Senate CIA Torture Report

[ryoder 1,590]

In case someone wants to read the actual report, rather than a 3rd-party's opinion, here it is:

http://cryptome.org/2014/12/cia-torture-report.pdf

500 pages, PDF format, 108MB.

"There are only three things of value: younger women, faster airplanes, and bigger crocodiles" - Arthur Jones.

[JohnnyMarko 1]

I'll wait for a 3rd party opinion from either Marc or John.

[jakee 1,489]

I think the problem is that it's so clear cut in its conclusion that it will be dismissed out of hand as partisan politicking*.


* I'm not 100% sure that's a word. It should be.

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[RonD1120 62]

I'll probably wait for the 3rd party spins. I believe it is being released now to take the focus off Gruber's Congressional testimony. Secondly, I think it will continue to allege that it is all Bush's fault. And thirdly, water boarding and sleep deprivation IMO is not torture.

Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them.

[lawrocket 3]

Maybe they're just trying to make a cut-off of the House Benghazi report, which is expected to clobber Obama.

Oh, wait. That report was released to a large number of crickets because it didn't hammer the Admin.

My wife is hotter than your wife.

[okalb 104]

RonD1120

And thirdly, water boarding and sleep deprivation IMO is not torture.

What is it then?

Time flies like an arrow....fruit flies like a banana

[GeorgiaDon 362]

Quote

...sleep deprivation IMO is not torture.

Sleep deprivation for 180 hours (more than a week!) while being kept nearly naked in a freezing cold room with your hands tied together and chained to the ceiling is not torture?

Waterboarding people to the point where they have to be resuscitated by medical personnel is not torture?

Freezing people until they die of hypothermia is not torture?

Next, I suppose you will tell John McCain that the North Vietnamese kept him in a Club Med all those years.

I guess it's all relative though, to someone who believes eternal torment in never-ending fire is a "just punishment" for, well, anything.

Don

_____________________________________
Tolerance is the cost we must pay for our adventure in liberty. (Dworkin, 1996)
“Education is not filling a bucket, but lighting a fire.” (Yeats)

[jakee 1,489]

RonD1120

I'll probably wait for the 3rd party spins. I believe it is being released now to take the focus off Gruber's Congressional testimony. Secondly, I think it will continue to allege that it is all Bush's fault. And thirdly, water boarding and sleep deprivation IMO is not torture.

The waterboarding technique was physically harmful, inducing convulsions and vomiting. Abu Zubaydah, for example, became "completely unresponsive, with bubbles rising through his open, full mouth."

Internal CIA records describe the waterboarding of Khalid Shaykh Mohammad as evolving into a "series of near drownings."

Sleep deprevation involved keeping detainees awake for up to 180 hours, usually standing or in stress positions, at times with their hands shackled above their heads. At least 5 detainees experienced disturbing hallucinations.

Contrary to CIA representations to DOJ, the CIA instructed personnel that the interrogation of Abu Zubaydah would take precedence over his medical care, resulting in the deterioration of a bullet wound he suffered during capture.

CIA detainees were subjected to rectal rehydration or rectal feeding without documented medical necessity.

CIA detainees at the COBALT detention facility were kept in complete darkness and constantly shackled in isolated cells with loud noise or music and only a bucket to use for human waste. Lack of heat at the facility likely contributed to the death of a detainee. The chief of interrogations described COBALT as a "dungeon."

At times, the detainees at COBALT were walked around naked or were shackled with their hands above their heads for extended periods of time. Other times, the detainees at COBALT were subjected to what was described as a "rough takedown," in which approximately five CIA officers would scream at a detainee, drag him outside of his cell, cut his clothes off, and secure him with Mylar tape. The detainee would then be hooded and dragged up and down a long corridor while being slapped and punched.

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[jakee 1,489]

GeorgiaDon

Quote

...sleep deprivation IMO is not torture.

Sleep deprivation for 180 hours (more than a week!) while being kept nearly naked in a freezing cold room with your hands tied together and chained to the ceiling is not torture?

Waterboarding people to the point where they have to be resuscitated by medical personnel is not torture?

Freezing people until they die of hypothermia is not torture?

But Don, none of that matters since we got so much useful information from the bastards!

While being subjected to the CIA's enhanced interrogation techniques and afterwards, multiple CIA detainees fabricated information, resulting in faulty intelligence. Detainees provided fabricated information on critical intelligence issues, including the terrorist threats which the CIA identified as its highest priorities.

Ok, well, I guess the most important thing is that we hurt bad people. Because freedom!

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[RonD1120 62]

Interrogation

Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them.

[RonD1120 62]

Did you read the report? I did not. Does it state that we did all those things?

John McCain was tortured. The North Vietnamese had a justified reason for doing it.

We used enhanced interrogation following 9/11. We were justified in doing so.

I am a hard liner, you know that.

Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them.

[Croc 0]

Another low point in the quickly declining moral values of our once great nation. Nothing good can ever come from torture. The ends never justify the means. Evil will flourish as long as "good" men and women allow it.

"Here's a good specimen of my own wisdom. Something is so, except when it isn't so."

Charles Fort, commenting on the many contradictions of astronomy

[Croc 0]

Do unto others as you would have them do unto you.

Your Bible.

"Here's a good specimen of my own wisdom. Something is so, except when it isn't so."

Charles Fort, commenting on the many contradictions of astronomy

[Andy9o8 2]

Quote

water boarding and sleep deprivation IMO is not torture.

You don't say. Well, then you might as well add Rectal Feeding to that list.

By the way, Senator John McCain, who, you'll forgive me, I find more persuasive in such matters than you, noted that in World War II, the United States military hanged Japanese soldiers for waterboarding American prisoners of war.

Learn more about how waterboarding is not torture Here.

[RonD1120 62]

I'm sorry, I remember how I felt and reacted to 9/11. I do not have sympathy for terrorists.

In reference to the Japanese, we always learn, adapt and become more adept at what our enemies teach.

I pity the next big enemy after ISIS.

Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them.

[jakee 1,489]

RonD1120

Did you read the report? I did not. Does it state that we did all those things?

Yes. See (as you're so fond of saying) post #8.

Quote

John McCain was tortured. The North Vietnamese had a justified reason for doing it.

We used enhanced interrogation following 9/11. We were justified in doing so.

How so? In either case?

And, given whatever reason you come up with, was 9/11 justified?

Quote

I am a hard liner, you know that.

With all seriousness, I believe the word you're looking for is fascist.

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[ryoder 1,590]

RonD1120

And thirdly, water boarding and sleep deprivation IMO is not torture.

Mancow Muller didn't think waterboarding was torture, but he had the balls to put his money where his mouth was and try it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qUkj9pjx3H0
He experienced a conversion.

As for sleep deprivation, medical research has shown it causes loss of neurons, and may trigger Alzheimer's disease:
http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2014/04/03/sleep-loss-alzheimers-disease.aspx

"There are only three things of value: younger women, faster airplanes, and bigger crocodiles" - Arthur Jones.

[kallend 2,026]

RonD1120

Did you read the report? I did not. Does it state that we did all those things?

John McCain was tortured. The North Vietnamese had a justified reason for doing it.

We used enhanced interrogation following 9/11. We were justified in doing so.

I am a hard liner, you know that.

I'm sure Jesus likes your attitude. Matches exactly what he preached in the Sermon on the Mount.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[RonD1120 62]

In reference to rectal feeding, back in the '70s some folks spoke of doing cocaine in that manner. For al Quaeda, a nice touch would be to dip the insertion tube in pig dung.

Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them.

[rhaig 0]

JohnnyMarko

I'll wait for a 3rd party opinion from either Marc or John.

Start the popcorn.

--
Rob

[RonD1120 62]

Yeah, you folks get me riled up. I'm going to be forced to repent, I think. Well, first I have to sort out the benefits of salvation versus defeating an evil enemy. Isn't that called a conundrum?

Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them.

[grue 1]

RonD1120

I'm sorry, I remember how I felt and reacted to 9/11. I do not have sympathy for terrorists.

Do you have sympathy for people who view the US's actions overseas as terroristic, who have lost their loved ones to unprovoked attacks on civilians?

cavete terrae.

[jakee 1,489]

RonD1120

Yeah, you folks get me riled up. I'm going to be forced to repent, I think. Well, first I have to sort out the benefits of salvation versus defeating an evil enemy. Isn't that called a conundrum?

Um, no? If you believe that this life is temporal and salvation is eternal then how could it even be a contest? It sounds like you're deciding whether to be faithful or a fanatic, and leaning heavily in favour of fanaticism.

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[grue 1]

RonD1120

In reference to rectal feeding, back in the '70s some folks spoke of doing cocaine in that manner. For al Quaeda, a nice touch would be to dip the insertion tube in pig dung.

Meanwhile your counterpart on the other side is thinking that if they want to torture christians they'll have to leave anything to do with the asshole being penetrated out of it, since that's something the crucifix-wearing crowd grow up on the receiving end and it's just nostalgia. To really offend his victims, he'd need to subject them to living without hypocrisy.

cavete terrae.

[kallend 2,026]

Nothing very surprising in the report.

The thing that surprised me most is that Dick Cheney came out and denied that it was a rogue operation with Bush kept in the dark. He said it was all authorized.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.