Combat veteran with "infidel" tattoo asked to leave Florida DZ

[wmw999 2,439]

Now how do you know that it was 6-Flags Fiesta Texas . Isn't that profiling or something?

Wendy P.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[Andy9o8 2]

any generic wetback will do.

[normiss 798]

[Zenister 0]

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I could point out that I am doing it, currently in Afghanistan, and have been for almost 16 years now but that would only serve to reinforce the idea that the jumpers veteran status is somehow relevant to this issue. Its not. Military service is not a free license to be a jerk.

This. As a veteran this guy is an embarrassment no matter what hes been through. Nothing justifies his blatant self promotion or entitled attitude. He certainly wasn't trained to be this kind of jackass and it reflects poorly on everyone who remembers what professional means.

____________________________________
Those who fail to learn from the past are simply Doomed.

[Bolas 5]

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A better example would be a black person who tattoos the Hebrew word for "go holocaust!" on himself. Other blacks could not read it - but Jews could.

And a Godwin rule violation to boot.

Replace "go holocaust" with "(derogatory term for non believer or black person)"

Stupidity if left untreated is self-correcting
If ya can't be good, look good, if that fails, make 'em laugh.

[grimmie 186]

Other veterans are speaking about it here...
http://www.shadowspear.com/vb/threads/eddie-bryant-adventures-of-a-broken-soldier.17699/

[Bolas 5]

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I could point out that I am doing it, currently in Afghanistan, and have been for almost 16 years now but that would only serve to reinforce the idea that the jumpers veteran status is somehow relevant to this issue. Its not. Military service is not a free license to be a jerk.

This. As a veteran this guy is an embarrassment no matter what hes been through. Nothing justifies his blatant self promotion or entitled attitude. He certainly wasn't trained to be this kind of jackass and it reflects poorly on everyone who remembers what professional means.

And Qatari visiting military should have thicker skins. They're the ones that should be more professional, as they're still officially representing their country on foreign soil.

Stupidity if left untreated is self-correcting
If ya can't be good, look good, if that fails, make 'em laugh.

[shattenjager 0]

Maybe my English is not good like yours, I said that a person was there and I heard the same story from other friends who were there.

The mind is like a parachute: If you don't open it, it doesn't work.

[airdvr 210]

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attitude.

http://liberallogic101.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/03/liberal-logic-101-27.jpg

Back atcha

Please don't dent the planet.

Destinations by Roxanne

[labrys 0]

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Back atcha

Fail!

Owned by Remi #?

[Zenister 0]

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Other veterans are speaking about it her e...
http://www.shadowspear.com/vb/threads/eddie-bryant-adventures-of-a-broken-soldier.17699/

Further illustrating how the standard of professionalism has fallen among the US Military.

Were the Quatris being asses? Absolutely, but I don't hold them to the same level of professionalism, they are not US and don't represent the traditions and standards of the US Military I belonged to and support daily. This guy is an embarrassment. Suck it up cupcake.

____________________________________
Those who fail to learn from the past are simply Doomed.

[sooperswooper 0]

I am not american but I respect America and the freedom that this country is based upon more than you.

[jgoose71 0]

I can't believe I read this whole thread up to this point. I feel dumber for it.

What gets me about this whole thing is a group of guys from Qatar come to the US and expect us to bend over backwards to kiss their ass.

If Everything we do is so offensive (Tattoo's, allow our women to skydive, eat pork) why the hell did they come here? Why do they get to walk into our house and tell us what to do?

Right now I am in Afghanistan, and I'll tell you what, I don't get to make demands on them in their house. This double standard blows...

I understand that a private business has the right to refuse service to anyone, however, if it was me and they made the request my response would have been:

"No, I'm not going to ask him to cover it up, welcome to America."

It's no secret we cherish our freedoms. If you need a more controlled environment, don't come here. UAE has a very nice drop zone I hear, and it's closer too...

"There is an art, it says, or, rather, a knack to flying. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss."
Life, the Universe, and Everything

[sooperswooper 0]

U r 100% right!!! I can't believe that people can't see this

[Abuaeden 0]

Well, I can see this topic has been sufficiently beat into the ground. I've been lurking around the forums off and on for a few years now.. this topic was the first that prompted me to join the conversation because it dealt with so many things that are relevant in my life.. Arabic, tattoos (I have a couple Arabic language tattoos myself), skydiving and the Army.

On a happier note, I should be home, back in the States, in a little over a month. I had already planned a vacation with the family down in the Orlando area in June. I'll be staying in Davenport and I just checked.. SLW is less than 20 miles away! I had already planned to spend at least an afternoon at a Florida DZ and it would be awesome if anyone from this thread, whether we agreed or not, wanted to meet up there for some tasty beverages after the beer light.

-zack

[labrys 0]

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I understand that a private business has the right to refuse service to anyone, however, if it was me and they made the request my response would have been:

"No, I'm not going to ask him to cover it up, welcome to America."

That's fine. You totally have that right. What I see as the primary issue is that this guy is making a huge fuss and trashing a DZ very publicly for kicking him out without any evidence that they actually did.

Owned by Remi #?

[champu 1]

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Heres the part what I still dont understand: If a non islam believer willingly tattoos this mocking word to his skin, why exactly is this suddenly considered as an insult towards muslims? Shouldnt it still be an insult towards the person wearing the tattoo him self?

If an african american were to tattoo the N-word to his skin, would this also be considered as an insult towards the white supremacists?

Perhaps someone could explain this to me in a simple way? Thanks!

In your example you're talking about black people and white supremacists. The Muslims in this story are not analogs to white supremacists, more simply ordinary white people. In fact, I doubt radical Islamists (the better supremacist analog) would take offense to the tattoo.

I am not an Arabic linguist, however I think the connotation is more akin to a black person going around saying all white people are white supremacists. I'm not sure how well that analogy works though because as a white person I'm impervious to being offended.

Ok, I think I understand what you are saying.

So in other words, as I now understand it, the word Kafir originally was a mocking word for all non islam believers, but nowadays the majority of muslims have seceded from such thinking and therefore if a non muslim calls him self as a kafir, the majority of muslims think that he still percieves all muslims seeing him as a kafir? (which they find offensive, since they dont see him as a kafir?)

Roughly, yeah. But, while I think this analogy is close, the word "nigger" and "kafir" as used by black people and non-muslims respectively, still don't quite have the same connotation. If the black guy was going around unprovoked getting right in white people's faces saying, "oh, what, I guess I'm just a nigger to you, is that it?" that would be pretty offensive behavior. If that was framed in the context of ongoing black on white violence, then I think you have your analogy.

I think the trap here is feeling like the muslims who are offended simply don't wish to be reminded that there are Islamists who see non-Muslims as infidels who should be killed. That would be a more selfish response, but I don't think that's what's happening. Why is this trap easy to fall into? Because if a white person says that a black person behaving as above makes them uncomfortable, they're told that they should have thought of that before they had white grandparents.

And Bill, Wendy, Andy... Ville and I can read Abuaeden's posts, and I think we both appreciate them... but we're trying to talk about the evolution of the word, we got the "look, it's bad now okay" message.

[jgoose71 0]

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I understand that a private business has the right to refuse service to anyone, however, if it was me and they made the request my response would have been:

"No, I'm not going to ask him to cover it up, welcome to America."

That's fine. You totally have that right. What I see as the primary issue is that this guy is making a huge fuss and trashing a DZ very publicly for kicking him out without any evidence that they actually did.

There is a bunch of he-said-she-said in this case, but either way the Vet was offended.

The DZ owner was put in a tough spot. Offend the Muslim visitors, or offend the American Vet. It sucks, but sometimes you have to make tough decisions. Sometimes those decisions have consequences.

Not all choices can be made to have the same consequences as choosing between chocolate and strawberry ice cream.

Knowing that we are in America and not the middle east, I would have chose differently...

"There is an art, it says, or, rather, a knack to flying. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss."
Life, the Universe, and Everything

[billvon 2,989]

>but either way the Vet was offended.

So were the Qataris. They went to the DZO. The vet just stormed off. His choice.

[Remster 30]

Have fun there! Betty is good people.

Remster

[airdvr 210]

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>but either way the Vet was offended.

So were the Qataris. They went to the DZO. The vet just stormed off. His choice.

I see you're swallowing that version. I have enough experience to know there are three sides to every story.

Please don't dent the planet.

Destinations by Roxanne

[jgoose71 0]

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>but either way the Vet was offended.

So were the Qataris. They went to the DZO. The vet just stormed off. His choice.

Did I say it wasn't? Everyone had a choice in the matter that day. The only choice I was truly questioning was the DZ owners.

But if you want me to question everyone's choice that day, here I go....

The Qatar group, knowing how we are and how we behave in general in the United states should have never came here if their feelings were going to be hurt at every turn....

The Vet should have said, "no I'm not covering it up, and no I'm going to continue to jump because I'm having a good time and not hurting anyone" and made the DZ owner physically throw him out and create a scene so there would have been witnesses...

Better?

"There is an art, it says, or, rather, a knack to flying. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss."
Life, the Universe, and Everything

[billvon 2,989]

>The Vet should have said, "no I'm not covering it up, and no I'm going to continue to
>jump because I'm having a good time and not hurting anyone"

Agreed, that would have been a good choice too.

> and made the DZ owner physically throw him out and create a scene so there would
> have been witnesses...

Or, more likely, the DZO would have sighed and said "OK, I'll talk to the Qataris again."

[BMFin 0]

Or how about if he said,

I got the tattoo, when I was taken as a POW in Iraq. The insurgents branded me with this label. Perhaps I should drag my sorry kafir ass away form your sight..

That might have led the conversation to a whole new level

[jgoose71 0]

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>The Vet should have said, "no I'm not covering it up, and no I'm going to continue to
>jump because I'm having a good time and not hurting anyone"

Agreed, that would have been a good choice too.

> and made the DZ owner physically throw him out and create a scene so there would
> have been witnesses...

Or, more likely, the DZO would have sighed and said "OK, I'll talk to the Qataris again."

Maybe... As Airdvr pointed out, it all depends on who's story you believe. There is a lot of he-said-she-said here.

"There is an art, it says, or, rather, a knack to flying. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss."
Life, the Universe, and Everything