jgoose71 0 #1 May 21, 2014 The VA, a government run single payer health care system... I just entered the VA system a couple of years ago, so my experience is limited. I will say that after 18 months, I still haven't gotten everything entered correctly and fixed yet. I filled for benefits while I was still active duty under the fast track program. Still waiting..... On a more politicized note, veterans have died from illness and committed suicide while waiting for care. I can't really blame Barrack Obama though. Everyone knew that the VA has been hosed up since the 70's. He has put more funds into the VA than any other president. I truly believe that he thought he was doing the right thing. Like most democrats, he thinks that there is no problem that can't be solved by throwing money and bureaucrats at it. From what I understand, a lot of people just shut the fuck up because they didn't want the government to "fix" it again. I'm interested to hear what other people think."There is an art, it says, or, rather, a knack to flying. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss." Life, the Universe, and Everything Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Boomerdog 0 #2 May 21, 2014 Let's just say President Obama and I are not on each others Christmas Card list and leave it at that. President Obama is not to blame, but he will deserve the blame if he cannot fix this mess on his watch. The problem with the VA has been ongoing through many Presidents AND Congress. The common theme/problem so to speak is that the VA spends more time looking for ways to deny Veterans their benfits than taking the time to help them. Thus, I would submit it's not a question of money so much as a callous attitude coupled to the culture of a large bureaucracy crippled by its own internal self made inertia. But it's still a heinous scandal of epic failure and proportion. The VA knows how to say "NO!" to Vets...it's got that act down cold. What if those vets who had: Suvived the hardships of the Winter at Valley Forge Manned the cannons at Fort McHenry Stood ground at Gettysburg, Antietam Charged San Juan Hill Gone "over the top" in WWI Kept faith at Guadalcanal Charged the beaches at Normandy Stayed the course in the cruel Winter of Bastonge Hung tough at Chosin Dug in at Khe Sanh Patrolled Fallujah Had said "NO!" What would be the results? The "leaders" of the VA are not leaders, they are dirtbag scoundrels who deserve nothing but our contempt and scorn. Their actions are nothing less than a breach of faith and a sacred trust broken between a country and those who accepted the call of their country to defend it in the darkest hours of our history and survival WHEN IT MATTERED MOST. But when it came time to help the vets when it mattered most for the vets they retreated like yellow cowards hiding behind what they interpreted as the rules and regulations rather than living the spirit of doing the right thing. I would politley ask that you don't ask me how I really think and feel about this matter. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RonD1120 62 #3 May 21, 2014 jgoose71 The VA, a government run single payer health care system...I just entered the VA system a couple of years ago, so my experience is limited. I will say that after 18 months, I still haven't gotten everything entered correctly and fixed yet. I filled for benefits while I was still active duty under the fast track program. Still waiting..... On a more politicized note, veterans have died from illness and committed suicide while waiting for care. I can't really blame Barrack Obama though. Everyone knew that the VA has been hosed up since the 70's. He has put more funds into the VA than any other president. I truly believe that he thought he was doing the right thing. Like most democrats, he thinks that there is no problem that can't be solved by throwing money and bureaucrats at it. From what I understand, a lot of people just shut the fuck up because they didn't want the government to "fix" it again. I'm interested to hear what other people think. First of all, you are right. It is not just BHO's fault. The VA problems go back as far as LBJ. The system sucks. I entered the VA system in 1992 and for the most part have been well taken care of. My needs have been medical, no disability claims. When I moved from FL to north GA I had my records transferred to the Asheville NC medical center. That was Oct 2013. I have still not been assigned to a medical team due to shortage of physicians. My clinic is in Franklin NC and does not anticipate working on the backlog until at least Jul 2014. My Rx have been used and I will have to travel to the ER in Asheville to get meds. I am personally working with a retired Marine to start a veterans resource ministry in north GA. I plan to work on and develop a better pathway for vets to get help and benefit claims processed. I am seeking Congressional assistance. This is the beginning, keep us in your prayers.Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jgoose71 0 #4 May 21, 2014 Well, I just saw BHO finally give a speech about the VA boondoggle. Not impressed. He seemed more concerned about his record than the actual problems themselves. This isn't like the other scandals facing his administration. With all the others he has followed a pattern. Feign anger, promise to have an investigation and hold people accountable, then withhold evidence and finally say "dude, that was 2 years ago...." Right now he seems to be following the pattern, but with this problem, it's not a one time event that can be buried and forgot about. Here is to hoping that he actually does something about it. Hopefully his investigation will produce something useful, like more bureaucracy isn't the answer."There is an art, it says, or, rather, a knack to flying. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss." Life, the Universe, and Everything Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DanG 1 #5 May 21, 2014 QuoteWell, I just saw BHO finally give a speech about the VA boondoggle. Not impressed. He seemed more concerned about his record than the actual problems themselves. Can you imagine any scenario where you would be happy with something Obama said or did? - Dan G Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Arvoitus 1 #6 May 21, 2014 DanGQuoteWell, I just saw BHO finally give a speech about the VA boondoggle. Not impressed. He seemed more concerned about his record than the actual problems themselves. Can you imagine any scenario where you would be happy with something Obama said or did? Maybe, "I resign." ?Your rights end where my feelings begin. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Amazon 7 #7 May 21, 2014 Boomerdog The VA knows how to say "NO!" to Vets...it's got that act down cold. What if those vets who had: Suvived the hardships of the Winter at Valley Forge Manned the cannons at Fort McHenry Stood ground at Gettysburg, Antietam Charged San Juan Hill Gone "over the top" in WWI Kept faith at Guadalcanal Charged the beaches at Normandy Stayed the course in the cruel Winter of Bastonge Hung tough at Chosin Dug in at Khe Sanh Patrolled Fallujah I would politley ask that you don't ask me how I really think and feel about this matter. They did... historically after a war has been over... vets became expendable.. it is how America has always dealt with veterans.They did provide some things after War II which was different.. but long term... not so much. I think they only did that because of the riots by veterans after War I trying to get benefits.. that was a shameful episode. Interesting names of the leaders of the troops sent to remove the veterans... http://www.worldwar1.com/dbc/bonusm.htmThe break-up of the Bonus Army in Washington was conducted by Army Chief of Staff and World War I veteran Douglas MacArthur, assisted by Majors George Patton and Dwight Eisenhower. MacArthur is considered to have exceeded President Hoover's intentions [and possibly his explicit instructions] with his heavy-handedness. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jgoose71 0 #8 May 21, 2014 DanGQuoteWell, I just saw BHO finally give a speech about the VA boondoggle. Not impressed. He seemed more concerned about his record than the actual problems themselves. Can you imagine any scenario where you would be happy with something Obama said or did? Yes I can. Instead of following his usual script for a scandal, step out of his comfort zone and actually do something. It's been 3 weeks. Using language like "If wrong doing has been found" when at this point we know there has been wrongdoing, well, it says lots. To his credit, he did mention that there were a couple of people on administrative leave. Since people have died as a result of these secret waiting lists, I think criminal negligence charges are more in order. We'll see if that happens."There is an art, it says, or, rather, a knack to flying. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss." Life, the Universe, and Everything Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jackwallace 3 #9 May 21, 2014 Posted this in March: http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=4604236;page=unread#unread. How many of you contacted your representatives? And don't you know the VA's motto- DDD!U only make 2 jumps: the first one for some weird reason and the last one that you lived through. The rest are just filler. scr 316 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kelpdiver 2 #10 May 21, 2014 jgoose71Well, I just saw BHO finally give a speech about the VA boondoggle. Not impressed. He seemed more concerned about his record than the actual problems themselves. He gave speeches about it 7 years ago. Unfortunately, like many of his campaign speeches, he found it was easier to talk about it then to fix it. and with VA directors cooking the books around wait times, it seems hard to rely on metrics to measure improvements. For any project lead, this is a huge impediment. I'd fire (if I had authority), or shit can off my project, people who behaved that way. With the troop count if Afghanistan down near 30k and trending toward a 10k target, the VA will eventually catch up by virtue of a return to "peacetime," so even without real action, the problem will be "solved." Should make for some blood pressure inducing speeches by those who want to take credit. And then any prioritized effort to really solve it will go away until the aftermath of the next war. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Amazon 7 #11 May 21, 2014 kelpdiver***Well, I just saw BHO finally give a speech about the VA boondoggle. Not impressed. He seemed more concerned about his record than the actual problems themselves. He gave speeches about it 7 years ago. Unfortunately, like many of his campaign speeches, he found it was easier to talk about it then to fix it. and with VA directors cooking the books around wait times, it seems hard to rely on metrics to measure improvements. For any project lead, this is a huge impediment. I'd fire (if I had authority), or shit can off my project, people who behaved that way. With the troop count if Afghanistan down near 30k and trending toward a 10k target, the VA will eventually catch up by virtue of a return to "peacetime," so even without real action, the problem will be "solved." Should make for some blood pressure inducing speeches by those who want to take credit. And then any prioritized effort to really solve it will go away until the aftermath of the next war. I like Bernie Sanders take on what the VA should be doing...and those who block support for veterans are the worst of what America offers to its people. http://www.sanders.senate.gov/newsroom/press-releases/senate-republicans-block-veterans-bill The legislation was backed by the American Legion, the Veterans of Foreign Wars, Disabled American Veterans, the Iraq and Afghanistan Veterans of America and virtually every other veterans’ and military service organization in the country. “The cost of war does not end once the last shots are fired and the last battles are fought,” Sanders said. “When members of the military lose arms, legs and eyesight fighting in wars that Congress authorized, we have a moral obligation to make sure that those Americans receive all of the benefits that they have earned and deserve. When American soldiers die in combat, we have a moral obligation to make sure that the spouses and children they leave behind are taken care of and do not live in abject poverty.” The measure would have improved health and dental care services provided by the Department of Veterans Affairs. It also would have allowed the VA to open 27 new clinics and medical facilities. Educational opportunities would have been expanded for post-9/11 veterans. Another provision would have improved access to care and benefits for veterans who experienced sexual trauma while serving in the military. Also full cost-of-living adjustments would be restored for future military retirees. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gravitymaster 0 #12 May 21, 2014 DanGQuoteWell, I just saw BHO finally give a speech about the VA boondoggle. Not impressed. He seemed more concerned about his record than the actual problems themselves. Can you imagine any scenario where you would be happy with something Obama said or did? Can you imagine a scenario where you would be happy to be treated like this? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DanG 1 #13 May 21, 2014 QuoteCan you imagine a scenario where you would be happy to be treated like this? Um, no. What does that have to do with Obama? - Dan G Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,989 #14 May 21, 2014 >What does that have to do with Obama? He thinks something is bad. Hence, Obama. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gravitymaster 0 #15 May 22, 2014 billvon>What does that have to do with Obama? He thinks something is bad. Hence, Obama. As opposed to "Obama didn't know anything about this until he read about it in the paper". Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gravitymaster 0 #16 May 22, 2014 DanGQuoteCan you imagine a scenario where you would be happy to be treated like this? Um, no. What does that have to do with Obama? Uhhh..How about he's the Commander in Chief of the Armed Forces? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JerryBaumchen 1,354 #17 May 22, 2014 Hi Grav, Quote Uhhh..How about he's the Commander in Chief of the Armed Forces? Uh, how about that the VA is not part of DoD. http://www.va.gov/explore/?gclid=CjgKEAjwnfGbBRDlxoHrl6uikyESJAD-nzCF8kXgyKtyWcDAg70PluLSQoVzdWEIqBG0c1QY5Wh4RvD_BwE What part of how the US gov't is organized is that you do not understand? JerryBaumchen Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gravitymaster 0 #18 May 22, 2014 JerryBaumchen Hi Grav, Quote Uhhh..How about he's the Commander in Chief of the Armed Forces? Uh, how about that the VA is not part of DoD. http://www.va.gov/explore/?gclid=CjgKEAjwnfGbBRDlxoHrl6uikyESJAD-nzCF8kXgyKtyWcDAg70PluLSQoVzdWEIqBG0c1QY5Wh4RvD_BwE What part of how the US gov't is organized is that you do not understand? JerryBaumchen What part of where the buck stops is confusing to you? I really wonder what it's going to take for you left wingers to stop defending the indefensible. IRS, NSA, Bengahzi, V.A., Guantanamo, Fast and Furious, killing Americans with drones with no due process. Exectutive Order after Executive Order because he knows he could never get his ideological agenda through Congress. Lies, lies and more lies on top of more lies. I swear, if he pulled a gun out and shot someone in the head on live TV, the left wingers would claim the deceased deserved it because he was probably a terrorist . Speaking of terrorists, how's that Guantanamo Bay closing going? How about all those shovel ready jobs? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
winsor 236 #19 May 22, 2014 DanGQuoteWell, I just saw BHO finally give a speech about the VA boondoggle. Not impressed. He seemed more concerned about his record than the actual problems themselves. Can you imagine any scenario where you would be happy with something Obama said or did? Seppuku. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RonD1120 62 #21 May 22, 2014 Gravitymaster ***Hi Grav, Quote Uhhh..How about he's the Commander in Chief of the Armed Forces? Uh, how about that the VA is not part of DoD. http://www.va.gov/explore/?gclid=CjgKEAjwnfGbBRDlxoHrl6uikyESJAD-nzCF8kXgyKtyWcDAg70PluLSQoVzdWEIqBG0c1QY5Wh4RvD_BwE What part of how the US gov't is organized is that you do not understand? JerryBaumchen What part of where the buck stops is confusing to you? I really wonder what it's going to take for you left wingers to stop defending the indefensible. IRS, NSA, Bengahzi, V.A., Guantanamo, Fast and Furious, killing Americans with drones with no due process. Exectutive Order after Executive Order because he knows he could never get his ideological agenda through Congress. Lies, lies and more lies on top of more lies. I swear, if he pulled a gun out and shot someone in the head on live TV, the left wingers would claim the deceased deserved it because he was probably a terrorist . Speaking of terrorists, how's that Guantanamo Bay closing going? How about all those shovel ready jobs? Perfectly summarized.Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DanG 1 #22 May 22, 2014 QuoteWhat part of where the buck stops is confusing to you? I really wonder what it's going to take for you left wingers to stop defending the indefensible. IRS, NSA, Bengahzi, V.A., Guantanamo, Fast and Furious, killing Americans with drones with no due process. Exectutive Order after Executive Order because he knows he could never get his ideological agenda through Congress. Lies, lies and more lies on top of more lies. I swear, if he pulled a gun out and shot someone in the head on live TV, the left wingers would claim the deceased deserved it because he was probably a terrorist . Speaking of terrorists, how's that Guantanamo Bay closing going? How about all those shovel ready jobs? Got it. The buck stops with Obama, but Bush wasn't responsible for anything because his subordinates lied to him. I don't defend everything Obama does, but blaming him personally for every government failing dilutes the legitimate complaints, such as not acting on Gitmo. - Dan G Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gravitymaster 0 #23 May 22, 2014 DanGQuoteWhat part of where the buck stops is confusing to you? I really wonder what it's going to take for you left wingers to stop defending the indefensible. IRS, NSA, Bengahzi, V.A., Guantanamo, Fast and Furious, killing Americans with drones with no due process. Exectutive Order after Executive Order because he knows he could never get his ideological agenda through Congress. Lies, lies and more lies on top of more lies. I swear, if he pulled a gun out and shot someone in the head on live TV, the left wingers would claim the deceased deserved it because he was probably a terrorist . Speaking of terrorists, how's that Guantanamo Bay closing going? How about all those shovel ready jobs? Got it. The buck stops with Obama, but Bush wasn't responsible for anything because his subordinates lied to him. I don't defend everything Obama does, but blaming him personally for every government failing dilutes the legitimate complaints, such as not acting on Gitmo. Dude, he hasn't even fired Shinseki. WTF. If this was Bush, your heads would be exploding by now and you know it. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gravitymaster 0 #24 May 22, 2014 Yeah, and don't even get me started on the pack of lies regarding healthcare. And then the left wingers wonder why we don't believe anything he says. Yet they would feel completely different if they knew someone personally who lied as much as Obama. They would completely shun a pathological liar in their daily lives, but they accept it coming from Obama and his administration. I emphasize "Administration" for all the race baiters. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DanG 1 #25 May 22, 2014 QuoteIf this was Bush, your heads would be exploding by now and you know it. I did happen under Bush, and you know it, too. - Dan G Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
