Voter issues? Nah, they dont exist do they......

[turtlespeed 221]

tkhayes

wrong, I never said it does not exist. and have never said that, but I have in fact consistently maintained that it does not exist to any statically significant amount.

Something similar to AGW.

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[tkhayes 348]

Not similar at all to AGW but at least yours is an example to support my case

There is a lot of data and peer reviewed scientific evidence to support AGW.

There is little data or peer reviewed scientific evidence to support voter fraud.

Nice try though.

[turtlespeed 221]

tkhayes

Not similar at all to AGW but at least yours is an example to support my case

There is a lot of data and peer reviewed scientific evidence to support AGW.

There is little data or peer reviewed scientific evidence to support voter fraud.

Nice try though.

It all depends on what you consider "Reviewed"

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[kelpdiver 2]

turtlespeed

It all depends on what you consider "Reviewed"

blogs don't count. Nor "reports" that count the numerous instances where someone moves and votes in a new location while a voting record still exists in their former locale.

[tkhayes 348]

people voting in one location while a voter record remains in a prior locale was already explained by me in an earlier post and does not necessarily constitute voter fraud.

Unless of course your aim is to build a case for voter fraud, in which case EVERY anomaly found might be counted as 'fraud' even if it is not.

[tkhayes 348]

Not similar at all to AGW but at least yours is an example to support my case

There is a lot of data and scientific evidence to support AGW.

There is little data or scientific evidence to support voter fraud.

Nice try though. (note that it is the same argument despite a silly attempt to discredit it on your part)

[turtlespeed 221]

tkhayes

Not similar at all to AGW but at least yours is an example to support my case

There is a lot of data and scientific evidence to support AGW.

There is little data or scientific evidence to support voter fraud.

Nice try though. (note that it is the same argument despite a silly attempt to discredit it on your part)

No documented voter fraud?

Seriously?

You actually believe that?

My point was that both are documented, but the impact is negligible, with the possibility to become very significant.

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[tkhayes 348]

Quote

No documented voter fraud?

Seriously?

You actually believe that?

I did not say that.

Seriously?

You actually believe that?

Now please go back and re-read the thread. I know, I know, it's a really long 5 pages....but until you have demonstrated that you have actually read it and my previous posts, I will have little choice but to ignore your posts.

[rushmc 23]

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2014/04/23/over-40000-voters-are-registered-in-both-virginia-and-maryland-group-finds/

Quote

A crosscheck of voter rolls in Virginia and Maryland turned up 44,000 people registered in both states, a vote-integrity group reported Wednesday.

And that’s just the beginning.










“The Virginia Voters Alliance is investigating how to identify voters who are registered and vote in Virginia but live in the states that surround us,” Alliance President Reagan George told the State Board of Elections.

George acknowledged that the number of voters who actually cast multiple ballots is relatively small. In the case of Maryland and Virginia, he revealed that 164 people voted in both states during the 2012 election.

But George said his group will expand their search for duplicate voters in the District of Columbia, Pennsylvania, New York, New Jersey, Delaware, North Carolina, Tennessee, West Virginia and Georgia.

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[kelpdiver 2]

the 44,000 number is meaningless. People move.

The 164 number is real (probably), but miniscule. Did it result in 164 investigations?

[wolfriverjoe 1,523]

kelpdiver

the 44,000 number is meaningless. People move.

The 164 number is real (probably), but miniscule. Did it result in 164 investigations?

And the funniest part of this is that any "Voter ID" requirements would do absolutely nothing to prevent this sort of fraud.
Double registration is the actual person voting twice.

Not a stand-in voting in their place.

Has anyone, anywhere made a valid complaint that they were not allowed to vote because someone else had already cast their vote?
That's the only thing requiring ID to vote would prevent.

"There are NO situations which do not call for a French Maid outfit." Lucky McSwervy

"~ya don't GET old by being weak & stupid!" - Airtwardo

[tkhayes 348]

Again, this does not demonstrate 'fraud'. people move all the time. Registering to vote, moving and then registering to vote is not only legal, it could be argued as your civic duty.

Even registering to vote, voting, then moving, registering to vote and voting in a new location is not 'fraud'. It is an anomaly in a democratic system of voting.

try again

[rushmc 23]

tkhayes

Again, this does not demonstrate 'fraud'. people move all the time. Registering to vote, moving and then registering to vote is not only legal, it could be argued as your civic duty.

Even registering to vote, voting, then moving, registering to vote and voting in a new location is not 'fraud'. It is an anomaly in a democratic system of voting.

try again

Still does not mean we should not try and clean things up though

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[tkhayes 348]

No it does not. not at all. The question I would ask first is "What law has been broken in the scenario that I have put forth?" Is there even a law anywhere that defines this?

And secondly, as maintained from the very beginning of ALL the voter ID arguments, and summarily ignored by those in favor of the Voter ID laws, is "Is this statistically significant?"

I expect it is not. given that people might vote in two different elections in two different locations, i doubt that the occurrence of someone voting for EXACTLY the same candidates in EXACTLY the same election occurs much at all.

But go ahead and show us the statistically significant cases where this is occurring and I will be waiting.....

Again, is the illegal? Or is this an anomaly?

[tkhayes 348]

I thought you were anti-big-govt? Sounds like a WHOLE LOT of big govt put into place at a huge expense to stop a problem that no one has demonstrated even exists. Very liberal of you I must say....

[rushmc 23]

tkhayes

I thought you were anti-big-govt? Sounds like a WHOLE LOT of big govt put into place at a huge expense to stop a problem that no one has demonstrated even exists. Very liberal of you I must say....

Nope
Not anti gov
Anti too big gov
But the gov does have its roles
Keeping the voting process clean is one of those roles
Nothing wrong with voter ID's
There is a reason the left does not want this
And it is NOT the stated reasons

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[tkhayes 348]

Quote

There is a reason the left does not want this
And it is NOT the stated reasons

There is a reason the right does want this
And it is NOT the stated reasons

fixed that for you.

[rushmc 23]

tkhayes

Quote

There is a reason the left does not want this
And it is NOT the stated reasons

There is a reason the right does want this
And it is NOT the stated reasons

fixed that for you.

Nope again
you fixed nothing
Nothing wrong with voter ID
It does NOT discriminate despite all the grinding of the teeth complains of the left

Do have stated many times you think ID's and checks are needed for other rights

Why not this one?

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[tkhayes 348]

And again, the onus is on the proponents to prove the problem. They make the claim, as do you. Go ahead and make all the claims you want.

Back them up with some facts or be dismissed. You sound like a Christian......I know there is a god but I cannot prove it to you, but I know there is one and we would all be better off if we just did it my way.....

[tkhayes 348]

I am not against Voter ID, but the laws that are being put forth put excessive demands on people who are legal to vote and may not be able to get said ID.

Cases already posted in this forum. Unlike you and your 'side', we actually provide data to back up our claims.

I am for capital punishment in some cases, but not many. And it all falls apart when you execute an innocent person. i feel the same way when a citizen gets denied their right to vote.

I ACCEPT the negligible amount of voter fraud that might occur if it allows a citizen to vote who might not otherwise be allowed to.

You want a 'perfection' than cannot be achieved with any system and your voter ID laws will not prevent nor stop the situation that you have posted earlier as the basis of your case.

What kind of logic is that anyway?

[tkhayes 348]

"A well defined problem is half-solved". Still waiting for someone to define the problem.

Voters registered in two states would require a national database of voters, which by the way would still be dynamic and changing every second - with no way to statically stop it for an election.

Not even sure if that would be Constitutionally legal given the states rights in the roles of election as granted in the Constitution.

define the problem. Then we can solve it. Cannot define the problem? Well......

[rushmc 23]

You and I will have to disagree
Fortunately the SC is letting the states set the guidelines up (as they are supposed to have this power)
It will be taken care of this way


(and no, you do not have the data you claim. You have your view of the data with which I disagree too)

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[Amazon 7]

tkhayes

"A well defined problem is half-solved". Still waiting for someone to define the problem.

Voters registered in two states would require a national database of voters, which by the way would still be dynamic and changing every second - with no way to statically stop it for an election.

Not even sure if that would be Constitutionally legal given the states rights in the roles of election as granted in the Constitution.

define the problem. Then we can solve it. Cannot define the problem? Well......

Like I said before... Social Security Cards that have the features of the Passport cards... or make them one and the same.. FREE to every American...

Lets add in a feature from DEMOCRACIES we have been foisting on people all over the middle East.... I LOVE the idea... you turn in your ballot.. you get a PURPLE THUMB[/PURPLE] then we also can see who give a shit about America by participating in the process and who is apathetic and can't be bothered.

[rehmwa 2]

Amazon

... you turn in your ballot.. you get a PURPLE THUMB[/PURPLE] then we also can see who give a shit about America by participating in the process and who is apathetic and can't be bothered.

sure, it identifies who cares or not, but it solves the other problem (with individuals, not the process owners - different problem) too

illegal voters -
1 - multiple voting - can't do it unless they cut off a finger (Vote early, vote 10 times)
2 - illegal voters are now marked, easy to identify after they committed the crime



However, I can't believe how insensitive you are to the thumbless challenged population, or recuperating patients in casts - I thought you cared about PEOPLE

for that matter what about the liberals that want dogs and cats to be able to vote too? kinda shuts them down also, except for the genetic freak pets

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[Amazon 7]

rehmwa

***... you turn in your ballot.. you get a PURPLE THUMB[/PURPLE] then we also can see who give a shit about America by participating in the process and who is apathetic and can't be bothered.

sure, it identifies who cares or not, but it solves the other problem (with individuals, not the process owners - different problem) too

illegal voters -
1 - multiple voting - can't do it unless they cut off a finger (Vote early, vote 10 times)
2 - illegal voters are now marked, easy to identify after they committed the crime



However, I can't believe how insensitive you are to the thumbless challenged population, or recuperating patients in casts - I thought you cared about PEOPLE

for that matter what about the liberals that want dogs and cats to be able to vote too? kinda shuts them down also, except for the genetic freak pets

Speaking of the freak pets.. how bout them conservative snake handlin folk( got some relatives who practice that.. but hey whatever "strikes" you as prudent.) I spose they could always dip the rattles in the purple.