Oregon

[tkhayes 348]

http://news.yahoo.com/oregon-mall-shooting-man-kills-2-self-rampage-004815715--abc-news-topstories.html

Oregon is a concealed state right? Where were all the carrying people and why did they let this happen? I mean 147000 permits in Oregon and 2.8M people, that is just over 5%.

If there was 1000 adults at the mall, then probably 50 of them had guns.

I mean a well-trained individual exercising their constitutionally god-given rights to carry a gun in public should have had no trouble taking on a 'teenager in a hockey mask' I would think

Or maybe they were all just running for their lives like everyone else.

But I know, I know - we don't have a gun problem....

[Gravitymaster 0]

Perhaps the CCW permit holders were not personally threatened and given events like the Trayvon Martin incident, chose to flee rather than confront.

[tkhayes 348]

Maybe Oregon has a 'flee your ground' law?

[rushmc 23]

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Maybe Oregon has a 'flee your ground' law?

So I guess in your world there are only cowboys or pussy's

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[rushmc 23]

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Perhaps the CCW permit holders were not personally threatened and given events like the Trayvon Martin incident, chose to flee rather than confront.

Or maybe the mall has a no gun policy that made it a free kill zone for this nut

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[Gravitymaster 0]

You do understand that liberals like you, with your hatred of guns and for the people that carry them, have made it much less likely that someone would use their gun to save your life, don't you?

I live in an open carry State but very few actually do carry this way because it freaks the gun-o-phobes out and they call the Police. This causes open carry gun owners to seek concealed permits. When I took my concealed weapons class, we were told that if we draw our guns, be prepared to be harrassed. If we ever discharge our guns, even if our own life is in danger, expect to be arrested and spend $50K-$200K on legal fees even if found "not guilty"

I would not draw a gun to protect anyone but myself and my immediate family because of the atmosphere the Gun-O-Phobes have fostered.

[Gravitymaster 0]

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Perhaps the CCW permit holders were not personally threatened and given events like the Trayvon Martin incident, chose to flee rather than confront.

Or maybe the mall has a no gun policy that made it a free kill zone for this nut

That's also very likely. If they do, then hopefully, the Mall will be sued for having such a policy. Wouldn't that just cause the Gun-O-Phobes to have an aneurism?

[tkhayes 348]

Clearly demonstrating how little you know about me. I actually own 13 guns I have no hatred for them

I have a problem with idiots owning guns and untrained idiots owning guns

And given the number of military police forces security forces police tactical squads the argument that my personal safety is somehow in jeopardy because I have a problem with idiots owning guns is absurd

[Gravitymaster 0]

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Clearly demonstrating how little you know about me. I actually own 13 guns I have no hatred for them

I have a problem with idiots owning guns and untrained idiots owning guns

And given the number of military police forces security forces police tactical squads the argument that my personal safety is somehow in jeopardy because I have a problem with idiots owning guns is absurd

Oh, that's right, you and Kallend have some magic crystal ball or sociological formula that allows you the superntural ability to know in advance who is going on a killing rampage. And barring that, would rather trample on the Constitution if it "just saves one life".

[tkhayes 348]

Sounds like I'm getting under your skin. is that an indication that maybe my point is better than yours?

By the way I never said anything about magic crystal balls. What I did say sarcastically, is America doesn't have a gun problem

[GeorgiaDon 362]

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Perhaps the CCW permit holders were not personally threatened and given events like the Trayvon Martin incident, chose to flee rather than confront.

Well of course, because it takes a PhD to be able to tell the difference between a guy in camo and a mask who is carrying a firearm in a shopping mall and actually shooting at people, and a guy in a hoodie walking through a townhouse complex. There's just so many similarities, they might as well be twins! Everyone knows that hoodies are way more scary than "assault rifles" (whatever those are).

Don

_____________________________________
Tolerance is the cost we must pay for our adventure in liberty. (Dworkin, 1996)
“Education is not filling a bucket, but lighting a fire.” (Yeats)

[Gravitymaster 0]

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Perhaps the CCW permit holders were not personally threatened and given events like the Trayvon Martin incident, chose to flee rather than confront.

Well of course, because it takes a PhD to be able to tell the difference between a guy in camo and a mask who is carrying a firearm in a shopping mall and actually shooting at people, and a guy in a hoodie walking through a townhouse complex. There's just so many similarities, they might as well be twins! Everyone knows that hoodies are way more scary than "assault rifles" (whatever those are).

Don

Your failure to understand is at times, breathtaking. Talk about missing the point.

[Gravitymaster 0]

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Sounds like I'm getting under your skin. is that an indication that maybe my point is better than yours?

By the way I never said anything about magic crystal balls. What I did say sarcastically, is America doesn't have a gun problem

What gets under my skin is do-gooders who want to impose their fears on the rest of us and then are amazed at the consequences. These people likely died because of the atmoshere fostered by the anti-gun, anti-Second Amendment nuts. And now you complain about the inaction of concealed weapons permit holders? Are you freakin serious???

[dmcoco84 5]

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I have a problem with idiots owning guns

You should turn in your firearms then...

[GeorgiaDon 362]

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When I took my concealed weapons class, we were told that if we draw our guns, be prepared to be harrassed.

Depends on the context, I would think. When I lived in Tucson, I had a few experiences where someone drew a gun, or used the threat of a gun, to harass me. In one case, a car almost ran me over in a crosswalk, I had to literally jump clear to avoid being hit. I gave the car the "bird" as it roared past; only then did it squeal to a stop, the driver stepped out, pointed a handgun at me, said "Bang, you're dead", then got back in the car and took off. Another time, I was walking my dogs a couple of blocks from my house, and passed a house with a fenced yard and several dogs that started barking loudly at my dogs. Some guy came out of the house with a rifle and yelled at me for "upsetting his dogs". I replied that I was just walking my dogs on the street, as I have a right to do, and he held up the rifle and said if he ever saw me again on "his" street "I would regret it". So don't tell me that gun owners are all nice law abiding types who would never use their guns to threaten or intimidate, they're just misunderstood and we should always let them be. "Harassment" can be a two-way street.

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If we ever discharge our guns, even if our own life is in danger, expect to be arrested and spend $50K-$200K on legal fees even if found "not guilty"

That's not how it seems to work here in Georgia. Quite the opposite, actually, judging from the news stories.

Still, it might be a good thing for people to have it in their minds that they will have a lot of explaining to do if they discharge their gun, for they should. If your explanation holds up to examination based on the evidence, you're good to go. If not, then there will be consequences. How can it be otherwise? Do you really think it would be a good idea to permit people to shoot someone, and if they claimed "I felt threatened" just let it go and have no examination of whether or not they actually had reasonable justification for their actions? Carrying is a serious responsibility, you can't just say "oops, too bad so sad" when you've just injured or killed someone who may have been innocent of any wrongdoing.

Don

_____________________________________
Tolerance is the cost we must pay for our adventure in liberty. (Dworkin, 1996)
“Education is not filling a bucket, but lighting a fire.” (Yeats)

[dmcoco84 5]

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Or maybe they were all just running for their lives like everyone else.

Just because you have a concealed carry permit, doesn't mean your pistol is attached to your body... people do go places where they feel more or less concerned about carrying.

A mall near me, when I was a kid... would easily go to during the day. But you would never catch me there at night.

If I were an adult and absolutely had to go at night... I would have been carrying. During the day, not so much. Could an issue occur during the day too... Yup.

[RonD1120 62]

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I have a problem with idiots owning guns

You should turn in your firearms then...

Best one I've read in a long time.

Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them.

[Gravitymaster 0]

Non-Police citizens who carry weapons are not law enforcement. They have no duty or obligation to protect you. When they are threatened by society with harrassment for drawing their guns, then don't complain when they walk away.

Fortunately, in the States where you and I live, there is a more sane attitude towards gun ownership. In other States, not so much.

As I have said, there's no way I would draw a gun to protect anyone but myself and my family. I would suggest that those who thinks I am responsible for their safety, should consider protecting themselves.

[GeorgiaDon 362]

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Non-Police citizens who carry weapons are not law enforcement. They have no duty or obligation to protect you. When they are threatened by society with harrassment for drawing their guns, then don't complain when they walk away.

Fortunately, in the States where you and I live, there is a more sane attitude towards gun ownership. In other States, not so much.

As I have said, there's no way I would draw a gun to protect anyone but myself and my family. I would suggest that those who thinks I am responsible for their safety, should consider protecting themselves.

Nothing here that I disagree with at all.

Don

_____________________________________
Tolerance is the cost we must pay for our adventure in liberty. (Dworkin, 1996)
“Education is not filling a bucket, but lighting a fire.” (Yeats)

[rhaig 0]

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Clearly demonstrating how little you know about me. I actually own 13 guns I have no hatred for them

I have a problem with idiots owning guns and untrained idiots owning guns

And given the number of military police forces security forces police tactical squads the argument that my personal safety is somehow in jeopardy because I have a problem with idiots owning guns is absurd

so had there been a CCW holder who shot this guy down, your post would have been about a "self-proclaimed, untrained rambo who felt the need to take on a gunman and endanger others"

hey look!! TROLL!

--
Rob

[rhaig 0]

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Non-Police citizens who carry weapons are not law enforcement. They have no duty or obligation to protect you.

Everyone should note that law enforcement has no constitutional obligation to protect you either. (old news really... just a reminder) http://www.nytimes.com/2005/06/28/politics/28scotus.html

--
Rob

[rushmc 23]

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Sounds like I'm getting under your skin. is that an indication that maybe my point is better than yours?

By the way I never said anything about magic crystal balls. What I did say sarcastically, is America doesn't have a gun problem

Looks like you are getting owned by him to me

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[Southern_Man 0]

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Non-Police citizens who carry weapons are not law enforcement. They have no duty or obligation to protect you.

Neither do police.

"What if there were no hypothetical questions?"

[normiss 803]

Nor do many of them maintain any level of knowledge and skill in firearms.

Those fat fucks around here they call cops....yea...I'd never count on a 300 pound bowling ball to help me. In any way.

[lawrocket 3]

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Perhaps the CCW permit holders were not personally threatened and given events like the Trayvon Martin incident, chose to flee rather than confront.

Or maybe the mall has a no gun policy that made it a free kill zone for this nut

I understand that Clackamas Town Center does, indeed, call itself a "gun free" zone and has a history of enforcing it.

My wife is hotter than your wife.