Christian persecution

[Amazon 7]

Oh all those poor down home folks.... always being discriminated against... don't ya know.


Discrimination Arkansas style

Wouldn't it be nice if we really did have religious freedom in this country.. not just lip service to it??

[funjumper101 15]

In the "Christian" community, the actions of the town officials is completely acceptable. In the USA, for those that believe in the Constitution and the Bill of Rights, the actions of the town officials is both despicable, and unconstitutional.

Freedom OF religion is supposed to be a bedrock of the freedoms we enjoy here in the USA. How do the "Conservatives" here explain this fundamental violation of the freedoms enshrined in the Constitution?

Ron, maybe you can explain why this disregard for US law and customs is considered to be acceptable, from a "Christian" perspective.

From a true believer in the Constitution and the Bill of Rights, this heinous violation of the law needs to be met with fierce and overwhelming force to punt those evil doers from public office. My contribution to the ACLU and the Pagan group will be going out today.

For the "conservatives" here, I challenge you all to put your money where your mouths are and contribute as well. Freedom is costly, and sometimes quite annoying. You have to tolerate other people who don't think and live like you do, and you have no right to try to force your beliefs on them.

[RonD1120 62]

By golly, nothing like this could happen in Humboldt County CA.

It's called cultural relativity, usually taught in Sociology 101. Each culture has its own mores, folkways, traditions and customs. Arkansas is nothing like northern California.

Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them.

[kallend 2,028]

RonD1120

By golly, nothing like this could happen in Humboldt County CA.

It's called cultural relativity, usually taught in Sociology 101. Each culture has its own mores, folkways, traditions and customs. Arkansas is nothing like northern California.

Right. Arkansas is 50th out of 50 in % of population with advanced degrees, while CA is 14th. Arkansas is 49th out of 50 in % of population with bachelors' degrees, while CA is 14th. AR is a "red" state, CA is "blue".

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[Coreece 190]

Nothing new...There have been plenty of churches denied because of various reasons disguised behind zoning laws...no big deal. Christians have paved the way for laws that protect various religious freedoms...It's not the end of world. Nobody is denying your right to practice...

http://aclj.org/churches-organizations-/zoning-religious-land-use

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religious_Land_Use_and_Institutionalized_Persons_Act

Your secrets are the true reflection of who you really are...

[Amazon 7]

Coreece

Nothing new...There have been plenty of churches denied because of various reasons disguised behind zoning laws...no big deal. Christians have paved the way for laws that protect various religious freedoms...It's not the end of world. Nobody is denying your right to practice...

http://aclj.org/churches-organizations-/zoning-religious-land-use

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religious_Land_Use_and_Institutionalized_Persons_Act

So ... does your ALCJ protect the rights of other denominations or religions other than Christians.. ??? I am thinking...... NOT

[Coreece 190]

Amazon

***Nothing new...There have been plenty of churches denied because of various reasons disguised behind zoning laws...no big deal. Christians have paved the way for laws that protect various religious freedoms...It's not the end of world. Nobody is denying your right to practice...

http://aclj.org/churches-organizations-/zoning-religious-land-use

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religious_Land_Use_and_Institutionalized_Persons_Act

So ... does your ALCJ protect the rights of other denominations or religions other than Christians.. ??? I am thinking...... NOT

I don't know...You'll have to do your own research, but they do seem to make a distinction between "churches" and "other religious organizations.

The point here isn't who the ACLJ protects...The point here is that the ACLJ actually has to exist.

In any event, there is always the RLUIPA...so just relax, it's not the end of the world...

Funny thing is that people come in here flaming away as if they actually care about pagan beliefs and cough up money for their cause even if they feel those beliefs are just as ridiculous as the christian's...

"The enemy of my enemy is my friend"

Your secrets are the true reflection of who you really are...

[Amazon 7]

Coreece

******Nothing new...There have been plenty of churches denied because of various reasons disguised behind zoning laws...no big deal. Christians have paved the way for laws that protect various religious freedoms...It's not the end of world. Nobody is denying your right to practice...

http://aclj.org/churches-organizations-/zoning-religious-land-use

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religious_Land_Use_and_Institutionalized_Persons_Act

So ... does your ALCJ protect the rights of other denominations or religions other than Christians.. ??? I am thinking...... NOT

I don't know...You'll have to do your own research, but they do seem to make a distinction between "churches" and "other religious organizations.

The point here isn't who the ACLJ protects...The point here is that the ACLJ actually has to exist.

In any event, there is always the RLUIPA...so just relax, it's not the end of the world...

Funny thing is that people come in here flaming away as if they actually care about pagan beliefs and cough up money for their cause even if they feel those beliefs are just as ridiculous as the christian's...

"The enemy of my enemy is my friend"

As I have said before... if we as a country are going to live up to the ideals of the Founding Fathers.... we had best follow what they put down in writing. Freedom of religion came about as a direct result of what they had been subjected to... and the not so distant history that had brought most of their families here only a couple generations or so before as they were escaping the atrocities of religious persecution in Europe in general and England in particular. Learn from the past, so you do not make the same mistakes in the future. If a group wishes to worship their creator in their own way perhaps we should allow them their own god given rights.. or none of us are free.

[Coreece 190]

Amazon

*********Nothing new...There have been plenty of churches denied because of various reasons disguised behind zoning laws...no big deal. Christians have paved the way for laws that protect various religious freedoms...It's not the end of world. Nobody is denying your right to practice...

http://aclj.org/churches-organizations-/zoning-religious-land-use

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religious_Land_Use_and_Institutionalized_Persons_Act

So ... does your ALCJ protect the rights of other denominations or religions other than Christians.. ??? I am thinking...... NOT

I don't know...You'll have to do your own research, but they do seem to make a distinction between "churches" and "other religious organizations.

The point here isn't who the ACLJ protects...The point here is that the ACLJ actually has to exist.

In any event, there is always the RLUIPA...so just relax, it's not the end of the world...

Funny thing is that people come in here flaming away as if they actually care about pagan beliefs and cough up money for their cause even if they feel those beliefs are just as ridiculous as the christian's...

"The enemy of my enemy is my friend"

As I have said before... if we as a country are going to live up to the ideals of the Founding Fathers.... we had best follow what they put down in writing. Freedom of religion came about as a direct result of what they had been subjected to... and the not so distant history that had brought most of their families here only a couple generations or so before as they were escaping the atrocities of religious persecution in Europe in general and England in particular. Learn from the past, so you do not make the same mistakes in the future. If a group wishes to worship their creator in their own way perhaps we should allow them their own god given rights.. or none of us are free.

I think we're doing a fine job at that...

As I said, Christians have paved the way with regard to religious freedoms in this country...

We have laws to protect us.

Suck it up cupcake.

Your secrets are the true reflection of who you really are...

[RonD1120 62]

kallend

***By golly, nothing like this could happen in Humboldt County CA.

It's called cultural relativity, usually taught in Sociology 101. Each culture has its own mores, folkways, traditions and customs. Arkansas is nothing like northern California.

Right. Arkansas is 50th out of 50 in % of population with advanced degrees, while CA is 14th. Arkansas is 49th out of 50 in % of population with bachelors' degrees, while CA is 14th. AR is a "red" state, CA is "blue".

I do not place that much value on advanced degrees or even bachelors' degrees. Been there, done that as the saying goes. I believe that education is important but degrees, not so much. They are kind of like a**holes, everybody has one.

Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them.

[kallend 2,028]

RonD1120

I believe that education is important but degrees, not so much. They are kind of like a**holes, everybody has one.

Not in Arkansas they don't, unless you consider 18.9% to be "everybody".

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[wmw999 2,460]

Telling someone that their church/mosque/synagogue/temple/whatever doesn't meet the requirements that are applied equally to everyone isn't persecution. You don't have massive weekly meetings in neighborhoods, zoning restrictions, tax changes, etc don't qualify as persecution if they're applied equally.

However if they're uneven (eg religious meetings are only considered such if they happen on Sunday, or "no minarets," or bells are OK but muezzins not), then it's more likely religious persecution.

Not certainly but the chances sure go up

Wendy P.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[wolfriverjoe 1,523]

RonD1120

By golly, nothing like this could happen in Humboldt County CA.

It's called cultural relativity, usually taught in Sociology 101. Each culture has its own mores, folkways, traditions and customs. Arkansas is nothing like northern California.

I was unaware that the 1st Amendment to the Bill of Rights was subject to cultural relativism.

Or to selective local enforcement.

If the article is accurate about the denial of the permit despite the presence of other churches in the zoning district and also correct about the city governments refusal to allow the Pagans to speak at the city council meeting, then this will be pretty much a slam-dunk lawsuit.

The only question will be how obstinate the city will be about appealing the decisions.

"There are NO situations which do not call for a French Maid outfit." Lucky McSwervy

"~ya don't GET old by being weak & stupid!" - Airtwardo

[jclalor 12]

Quote

It's called cultural relativity, usually taught in Sociology 101. Each culture has its own mores, folkways, traditions and customs. Arkansas is nothing like northern California.

Do you mean like slavery and segregation?

Perhaps you need to (re)take the high school class "introduction to American government"

Imagine a grammar school some where in Michigan, with a Muslim Majority, your head would explode if a Christian child there was forced to say an Islamic prayer every morning before class.

[RonD1120 62]

wolfriverjoe

***By golly, nothing like this could happen in Humboldt County CA.

It's called cultural relativity, usually taught in Sociology 101. Each culture has its own mores, folkways, traditions and customs. Arkansas is nothing like northern California.

I was unaware that the 1st Amendment to the Bill of Rights was subject to cultural relativism.

Or to selective local enforcement.

If the article is accurate about the denial of the permit despite the presence of other churches in the zoning district and also correct about the city governments refusal to allow the Pagans to speak at the city council meeting, then this will be pretty much a slam-dunk lawsuit.

The only question will be how obstinate the city will be about appealing the decisions.

And that my friend is how Andy9o8 makes a living.

Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them.

[RonD1120 62]

jclalor

Quote

It's called cultural relativity, usually taught in Sociology 101. Each culture has its own mores, folkways, traditions and customs. Arkansas is nothing like northern California.

Do you mean like slavery and segregation?

Perhaps you need to (re)take the high school class "introduction to American government"

Imagine a grammar school some where in Michigan, with a Muslim Majority, your head would explode if a Christian child there was forced to say an Islamic prayer every morning before class.

Slavery and segregation! That is an anachronism. But seriously, IMO, I don't believe strong Christian parents would allow their child in a public school with a Muslim majority. That is especially unlikely if the child was "forced" to repeat Islamic prayers. Again, call Andy9o8, that is how he earns professional fees.

Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them.

[Amazon 7]

RonD1120

***

Quote

It's called cultural relativity, usually taught in Sociology 101. Each culture has its own mores, folkways, traditions and customs. Arkansas is nothing like northern California.

Do you mean like slavery and segregation?

Perhaps you need to (re)take the high school class "introduction to American government"

Imagine a grammar school some where in Michigan, with a Muslim Majority, your head would explode if a Christian child there was forced to say an Islamic prayer every morning before class.

Slavery and segregation! That is an anachronism. But seriously, IMO, I don't believe strong Christian parents would allow their child in a public school with a Muslim majority. That is especially unlikely if the child was "forced" to repeat Islamic prayers. Again, call Andy9o8, that is how he earns professional fees.

Oh really... remember that thread about the wonderful folks down there in your neck of the woods who are effectively doing just that with the corrupt criminal justice system to the least fortunate. Put them in jail and keep charging them a set amount a day and they have no hope of ever getting out of..... wait for it.... the new American corporate debtors prison....

And I KNOW you are in an area that segregation may not be the law.. but it sure is the normal reality in schools housing and economic possibilities.

Ain't 'Murica great

[Coreece 190]

wmw999

Telling someone that their church/mosque/synagogue/temple/whatever doesn't meet the requirements that are applied equally to everyone isn't persecution. You don't have massive weekly meetings in neighborhoods, zoning restrictions, tax changes, etc don't qualify as persecution if they're applied equally.

However if they're uneven (eg religious meetings are only considered such if they happen on Sunday, or "no minarets," or bells are OK but muezzins not), then it's more likely religious persecution.

Not certainly but the chances sure go up

Wendy P.

In this country, if one is to persecute the church, then it's probably in their best interest to be subtle and disguise it some manner.

In any event, most "persecution" seen here in the U.S is child's play when compared to how pagans and christians have persecuted each other in the past...it's almost laughable.

We're fine...

Your secrets are the true reflection of who you really are...

[WoodlandWookiee 0]

What I'm curious about is why Christians (representing approximately ~80% of the United States population) are up in arms about being "prosecuted" when movements based on equality begin pressuring them. Whether it's comparative religion classes that focus equally on all major religions, marriage equality, equal permission to set up religious displays on public property--how exactly can a majority be prosecuted based on spreading equality?

Genuine question here.

[wolfriverjoe 1,523]

RonD1120

******By golly, nothing like this could happen in Humboldt County CA.

It's called cultural relativity, usually taught in Sociology 101. Each culture has its own mores, folkways, traditions and customs. Arkansas is nothing like northern California.

I was unaware that the 1st Amendment to the Bill of Rights was subject to cultural relativism.

Or to selective local enforcement.

If the article is accurate about the denial of the permit despite the presence of other churches in the zoning district and also correct about the city governments refusal to allow the Pagans to speak at the city council meeting, then this will be pretty much a slam-dunk lawsuit.

The only question will be how obstinate the city will be about appealing the decisions.

And that my friend is how Andy9o8 makes a living.

Well, if the city officials would actually read the Constitution and the Bill of Rights, and apply them fairly and evenly to everyone, then there wouldn't be any call for the lawyers, now would there?

Unfortunately, the bigoted and ignorant majority often feels it has the power to deny rights to an unpopular minority.

Fortunately (for everyone) the courts have decided that isn't allowed.
Unfortunately, the bigoted and ignorant majority has to have this lesson repeated over and over again.

Which is where the lawyers come in.

As a side note, I went through Harrison AR a couple weeks ago. I found THIS billboard combination to be somewhat ironic.
It kind of reinforces the image a lot of people have about that area.

"There are NO situations which do not call for a French Maid outfit." Lucky McSwervy

"~ya don't GET old by being weak & stupid!" - Airtwardo

[funjumper101 15]

RonD1120

***

Quote

It's called cultural relativity, usually taught in Sociology 101. Each culture has its own mores, folkways, traditions and customs. Arkansas is nothing like northern California.

Do you mean like slavery and segregation?

Perhaps you need to (re)take the high school class "introduction to American government"

Imagine a grammar school some where in Michigan, with a Muslim Majority, your head would explode if a Christian child there was forced to say an Islamic prayer every morning before class.

Slavery and segregation! That is an anachronism. But seriously, IMO, I don't believe strong Christian parents would allow their child in a public school with a Muslim majority. That is especially unlikely if the child was "forced" to repeat Islamic prayers. Again, call Andy9o8, that is how he earns professional fees.

Here is a tough question for you, Ron. Just how exactly did slavery and segregation come to be an anachronism?

Here is another tough question for you, Ron. Why would it be necessary for "strong Christian parents" to remove their children from public schools that have a Muslim majority?

Here is the third tough question for you. How is it that a Muslim or Jewish child is expected, by some people, to tolerate and participate in Christian prayers in public schools?

Keep in mind that, by your own words, no "strong Christian parents" would allow their children to be forced to tolerate and participate in another religion's prayers in public schools.


I look forward to your well reasoned answers to my challenging questions.

[RonD1120 62]

Question 1: Republicans
Question 2: Safety
Question 3: They are not.

Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them.

[Amazon 7]

RonD1120

Question 1: Republicans
Question 2: Safety
Question 3: They are not.

The Republicans of 150 years ago up till Eisenhower.. the Party of Lincoln.. before the Blue Dog Dixiecrats infested the GOP to become the Dixpublicans of today that are trying to return us to the Days of Glory they believe existed once upon a time.

[Coreece 190]

WoodlandWookiee

What I'm curious about is why Christians (representing approximately ~80% of the United States population) are up in arms about being "prosecuted" when movements based on equality begin pressuring them.

Somebody lied to you, sista...

Your secrets are the true reflection of who you really are...

[skinnay 0]

Coreece

***What I'm curious about is why Christians (representing approximately ~80% of the United States population) are up in arms about being "prosecuted" when movements based on equality begin pressuring them.

Somebody lied to you, sista...

Yep, it's more like 70% now, good thing we have less of them every year.