Concealed Weapon choice.

[kelpdiver 2]

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Take a look at a SIG P229

http://www.sigsauer.com/CatalogProductDetails/p229.aspx

The barrel is interchanable with .40, 9mm, .357 and .22. Nice if there is a shortage of a specific ammo and gives cheaper options for practices.

I like 9mm myself but that's a different discussion that nobody ever comes out ahead on!

The .40 and .357Sig barrels are interchangeable on the 229, and I believe many (most?) other brands. But I do not believe this extends to the .22 and the 9mm.

Coming from a no CCW land, I think the 229 is a decent call but on the larger side of what people like to carry. You're not giving anything up on handling like you might with the pocket guns. The HK USP45c is also pretty nice.

If I could carry, I'd probably take the HK P7M8, which is compact, though fairly heavy. It is the one I'm most accurate with - combination of the grip safety and the recoil dampening.

[quade 4]

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You use ONE example and paint the whole thing over

If you think that's the only example of a number of trained professionals missing the suspect and hitting other people downrange you're sadly mistaken.

It's not just ONE example, simply the latest and most illustrative of my point.

Look, I'm not saying do or don't carry, I'm saying don't think every bullet is going to hit its target. It's just not realistic anyone is that "awesome" of a shot. In a mass shooting situation, a non-professional should think before taking out his weapon. Chances are, there are a lot of good reasons not to attempt to intervene and some of those reasons may just be standing in the line of fire near the suspect. If trained professionals can't figure that out in the heat of battle then the average non-professional needs to think about it even more.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[DcloudZ 0]

[kelpdiver 2]

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We like being able to take care of ourselves as individuals. It was written into our constitution and some of us still like it that way.

[rushmc 23]

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We like being able to take care of ourselves as individuals. It was written into our constitution and some of us still like it that way.

[DanG 1]

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It is the same reason liberal progressives hate our constitution

Whatever. You're just sounding silly.

- Dan G

[rushmc 23]

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It is the same reason liberal progressives hate our constitution

Whatever. You're just sounding silly.

Tweaked a nerve huh......

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[DanG 1]

Actually, yes. I love our constitution, and volunteered to give my life for it. It pisses me off to be accused of hating it, or wanting to destroy it.

- Dan G

[rushmc 23]

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Actually, yes. I love our constitution, and volunteered to give my life for it. It pisses me off to be accused of hating it, or wanting to destroy it.

Anyone who says it is a living breathing doc wishes to destroy it. I do not know if that is your opinion

And I thank you for your service
I have the greatest respect for any and all who have done this. No matter of current political leanings

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[Arvoitus 1]

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Question from a complete gun noob,
Why is it that you actually need to carry concealed?
Is it for future work, or just walking around?

The world is full of reasons to carry:

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=6c6_1347283633

Your rights end where my feelings begin.

[stayhigh 2]

which state issue concealed weapon carry license??? that citizen can actually obtain??

Bernie Sanders for President 2016

[firemedic 7]

Flyboy, you're gettting a lot of suggestions so I'll make mine. Consider a Para Ordinance if you like a 1911. I have a Wart Hog in .45 Its fairly compact and has a 10 round capacity.

[rushmc 23]

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which state issue concealed weapon carry license??? that citizen can actually obtain??

This should give you the info

http://marylandshallissue.org/get-informed/shall-issue-maps/

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[davjohns 1]

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We like being able to take care of ourselves as individuals. It was written into our constitution and some of us still like it that way.

[wolfriverjoe 1,523]

Well, I'm a bit late to the party. The usual suspects are arguing gun rights and the Constitution.

My $0.02 (worth about that much too )

Caliber - 9mm isn't all that bad. Some of the high end defensive stuff penetrates and expands well.
40 is overrated IMO. It's biggest problem is pressure. It generates pressures very similar to a full power 357 Mag. It tears up guns. The little Glocks (small and really small) don't last very long in the 40 cal versions.
45 has its advantages. But you lose capacity, and have a fair amount of recoil, especially in the smaller guns.
Even the lowly 380 has its place. The high end defensive ammo performs reasonably well, for it's size, and the guns can be pretty tiny.

The NRA mag had an article on penetration and expansion of various ammo brands/types last month. It didn't make any conclusions, just test result. It has a lot of good info.

And as was quoted above, the wound channel from the bullet is what causes the injury. 45 is better than 9mm, but only by 0.01 inch (.355 vs .451) what really counts is shot placement.
A smaller caliber that you can hit with beats a larger caliber that you can't.

Guns - The Glock, Springfield XD, S&W M&P are all pretty similar. Longer "squishy" trigger pull, reliable and durable (except the Glock 40s). I recently saw the XD 3.3 in 45 (the really tiny one that's just out). It's not too bad to shoot, and is quite concealable.

1911s - My personal preferrence. I like Kimber, but you pay for it. You can pay more for some of the customs or semi customs (Wilson, and similar). Springfield makes a nice 1911 that won't break the bank. So does Para-Ordanance.
The "Compact" (Officer's Model sized) 1911s are pretty small. I compared a Kimber Ultra against that XD 3.3 and the only thing that was bigger was the grip length, and only by an inch or so. Admittely, it's grip length that pushes your shirt out and makes a lump, but the Officer's is still pretty small for a 45.
One issue with the 1911 is that it is intended to be carried "cocked and locked." That's how Browning intended it. A lot of cops can't carry 1911s because they aren't professional enough to be trusted carrying that way (many departments forbid it).
Carrying C&L means extra training, primarily in getting the safety off as the gun comes up, but also in resetting the safety before you reholster and in reholstering safely. If you are willing to put in the time and effort, the reward is a trigger pull that is very nice.

My experience is that concealablity is affected far more by width than any other dimension. Some of the double stack Glocks (even the littler ones) seem to be harder to hide than a 1911 (even a bigger one). You have to choose your clothes and holster well, but I've been pretty amazed at how big of a 1911 (a full sized Government model) will disappear under a sweatshirt. And at how easy it is to spot the lump of a Glock or XD double stack, even under a fairly loose shirt.

As was suggested, your best bet is to try a bunch of different ones. Some ranges offer rentals, others have a core group of shooters who might be willing to let you try their guns out.
You have to find what you like and what you are comfortable with and what works best for...

(wait for it)... you.

"There are NO situations which do not call for a French Maid outfit." Lucky McSwervy

"~ya don't GET old by being weak & stupid!" - Airtwardo

[DcloudZ 0]

Snide comments with no logical support?

Feel free to study the difference in gun related deaths/violence between the United States and Canada. (Accounting for the difference in population of course)

"Better to have a short life that is full of what you like doing than a long life spent in a miserable way." -Alan Watts

[brenthutch 444]

The concealed weapon of my choice is the brain. I have used tools, from a Rugar p-85 to the front bumper of a car to, my j-boots, forearms, the opponent’s collar, a triangle choke, and a pure punking of a threat. (At the time I had a broken back and would have been destroyed by a cub scout). It is fun to talk about accuracy, firepower, concealability etc. But the real answer is between your ears.

[toolbox 0]

Check into the Para USA (formerly Para-ordnance) line of double stack 1911 45acp pistols.
I own a Para double stack 45 and it is only slightly thicker than my single stack 45 but holds 15 rounds compared to 8 rounds in the single stack.
The Para has been 100% dependable and as accurate as any 1911 I've shot so far,and I've shot alot of them.
If you use some +P 230gr hollow point rounds in 45acp you could really do some carnage on a human body.
But like they say "shot placement is king"

[flyboy8501 0]

I'm not saying a mistake is impossible, but using good judgement has always been a skill of mine. You can not take that one incendent and use if against people that carry guns. That's like saying all skydivers are just like DB Cooper...

[flyboy8501 0]

I agree with your point here, I miss my target as well sometimes, But keep your eye on the target and when the opportunity arrises that has the least chance of collateral damage, take the shot. And I know, say a bank is getting robbed by several people, don't intervene cause you will get yourself killed. I'm aware that just cause you have a gun, you are not superman.

[flyboy8501 0]

Ofcourse it was written 225 years ago, it has been ammended with our changing society and the 2nd addentment still stands. So there you go.

[flyboy8501 0]

Brother, that's the sad reality of America, Not to many people love it as we do.

[flyboy8501 0]

You look at the gun related deaths, but have you even considered looking up the amount of lives saved by guns? I can say the same for cars and baseball bats, shit skydiving killed about 50 people last year maybe we should ban that? But what about the millions of jumps made? Who cares, people died.... See my point? Look at both sides before you make such statements.

[steve1 5]

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It is fun to talk about accuracy, firepower, concealability etc. But the real answer is between your ears.

Well said! Having the right weapon can be critical, but so can being aware of a threat, and having a plan in your head. You must also have the courage and determination to implement that plan, if needed.

Colonel Grossman was nominated for a Pulitzer Prize for his book "On Killing". Most of his book discusses the origins of violence in America. If you haven't already read it, I'd recommend it. Grossman is a Psychologist, and former Army Ranger. He once taught at West Point.

According to Grossman, people can be categorized into three groups. Either Wolves, Sheep, or Sheep Dogs. The wolves are the bad guys. People who prey on others. They may be socio-paths, or nut cases who have no remorse when they kill you or hurt your family. Let's face it, we live in dangerous times. The situation is not getting better.

The sheep are those who think the world is a safe, wonderful place, filled with good people. They deny that there are evil doers in the world, those who might want to take your life, or hurt you bad. The sheep have rose colored glasses on. They do not like anyone who has a weapon and is willing to use it (for even defensive purposes). They feel there are no need for weapons. After all the government will keep you safe. It is easier to stay in this state of denial than take the time and effort to look at the real dangers in the world.

Then their are the sheep dogs. The military and law enforcement are examples of sheep dogs. Since they have teeth and are prepared to use them, they are not trusted by the sheep. Yet the role of sheep dogs is to keep the sheep safe. They would give up their lives in protection of the sheep.

Much of the public is becoming increasingly aware that we live in a world filled with dangerous people in it. They are not willing to become victims. They are not satisfied to remain a sheep. They buy weapons, because they are thinking people, and they want to be able to protect themselves and their families if threatened. They know that law enforcement or the government is not always there when you need them for help.

Wouldn't it be awful if your family needed help, and you were unprepared....

So, the question is, what are you? I think America needs more sheep dogs.

[matthewcline 0]

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The concealed weapon of my choice is the brain. I have used tools, from a Rugar p-85 to the front bumper of a car to, my j-boots, forearms, the opponent’s collar, a triangle choke, and a pure punking of a threat. (At the time I had a broken back and would have been destroyed by a cub scout). It is fun to talk about accuracy, firepower, concealability etc. But the real answer is between your ears.

"My mind is the weapon, my body, is but one tool"

This thread speaks of when we need to use a particular type of tool.

Matt

An Instructors first concern is student safety.
So, start being safe, first!!!