backfiring.

The guy is wanted on a rape charge in Sweden! His running and hiding isn't helping him any. Also, the fact he jumped bail just makes him look more guilty. All those awards and gold buttons he got don't mean squat, now.


Chuck

Actually he hasn't been charged with anything Chuck, and the Swedish want to question him not over rape (as widely misreported) but over sexual misconduct, a crime that doesn't even exist in the UK. Don't get me wrong, I think the guys is a lresponsible, attention seeking loose cannon who has endangered lives.
But many of the facts widely reported by the mass media are not correct.

Its also worth remembering that the intelligence services have used criminal sexual defamation before when they've been pursuing someone for publishing something that fell foul of offcial secrets (See Richard Tomlison MI6 agent, he was defamed by being labelled a paedophile to keep him running. He was not, nor did he have any criminal background outside of attempting to publish a book.

When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy.
Lucius Annaeus Seneca

[Skyrad 0]

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hmm...will this be the end of it all?

I hope so. The US and the UK need to let Assange fade away into obscurity like the fart in the wind that he is.

Something a lot of folks on this board, not necessarily you kelp, have had difficulty with is remembering that Bradley Manning and Julian Assange are not the same person, nor are their situations all that similar.

Assange held a Q&A session about what he did and simply stroked his own ego and insulted anyone who opposed, he claimed to have redacted stuff he thought was dangerous but did a poor job at it, and later incompetently released the un-redacted versions and tried to throw someone else under the bus over it. But given all that I've still always said he shouldn't have weird unrelated allegations trumped up to get back at him for it. I just find it disgusting that people actually laud him for taking advantage of Manning and others when it's pretty clear his only goal is promoting himself.

If Bradley Manning is has charges to face then why hasn't he recieved a trial? Its been over 800 days now, how can that be justifiable?

When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy.
Lucius Annaeus Seneca

[masterrig 1]

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Its the Falklands, always has been always will be. Unless the islanders change their flag of course

Or the British decide to bring them home when they can no longer protect them. Threatening to storm the embassy seems to be backfiring.

The guy is wanted on a rape charge in Sweden! His running and hiding isn't helping him any. Also, the fact he jumped bail just makes him look more guilty. All those awards and gold buttons he got don't mean squat, now.


Chuck

Actually he hasn't been charged with anything Chuck, and the Swedish want to question him not over rape (as widely misreported) but over sexual misconduct, a crime that doesn't even exist in the UK. Don't get me wrong, I think the guys is a lresponsible, attention seeking loose cannon who has endangered lives.
But many of the facts widely reported by the mass media are not correct.

Its also worth remembering that the intelligence services have used criminal sexual defamation before when they've been pursuing someone for publishing something that fell foul of offcial secrets (See Richard Tomlison MI6 agent, he was defamed by being labelled a paedophile to keep him running. He was not, nor did he have any criminal background outside of attempting to publish a book.

I noticed in reading news stories about him that one story says this and another story says that, more than likely to sell newspapers. I guess, it's the old story... 'if you can't beat 'em... confuse 'em'!
We'll just have to watch the drama and see how it all shakes-out.


Chuck

[champu 1]

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If Bradley Manning has charges to face then why hasn't he recieved a trial? Its been over 800 days now, how can that be justifiable?

I don't know why anything takes as long as it does, but I'm always keen to apply Hanlon's Razor *.

In any event, he has been arraigned so he does have charges to face, and apparently the trial is supposed to be getting under way in the next month or so.

/edited to add: * I will admit, however, that there's a sad irrelevancy to Hanlon's Razor as despite the disparate prevalence of malice and stupidity, they are equally incurable.

[masterrig 1]

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If Bradley Manning has charges to face then why hasn't he recieved a trial? Its been over 800 days now, how can that be justifiable?

I don't know why anything takes as long as it does, but I'm always keen to apply Hanlon's Razor *.

In any event, he has been arraigned so he does have charges to face, and apparently the trial is supposed to be getting under way in the next month or so.

/edited to add: * I will admit, however, that there's a sad irrelevancy to Hanlon's Razor as despite the disparate prevalence of malice and stupidity, they are equally incurable.

I would imagine, it's taken so long to bring Bradley to trial is due to 'legal tactics' by attornies.
In the case of Asange, Does anyone know for certain and have evidence that the rape/sexual assault charges are trumped-up? Does anyone know for certain that there is collusion on the part of Sweden and the U.S or are these just guesses and assumptions, using past experience?


Chuck

[kelpdiver 2]

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In the case of Asange, Does anyone know for certain and have evidence that the rape/sexual assault charges are trumped-up? Does anyone know for certain that there is collusion on the part of Sweden and the U.S or are these just guesses and assumptions, using past experience?

Again, it isn't rape by any standard that we would use in the US. One allegation is sex without a condom. There's your misconduct.

At least one of the two ladies continued to associate with him after the alledged event. Another may have CIA ties.

He did make offers to talk with said investigators, short of going to Sweden.

[kelpdiver 2]

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Something a lot of folks on this board, not necessarily you kelp, have had difficulty with is remembering that Bradley Manning and Julian Assange are not the same person, nor are their situations all that similar.

Indeed- to his harshest enemies, they're both traitors that should be shot...even though Assange isn't even an American.

To many of his greatest fans, they're both fighters for the freedom of information.

in between, saner people see a solider that abandoned his duty and a journalist that took advantage of it.

[normiss 798]

Journalist?

[kelpdiver 2]

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Journalist?

yes.

[normiss 798]

I think real journalists are offended by the comparison.

[masterrig 1]

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In the case of Asange, Does anyone know for certain and have evidence that the rape/sexual assault charges are trumped-up? Does anyone know for certain that there is collusion on the part of Sweden and the U.S or are these just guesses and assumptions, using past experience?

Again, it isn't rape by any standard that we would use in the US. One allegation is sex without a condom. There's your misconduct.

At least one of the two ladies continued to associate with him after the alledged event. Another may have CIA ties.

He did make offers to talk with said investigators, short of going to Sweden.

One story I read referred to it as a charge of 'rape', another referred to it as 'sexual mis-behavior', hell, they can't make-up their minds.
Personally, I think both this arrogant slick needs to be dealt with as should his little buddy in crime.
He may have offered to speak with 'said investigators' on 'his' terms! It ain't Burger King... he doesn't get it his way!


Chuck

[kelpdiver 2]

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One story I read referred to it as a charge of 'rape', another referred to it as 'sexual mis-behavior', hell, they can't make-up their minds.
Personally, I think both this arrogant slick needs to be dealt with as should his little buddy in crime.
He may have offered to speak with 'said investigators' on 'his' terms! It ain't Burger King... he doesn't get it his way!
Chuck

Chuck - your bias is showing a bit. Being an arrogant ass isn't a crime.

[Skyrad 0]

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In the case of Asange, Does anyone know for certain and have evidence that the rape/sexual assault charges are trumped-up? Does anyone know for certain that there is collusion on the part of Sweden and the U.S or are these just guesses and assumptions, using past experience?

Again, it isn't rape by any standard that we would use in the US. One allegation is sex without a condom. There's your misconduct.

At least one of the two ladies continued to associate with him after the alledged event. Another may have CIA ties.

He did make offers to talk with said investigators, short of going to Sweden.

The thing is, the USA hasn't even asked for him. He'd be safer in Sweden because if the USA wanted him and requested his extradition from Sweden under European law both Sweden and the UK would both have to say yes. As it is the UK isn't shy of bunging people on planes to the USA if requested to do so. Personally I'd be happy if he were sent to Ecuador, lets see how he likes the freedom of the press in a tin pot banana republic kissing El Presidentes jack boots. Alternatively throw his sorry arse on a plane to Sweden. Or the USA if they want him, or deport the bugger back to OZ, just kick his sorry arse off the UK.

When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy.
Lucius Annaeus Seneca

[kelpdiver 2]

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I think real journalists are offended by the comparison.

"Real" journalists are a nearly extinct species, but it really doesn't matter what they think.

[masterrig 1]

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One story I read referred to it as a charge of 'rape', another referred to it as 'sexual mis-behavior', hell, they can't make-up their minds.
Personally, I think both this arrogant slick needs to be dealt with as should his little buddy in crime.
He may have offered to speak with 'said investigators' on 'his' terms! It ain't Burger King... he doesn't get it his way!
Chuck

Chuck - your bias is showing a bit. Being an arrogant ass isn't a crime.

Oops! To me, if, there is justifiable, real evidence showing there was in fact, a crime(s) has been committet, the answer is simple...
Otherwise, leave him be.


Chuck

[normiss 798]

Agreed.
However, simply hacking into someone else's secured information and simply copying and pasting is clearly NOT journalism.

[kelpdiver 2]

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Agreed.
However, simply hacking into someone else's secured information and simply copying and pasting is clearly NOT journalism.

Why not? You don't approve because it posted sensitive (but mostly boring) US information. To an extent, I agree with you that in the latter stages wikileaks stopped exercising much editorial direction and just barfed volumes of material. But it's still publishing.

The Examiner chain of newspapers and websites will print just about anything. Slate doesn't have a printed edition, but it's much better example of journalism than most newspapers and magazines today.

[normiss 798]

None of your comparisons are stealing other people's information.

[ManagingPrime 0]

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Agreed.
However, simply hacking into someone else's secured information and simply copying and pasting is clearly NOT journalism.

No, but once that information is disseminated with the intent of it reaching the masses he becomes a journalist. Look at merriam-websters definitions for Journalist and Journalism and some of the synonyms.