Ask your Doctor if Zohydro is right for you

[jclalor 12]

I never heard of this until today, I'm sure it's going to help some, but I've known way too many people who have had their lives destroyed by pills.


http://www.myfoxtwincities.com/story/24823764/minn-mom-hopes-to-halt-hydrocodone-only-painkiller

[RonD1120 62]

  jclalor

I never heard of this until today, I'm sure it's going to help some, but I've known way too many people who have had their lives destroyed by pills.


http://www.myfoxtwincities.com/story/24823764/minn-mom-hopes-to-halt-hydrocodone-only-painkiller

It's medical science and big pharma. We justify addiction to relieve pain. We justify tax increases to provide programs to treat addiction. It's all about the money and trust in the government.

Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them.

[quade 4]

You know, it could be that it's an attempt to treat people with a debilitating amount of pain.

It doesn't have to be a conspiracy.

If you think all pain killers are a big pharma / government conspiracy, then I invite you to get a root canal without any.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[RonD1120 62]

  quade

You know, it could be that it's an attempt to treat people with a debilitating amount of pain.

It doesn't have to be a conspiracy.

If you think all pain killers are a big pharma / government conspiracy, then I invite you to get a root canal without any.

jclalor is the one concerned. I recognize it for what it is. I earned a living working in government funded drug treatment programs.

Back in the day, you drank a glass of whiskey and bit down hard on a stick. We were tougher then.

Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them.

[Stumpy 284]

  RonD1120

We were tougher then.

Often deader too.

Never try to eat more than you can lift

[Nightingale 0]

I'm really glad that a version of hydrocodone is coming out without the tylenol in it, because taking tylenol is really bad for your liver, and it limits what other medications someone can take, because almost every cold medicine has tylenol in it! The only reason the tylenol was put in there was to prevent people from abusing it, and it didn't work, and the tylenol is poisoning people with legitimate pain problems, often without them realizing it until the damage has been done. If this is prescribed with caution, I could see it being a good thing. They've had this medicine for years in Europe. The doses it's available in are similar to the doses already available for oxycodone. Since oxycodone is already around and has been for decades, I don't see this version of hydrocodone hitting the market to be a huge risk.

[DanG 1]

  Quote

Back in the day, you drank a glass of whiskey and bit down hard on a stick. We were tougher then.

Please regale us with a tale of when you did this! I'd love to hear one.

- Dan G

[champu 1]

  RonD1120

***If you think all pain killers are a big pharma / government conspiracy, then I invite you to get a root canal without any.

Back in the day, you drank a glass of whiskey and bit down hard on a stick. We were tougher then.

Wait, wouldn't the stick get in the dentist's way?

[jakee 1,563]

  Quote

Back in the day, you drank a glass of whiskey and bit down hard on a stick.

Doesn't that make it more difficult for the dentist to get at your teeth?

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[quade 4]

  RonD1120

Back in the day, you drank a glass of whiskey and bit down hard on a stick. We were tougher then.

Because, you know, whiskey isn't a pain killer nor is it an addictive substance subject to abuse.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[kelpdiver 2]

  Nightingale

The only reason the tylenol was put in there was to prevent people from abusing it, and it didn't work,

how was it supposed to accomplish that?

I was pretty uneasy with the amount I was getting via Norco when I had my bike crash.

[Nightingale 0]

  kelpdiver

*** The only reason the tylenol was put in there was to prevent people from abusing it, and it didn't work,

how was it supposed to accomplish that?

I was pretty uneasy with the amount I was getting via Norco when I had my bike crash.

I believe the thought was that adding the tylenol to it would make it difficult to islolate the opiate if addicts wanted to inject it or inhale it, which is why Vicodin and Vicoprofen are schedule III (there was a proposal to move them to Schedule II but I don't recall if it happened), and oxycodone and Zohydro are Schedule II. In reality, I think they didn't prevent any abuse, the addicts just got smarter and found ways to separate the drug or just took oxy instead, and the FDA ended up poisoning a lot of legitimate pain patients with tylenol.

[lawrocket 3]

It's interesting. There are people out there wracked with pain who are dealing with liver failure and the like from oral pain medications containing acetaminophen. Ever see someone with trigeminal neuralgia? People who would prefer to simply cut their faces off that live another day.

On the other hand, you have addicts. People who get addicted to pain meds. This doesn't even necessarily involve someone who is crushing them and snorting them, etc. Simply people who have pain meds and can't stop them.

Thinking of what drugs actually kill people. Cocaine? Weed? Meth? These drugs really don't kill people. When we find out what people OD on it's usually opiates, either through injection of more frequently through OD on pills or adverse reactions to polypharmacy.

So what to do? Get someone with chronic pancreatitis and deny the person perhaps the only effective analgesia because others abuse the substance? Or do we say that the stuff is too dangerous and ban it because of the harm to society?

It's a very tough issue. And I think the medical profession itself has to ask the questions. How many doctors will even be willing to prescribe the stuff? I can be fairly certain that if I was circling the drain with pancreatic cancer, I'd want something to take away the pain...

Anything.

My wife is hotter than your wife.

[oldwomanc6 60]

Agreed!

I never understood the problem with prescribing what ever the level of meds it takes to keep a terminal (or even very) ill patient in as little pain as possible.

lisa
WSCR 594
FB 1023
CBDB 9

[Nightingale 0]

One of my nurse friends told me that "A patient's pain is what they say it is." She said that doctors at her hospital use that philosophy because they'd rather risk giving drugs to a junkie (who will find them elsewhere if not at the hospital) than undermedicating or totally failing to medicate a patient with legitimate pain. They understand that this is what happens when you fail to appropriately manage pain: http://headaches.about.com/od/advocacyissues/a/er_suicide.htm

[SkyDekker 1,465]

  Quote

I can be fairly certain that if I was circling the drain with pancreatic cancer, I'd want something to take away the pain...

In all fairness, pain management in pallative care is different from other pain management. Don't really care about addicition issues for the terminally ill.

[winsor 236]

  SkyDekker

  Quote

I can be fairly certain that if I was circling the drain with pancreatic cancer, I'd want something to take away the pain...

In all fairness, pain management in pallative care is different from other pain management. Don't really care about addicition issues for the terminally ill.

Agreed.

My mother mentioned the use of Diamorphine (heroin) in the hospice where she worked.

It turns out that the appeal of diacetyl morphine from the illicit standpoint has nothing to do with its addictive qualities. As an addition reaction, turning morphine into heroin produces more weight on a molecule by molecule basis - morphine will yield over 10% more when converted to heroin. The real appeal is that heroin is 6 to 8 times as potent as morphine. If someone is going to pay $10 to get a serious nod on, it will take a grain of morphine (60mg), but 10 mg of heroin will do the trick.

Oddly enough, this is the advantage from an end of life standpoint. When faced with terminal pain, one can up the dose with morphine to the extent that the load on the liver and kidneys is significant. You have to up the dose another sixfold before heroin shows the same level of hepatoxicity.

It is recommended that one stay away from most of these things unless death is imminent and inevitable (okay, death is inevitable for all of us, but I'm talking about the untimely variant). One of the reasons these drugs have clinical utility is that, under their influence, things that are generally worrisome (such as being maimed and/or dying) are not as big of a deal.

It is recommended that one avoid permanent solutions to temporary problems, and becoming dependent upon narcotics has too great a potential to become a permanent issue.

YMMV.


BSBD,

Winsor

[lawrocket 3]

  SkyDekker

  Quote

I can be fairly certain that if I was circling the drain with pancreatic cancer, I'd want something to take away the pain...

In all fairness, pain management in pallative care is different from other pain management. Don't really care about addicition issues for the terminally ill.

Of course it is. Problem is that there are people not wanting this drug available to anyone because of its potency. Meaning that the person in need of palliative care ain't gonna get it. The concern is addiction issues for everyone else.

This worries me. A policy that says those who need it can't have it because those who don't need it will get it.

Note: it's not like drug availability isn't its own political drama. The DEA sets limits each year on how much of a drug can be manufactured. Then they leave it to drug companies to decide how much generic versus label brands to be produced. Leading to shortages of the less profitable meds. Add to that production problems, shipping problems, issues with precursor ingredients, and frequent shortages of everything from Adderall to antivirals to Dextrose solutions have shortages.

We see the DEA limiting production of drugs like Adderall. Meaning there's a scarcity for those who need it. I don't like that at all.

My wife is hotter than your wife.

[SkyDekker 1,465]

  Quote

Problem is that there are people not wanting this drug available to anyone because of its potency. Meaning that the person in need of palliative care ain't gonna get it.

Is there a need for this drug in palliative care?

Or will it go the same route as Oxy? At first it wasn't prescribed as easily and quickly. Reserved for the more serious pain management issues. These days it seems like it is to the go to drug for prescription pain medication.