Arvoitus 1 #426 July 2, 2014 promise5I'm still stumped how this applies to bring a TI? Unless, the TI took a student loan out,maybe a grant then used it to pay for all his equipment,courses and jumps just so he could get a job as a TI then committed a sex crime that got him on the list. So after serving his time etc. the ONLY job he could get was as a TI? Which he could get immediately because he wouldn't need to be recertified or anything? Interesting. Not trying to be offensive. But come on!! This if he doesn't get to work as a TI he'll end up back in jail because he can't fond any work just doesn't fly. Come on this isn't a cheap sport it costs for equipment,courses and jumps. I guess it varies from case to case, but I didn't pay much if anything for being a TI, my DZ pretty much payed it all.Your rights end where my feelings begin. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Coreece 190 #427 July 2, 2014 quadeNo. Most murderer/molester/rapists are not held back by fear of severe punishment. There is something wrong with the wiring of their brains. MOST people aren't murderer/molester/rapists and it has nothing whatsoever to do with severe punishment. MOST people understand that these things are universally immoral acts and should simply not do them for the sake of humanity alone. Absolutely...this is why it's important to be conservative with our morality. If we don't keep ourselves in check, It could get to the point where statutory rape isn't rape anymore, but merely consensual sex between two humans that have reached the age of physical sexual maturity. History has a tendency to repeat itself. Who knows...maybe one day you or your future relative will be the conservative fighting the liberalism of sexual freedom?Your secrets are the true reflection of who you really are... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DanG 1 #428 July 2, 2014 QuoteGiven the impetuous nature of some people here, (e.g, normiss) I can understand why you'd actually feel the need to give a disclaimer of not condoning sex crimes, but surely you don't actually believe that either of the two extremes you've posted represent the majority of sex crimes/criminals, do you? What two extremes are you talking about? I didn't post anything about two extremes. - Dan G Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DanG 1 #429 July 2, 2014 QuoteThey should be thankful for the fact that we don't cut their balls off. Then we should sentence them to life in prison if that's what we really want. Sentencing them to a shorter term, but then effectively imprisoning them outside the prison walls gives them no incentive not to rape again, and now they're out where the victims live. QuoteIf there is no heavy repercussion who is going to not rape/steal/kill someone like a savage animal??? It is because of these rules, laws, repercussion human beings can keep things civil. So the only reason you're not a murdering rapist is the fear of being punished? - Dan G Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
promise5 17 #430 July 2, 2014 Ok they paid for you to be a TI, but did they also pay for you to get started in the sport,all your equipment,jumps etc.?No matter how slowly you say oranges it never sounds like gullible. Believe me I tried. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
stayhigh 2 #431 July 2, 2014 I think i would've killed someone long ago if there was no punishment involved. I think I would still kill that person, and the other guy would kill me if he had the chance. That's what happened back in wild wild west days no??? Freedom to have firearm, and not enough law enforcements.Bernie Sanders for President 2016 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DanG 1 #432 July 2, 2014 QuoteI think i would've killed someone long ago if there was no punishment involved. I think I would still kill that person, and the other guy would kill me if he had the chance. That's what happened back in wild wild west days no??? Freedom to have firearm, and not enough law enforcements. Do you feel the same way about rape, which is what this thread is about? - Dan G Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
normiss 798 #433 July 2, 2014 Fuck off ass hat. YOU are the reason I've stopped posting here. Until you call me out and personally attack me. Again. Who the fuck is the asshat that felt you deserved back here is beyond me. You just ain't right in the head. See you folks in a few weeks. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Coreece 190 #434 July 2, 2014 DanGWhat two extremes are you talking about? I didn't post anything about two extremes. The part about giving sex criminals a life sentence because there is no incentive to reform themselves if society treats them harshly.Your secrets are the true reflection of who you really are... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DanG 1 #435 July 2, 2014 QuoteThe part about giving sex criminals a life sentence because there is no incentive to reform themselves if society treats them harshly. I guess that's one extreme. I'm not sure what you think the other is. "Treating them harshly" is one way of saying preventing them from getting work or having a fixed address, but I think it's more like preventing them from having any hope of living in society, and therefore preventing them from feeling accountable to society. In other words, I don't think what we do currently is effective at rehabilitating sex offenders. - Dan G Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Coreece 190 #436 July 2, 2014 DanGQuoteThe part about giving sex criminals a life sentence because there is no incentive to reform themselves if society treats them harshly. I guess that's one extreme. I'm not sure what you think the other is. "Treating them harshly" is one way of saying preventing them from getting work or having a fixed address, but I think it's more like preventing them from having any hope of living in society, and therefore preventing them from feeling accountable to society. In other words, I don't think what we do currently is effective at rehabilitating sex offenders. Right, that's why I figured you really didn't believe that giving them a life sentence was the solution. You were just making a point. The other extreme is that there is no incentive to rehabilitate. They're options are extremely limited, but even in the worst cases there's at least hope in the idea that time heals all wounds.(somewhat) If a sex offender is on probation/parole, it's only a matter of time before he satisfies the requirements of that period and is released. He can then move on and try to start a new life elsewhere...not all jobs do background checks and some companies only go back 7 years. There is also the option of self employment.Your secrets are the true reflection of who you really are... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DanG 1 #437 July 2, 2014 QuoteIf a sex offender is on probation/parole, it's only a matter of time before he satisfies the requirements of that period and is released. Not necessarily. Sometimes the "release" consists of being confined to a rehabilitation facility, from which there is no practical means of release. QuoteHe can then move on and try to start a new life elsewhere...not all jobs do background checks and some companies only go back 7 years. There is also the option of self employment. You make it sound so easy. The fact of the matter is that it is easier for a murderer to start a new life than a sex offender. There is no murderer registry. No Sheriffs require that a sign be posted in the murderer's yard warning neighbors about him. Murderers aren't barred from living near schools, libraries, playgrounds, day care centers, or other places where children gather. But, and here's the kicker, murderers have a higher recidivism rate than sex offenders. It makes no sense. - Dan G Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Arvoitus 1 #438 July 2, 2014 promise5Ok they paid for you to be a TI, but did they also pay for you to get started in the sport,all your equipment,jumps etc.? No, but then again a person with no criminal record could get a TI rating, commit a sexual crime, do the prison time, come back, get current and there'd be nothing USPA would be able to do about this person having a TI rating with also being in sex offender registry. Which is why the only sensible option in this scenario is for the individual DZ to do the filtering instead of USPA or the manufacturer who assigns the ratings.Your rights end where my feelings begin. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Coreece 190 #439 July 2, 2014 DanGQuoteIf a sex offender is on probation/parole, it's only a matter of time before he satisfies the requirements of that period and is released. Not necessarily. Sometimes the "release" consists of being confined to a rehabilitation facility, from which there is no practical means of release. QuoteHe can then move on and try to start a new life elsewhere...not all jobs do background checks and some companies only go back 7 years. There is also the option of self employment. You make it sound so easy. And you make it sound so impossible... DanGThe fact of the matter is that it is easier for a murderer to start a new life than a sex offender. There is no murderer registry. No Sheriffs require that a sign be posted in the murderer's yard warning neighbors about him. Murderers aren't barred from living near schools, libraries, playgrounds, day care centers, or other places where children gather. But, and here's the kicker, murderers have a higher recidivism rate than sex offenders. It makes no sense. What doesn't make sense is that in one argument you'll say that harsher penalties for sex offenses don't give offenders an incentive to rehabilitate, and then in another argument you'll talk about how recidivism rates for sexual offenses are relatively low when compared to other crimes...Your secrets are the true reflection of who you really are... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DanG 1 #440 July 2, 2014 QuoteWhat doesn't make sense is that in one argument you'll say that harsher penalties for sex offenses don't give offenders an incentive to rehabilitate, and then in another argument you'll talk about how recidivism rates for sexual offenses are relatively low when compared to other crimes... It makes sense if both of my statements are true, and the majority of sex offenders are not habitual predators like they get portrayed. Again, and I feel the need to restate this, I am in no way condoning or trying to lessen the seriousness of sex crimes. I'm just arguing that the way the current criminal justice system deals with them is not based on data, nor is it in society's best interest. - Dan G Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
promise5 17 #441 July 2, 2014 I brought up a scenerio close to that. He wouldn't be able to get current if he was on the list. If not being a sex offender was a requirement. Whoever signed off on getting him current would also be held responsible if they ignored that requirement.No matter how slowly you say oranges it never sounds like gullible. Believe me I tried. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
stayhigh 2 #442 July 2, 2014 Killing someone, or myself came to thoughts several times, but raping someone never came to my mind. I guess, it depends on person's brain chemistry. I can never understand why people can just jerk off and get over sexual frustration if they can't have relationship with other sex. I have stolen something when I was little, but I've seen kids going to juvie and getting locked up and that didn't seem cool or fun at all so I stopped doing that.Bernie Sanders for President 2016 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
normiss 798 #443 July 2, 2014 I don't think rape is about sex. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
quade 4 #444 July 2, 2014 promise5I brought up a scenerio close to that. He wouldn't be able to get current if he was on the list. If not being a sex offender was a requirement. Whoever signed off on getting him current would also be held responsible if they ignored that requirement. This goes back to my one of my very first problems in this thread with regards to who is held accountable. You want it to be a USPA issue, but then say things like this where it becomes an issue for an instructor signing off on currency. THAT random instructor has no business whatsoever even knowing the offender's criminal status. You're asking him to play detective and be held responsible for possibly doing a poor job of it.quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
stayhigh 2 #445 July 2, 2014 What is it than?? Mental illness?? I guess some people are just fucked in their brain. Other thing I totally can not understand is child molesters. How does one get off on kids??Bernie Sanders for President 2016 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
promise5 17 #446 July 2, 2014 If he's signing off on a TI and that TI is a sex offender and he knows it. Yes he would be held accountable.No matter how slowly you say oranges it never sounds like gullible. Believe me I tried. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
normiss 798 #447 July 2, 2014 Depends on the rape I think. Power, revenge, control, inflict terror on someone. I'd much prefer to call it a mental defect as opposed to an illness. I agree, some people are most assuredly "fucked in their brain" as you say. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
stayhigh 2 #448 July 2, 2014 I'm just glad that we don't fully understand these rapist. Because if you can truly understand what goes in their head, same type of shit probably goes in your head as well.Bernie Sanders for President 2016 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
quade 4 #449 July 2, 2014 promise5If he's signing off on a TI and that TI is a sex offender and he knows it. Yes he would be held accountable. Why should he know though? You're saying that as if it would either be obvious common knowledge (like he has a tattoo on his forehead saying "sex offender") or it's his duty to find out. If it's not obvious common knowledge or his duty to find out, then how could you ever possibly hold the person accountable? Are you suggesting that every person looking for recurrency signoffs be subjected to internet searches to see whether or not they're sex offenders?quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
normiss 798 #450 July 2, 2014 Criminal psychologists should be imprisoned! I think the world is a much more dangerous place than a LOT of people realize. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
