Score one for gun owners

[BillyVance 34]

Sometimes, legal gun ownership has its benefits. They stop a crime in progress.

http://news.yahoo.com/two-men-girl-human-shield-until-her-father-040007545.html

"Mediocre people don't like high achievers, and high achievers don't like mediocre people." - SIX TIME National Champion coach Nick Saban

[kallend 2,027]

Pity about the hundreds of thousands of guns that legal gun owners allow to fall into the hands of criminals each year, and the hundreds of thousands of crimes that then get committed with those guns each year.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[normiss 806]

I'm pretty sure hundreds of thousands of legal gun owners do not allow that.
How's Chicago's front porch looking these days?
Maybe hundreds of thousands there, not here.

[BillyVance 34]

normiss

I'm pretty sure hundreds of thousands of legal gun owners do not allow that.
How's Chicago's front porch looking these days?
Maybe hundreds of thousands there, not here.

Chicago is pretty much the armpit of America. Detroit too. Gun control laws doesn't appear to be working either.

"Mediocre people don't like high achievers, and high achievers don't like mediocre people." - SIX TIME National Champion coach Nick Saban

[masterrig 1]

kallend

Pity about the hundreds of thousands of guns that legal gun owners allow to fall into the hands of criminals each year, and the hundreds of thousands of crimes that then get committed with those guns each year.

Where did you get that? I've never heard of "legal gun owners 'allowing' their guns to fall into the hands of criminals each year." You make it sound like we just leave our guns 'out there' free for the taking. I have never known of this. I do know, I keep all of my guns out of the reach of children even though there are no kids here or even as visitors. I don't know how to really prevent my house from being broken into or my pick-up for that matter. If, a crook wants to get into my house or pick-up, they're going to get into it. I refuse to live in a cage just to keep bad guys out.


Chuck

[kallend 2,027]

normiss

I'm pretty sure hundreds of thousands of legal gun owners do not allow that.
How's Chicago's front porch looking these days?
Maybe hundreds of thousands there, not here.

DoJ Bureau of Justice Statistics.

Guns don't start out illegal. They start out legal and somewhere along the line hundreds of thousands each year make the move from legal gun owners to criminals.

The criminal classes are being armed by legal gun owners.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[normiss 806]

wiggle wiggle much?

[kallend 2,027]

normiss

wiggle wiggle much?

Just the facts. Smith & Wesson and Glock, etc., don't make illegal guns. The guns get to criminals after passing through the hands of legal gun owners.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[DiverMike 5]

Quote

The criminal classes are being armed by legal gun owners.

That is a stretch. The primary definition of being armed is to be furnished with weapons. Legal gun owners are not furnishing anything (definition: to supply or give something to someone or something).

I would agree that the criminal class is arming itself by stealing from law abiding citizens, but legal gun owners are definitely not arming the criminals.

For the same reason I jump off a perfectly good diving board.

[masterrig 1]

kallend

***wiggle wiggle much?

Just the facts. Smith & Wesson and Glock, etc., don't make illegal guns. The guns get to criminals after passing through the hands of legal gun owners.

O.K., you divulged your source but what I'd like to know is... how does it happen that 'legal' guns get from 'legal gun owners' into the hands of bad guys? Is it through sales, house burglaries, vehicle burglaries, they are left lying around in their yards or on sidewalks or left on the counters at Starbucks while making a purchase? How?


Chuck

[SkyDekker 1,465]

Quote

O.K., you divulged your source but what I'd like to know is... how does it happen that 'legal' guns get from 'legal gun owners' into the hands of bad guys? Is it through sales, house burglaries, vehicle burglaries, they are left lying around in their yards or on sidewalks or left on the counters at Starbucks while making a purchase? How?

Yes to pretty much all of the above.

Most if not all guns start as legally purchased guns, which then through a multitude of ways end up as "illegal".

That us unless you are willing to entertain the idea that gun manufacturers are selling guns knowing they will end up on the illegal market. There is precedent for this with the tobacco manufacturers.

[normiss 806]

Your wiggle was the selective use of, then the omission of the word "allow".

Keep trying.

[BIGUN 1,323]

kallend

***I'm pretty sure hundreds of thousands of legal gun owners do not allow that.
How's Chicago's front porch looking these days?
Maybe hundreds of thousands there, not here.

DoJ Bureau of Justice Statistics.

Guns don't start out illegal. They start out legal and somewhere along the line hundreds of thousands each year make the move from legal gun owners to criminals.

The criminal classes are being armed by legal gun owners.

The DoJ does not maintain statistics on the legality of weapons; that is the ATF's job. The DoJ collects, analyzes, publishes, and disseminate information on crime, criminal offenders, and victims of crime.

The hundreds of thousands you talk about are... the ~200,000 weapons that are stolen.

In your defense; The ATF is cracking down on straw purchases (which account for about 2% of guns used in crimes). There are tougher laws coming into legislature about ownership and securing one's weapons properly and being criminally responsible if one's weapons are stolen and the appropriate security measures not used.

Nobody has time to listen; because they're desperately chasing the need of being heard.

[masterrig 1]

SkyDekker

Quote

O.K., you divulged your source but what I'd like to know is... how does it happen that 'legal' guns get from 'legal gun owners' into the hands of bad guys? Is it through sales, house burglaries, vehicle burglaries, they are left lying around in their yards or on sidewalks or left on the counters at Starbucks while making a purchase? How?

Yes to pretty much all of the above.

Most if not all guns start as legally purchased guns, which then through a multitude of ways end up as "illegal".

That us unless you are willing to entertain the idea that gun manufacturers are selling guns knowing they will end up on the illegal market. There is precedent for this with the tobacco manufacturers.

Something I've found interesting is, gang members joining our armed forces, stealing weapons and getting them shipped to their respective gangs. I don't know anything about the tobacco industry but I do feel quite certain, reputable gun manufacturers would be risking everything if they were caught selling to bad guys. I don't believe they'd be stupid enough to do that. Also, gun manufacturers are 'monitored'.


Chuck

[SkyDekker 1,465]

Quote

I don't know anything about the tobacco industry but I do feel quite certain, reputable gun manufacturers would be risking everything if they were caught selling to bad guys. I don't believe they'd be stupid enough to do that. Also, gun manufacturers are 'monitored'.

In that case pretty much all guns were legal at one point, and it is the legal gun market that is feeding the illegal gun market.

[Amazon 7]

masterrig

***
Pity about the hundreds of thousands of guns that legal gun owners allow to fall into the hands of criminals each year, and the hundreds of thousands of crimes that then get committed with those guns each year.

Where did you get that? I've never heard of "legal gun owners 'allowing' their guns to fall into the hands of criminals each year." You make it sound like we just leave our guns 'out there' free for the taking. I have never known of this. I do know, I keep all of my guns out of the reach of children even though there are no kids here or even as visitors. I don't know how to really prevent my house from being broken into or my pick-up for that matter. If, a crook wants to get into my house or pick-up, they're going to get into it. I refuse to live in a cage just to keep bad guys out.


Chuck

I would think keeping the weapons in a properly secured safe tends to dissuade some scum that may try to burgle your place... rather than just stuffing them under the bed in a gun condom... or standing them there in a closet in the bedroom with the bifold doors... like several of my "responsible gun owning" friends who I shoot with at the range do.

I have a former boss from the military who felt living in the country was safe, 80 miles from the city and 10 miles outside a very small town.. a friend of a friend of his who had been separated decided he wanted those weapons to pay for his further drug use. He cleaned out a whole lot of weapons while the family was gone for a hunt in another part of the state. Lesson learned.

[kelpdiver 2]

kallend

Guns don't start out illegal. They start out legal and somewhere along the line hundreds of thousands each year make the move from legal gun owners to criminals.

Do they come from the same place as legal cocaine? Or heroin?

[SkyDekker 1,465]

Quote

Do they come from the same place as legal cocaine? Or heroin?

Most cocaine and heroin is manufactured illegally.

Are you contending a sizeable group of guns in circulation were manufactured illegally?

[kelpdiver 2]

SkyDekker

Quote

Do they come from the same place as legal cocaine? Or heroin?

Most cocaine and heroin is manufactured illegally.

Are you contending a sizeable group of guns in circulation were manufactured illegally?

guns that are smuggled in with drug shipments from outside US borders were never "legal."

[masterrig 1]

Amazon

******
Pity about the hundreds of thousands of guns that legal gun owners allow to fall into the hands of criminals each year, and the hundreds of thousands of crimes that then get committed with those guns each year.

Where did you get that? I've never heard of "legal gun owners 'allowing' their guns to fall into the hands of criminals each year." You make it sound like we just leave our guns 'out there' free for the taking. I have never known of this. I do know, I keep all of my guns out of the reach of children even though there are no kids here or even as visitors. I don't know how to really prevent my house from being broken into or my pick-up for that matter. If, a crook wants to get into my house or pick-up, they're going to get into it. I refuse to live in a cage just to keep bad guys out.


Chuck

I would think keeping the weapons in a properly secured safe tends to dissuade some scum that may try to burgle your place... rather than just stuffing them under the bed in a gun condom... or standing them there in a closet in the bedroom with the bifold doors... like several of my "responsible gun owning" friends who I shoot with at the range do.

I have a former boss from the military who felt living in the country was safe, 80 miles from the city and 10 miles outside a very small town.. a friend of a friend of his who had been separated decided he wanted those weapons to pay for his further drug use. He cleaned out a whole lot of weapons while the family was gone for a hunt in another part of the state. Lesson learned.

I was fortunate enough to have had a father who taught me right about guns. To me, the proper 'care and feeding' of guns takes good ol' common sense. A gun owner can get a good gun safe at a fair price. Those folks who leave their guns hanging in their Easy Rider rifle rack are asking for their guns to be stolen.


Chuck

[normiss 806]

Agreed.

IMO, the parents that left the guns accessible to the murderer at the school should be charged as accessories to murder.
10 years. Minimum.

Secure your weapons people.
More so if you've been a slouch of a parent and have raised your kids by TV, video games, and prescription drugs.
People are raising crazies and subjecting the rest of us to their insanity.

[Amazon 7]

masterrig

*********
Pity about the hundreds of thousands of guns that legal gun owners allow to fall into the hands of criminals each year, and the hundreds of thousands of crimes that then get committed with those guns each year.

Where did you get that? I've never heard of "legal gun owners 'allowing' their guns to fall into the hands of criminals each year." You make it sound like we just leave our guns 'out there' free for the taking. I have never known of this. I do know, I keep all of my guns out of the reach of children even though there are no kids here or even as visitors. I don't know how to really prevent my house from being broken into or my pick-up for that matter. If, a crook wants to get into my house or pick-up, they're going to get into it. I refuse to live in a cage just to keep bad guys out.


Chuck

I would think keeping the weapons in a properly secured safe tends to dissuade some scum that may try to burgle your place... rather than just stuffing them under the bed in a gun condom... or standing them there in a closet in the bedroom with the bifold doors... like several of my "responsible gun owning" friends who I shoot with at the range do.

I have a former boss from the military who felt living in the country was safe, 80 miles from the city and 10 miles outside a very small town.. a friend of a friend of his who had been separated decided he wanted those weapons to pay for his further drug use. He cleaned out a whole lot of weapons while the family was gone for a hunt in another part of the state. Lesson learned.

I was fortunate enough to have had a father who taught me right about guns. To me, the proper 'care and feeding' of guns takes good ol' common sense. A gun owner can get a good gun safe at a fair price. Those folks who leave their guns hanging in their Easy Rider rifle rack are asking for their guns to be stolen.


Chuck

Amen bro... I had a grandfather who taught all of us the proper handling, cleaning and care of weapons long before he taught us to shoot. That was part of the program which included learning to reload if we wanted to shoot. After shooting a good proper cleaning and then storage in the safe was mandatory before that day came to a close. When we went hunting we did not have a safe with us but we also did not allow for them to just be set in the "easy rider rifle rack" in plain view, we had a cable and lock to secure then in the vehicle. That was how the end of the day went, before the big people broke out the adult beverages in camp.

[masterrig 1]

normiss

Agreed.

IMO, the parents that left the guns accessible to the murderer at the school should be charged as accessories to murder.
10 years. Minimum.

Secure your weapons people.
More so if you've been a slouch of a parent and have raised your kids by TV, video games, and prescription drugs.
People are raising crazies and subjecting the rest of us to their insanity.

A-men!!


Chuck

[masterrig 1]

Amazon

************
Pity about the hundreds of thousands of guns that legal gun owners allow to fall into the hands of criminals each year, and the hundreds of thousands of crimes that then get committed with those guns each year.

Where did you get that? I've never heard of "legal gun owners 'allowing' their guns to fall into the hands of criminals each year." You make it sound like we just leave our guns 'out there' free for the taking. I have never known of this. I do know, I keep all of my guns out of the reach of children even though there are no kids here or even as visitors. I don't know how to really prevent my house from being broken into or my pick-up for that matter. If, a crook wants to get into my house or pick-up, they're going to get into it. I refuse to live in a cage just to keep bad guys out.


Chuck

I would think keeping the weapons in a properly secured safe tends to dissuade some scum that may try to burgle your place... rather than just stuffing them under the bed in a gun condom... or standing them there in a closet in the bedroom with the bifold doors... like several of my "responsible gun owning" friends who I shoot with at the range do.

I have a former boss from the military who felt living in the country was safe, 80 miles from the city and 10 miles outside a very small town.. a friend of a friend of his who had been separated decided he wanted those weapons to pay for his further drug use. He cleaned out a whole lot of weapons while the family was gone for a hunt in another part of the state. Lesson learned.

I was fortunate enough to have had a father who taught me right about guns. To me, the proper 'care and feeding' of guns takes good ol' common sense. A gun owner can get a good gun safe at a fair price. Those folks who leave their guns hanging in their Easy Rider rifle rack are asking for their guns to be stolen.


Chuck

Amen bro... I had a grandfather who taught all of us the proper handling, cleaning and care of weapons long before he taught us to shoot. That was part of the program which included learning to reload if we wanted to shoot. After shooting a good proper cleaning and then storage in the safe was mandatory before that day came to a close. When we went hunting we did not have a safe with us but we also did not allow for them to just be set in the "easy rider rifle rack" in plain view, we had a cable and lock to secure then in the vehicle. That was how the end of the day went, before the big people broke out the adult beverages in camp.

Outstanding! As it should be.


Chuck

[BillyVance 34]

I know that I refuse to live in an area where your name and address gets published as a gun-owner, thereby making MY home a target, like a certain area of NY...

If some asshole wants my guns, they're going to have to be real fast. Response time is less than a minute, and they will not be able to disengage my wireless ADT alarm.

You want my guns? FUCK YOU! Try and get them.

"Mediocre people don't like high achievers, and high achievers don't like mediocre people." - SIX TIME National Champion coach Nick Saban