Broke multiple laws no problem 3 years free tax refunds

[kallend 2,030]

turtlespeed

******
They are a criminal, nothing they do can be legal, .

Factually INCORRECT. Which makes the rest of your claims moot.

The immigrant being illegal makes the argument mute.

1. You used the word "criminal". Undocumented presence alone is not a violation of federal criminal law. They are not "criminals" unless some other, actually criminal, offense has been committed.

2. The word is "moot", not "mute".

3. Ergo, you are WRONG.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[turtlespeed 221]

kallend

*********
They are a criminal, nothing they do can be legal, .

Factually INCORRECT. Which makes the rest of your claims moot.

The immigrant being illegal makes the argument mute.

1. You used the word "criminal". Undocumented presence alone is not a violation of federal criminal law. They are not "criminals" unless some other, actually criminal, offense has been committed.

2. The word is "moot", not "mute".

3. Ergo, you are WRONG.

Tell Steve jobs to stop making corrections to my typing then.

I will concede to partially wrong. Illegal entry into this country is a misdemeanor punishable by up to 6 months in jail. But you are correct it is a civil violation, which is still illegal, to just be here when you legally should not be.

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[normiss 806]

Meaning not criminal.

[turtlespeed 221]

normiss

Meaning not criminal.

Yes. Meaning that not every single illegal alien is here criminally.

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[Andy9o8 2]

Quote

Tell Steve jobs to stop making corrections to my typing then.

Um. He doesn't take my calls.

[Andy9o8 2]

Channman

******How do you legally pay taxes as an illegal alien with no ss number?

Well, they pay the same taxes on typical consumer goods and services that most everybody else does.
No, it's unlikely they pay income taxes on their pay for picking the produce on your plate, for which they almost certainly get paid below minimum wage. And if you're worried about how much in tax revenue goes uncollected for that, compare it to the fact that most of the income earned by the wealthiest people in the US is taxed not as ordinary income (like yours or mine), but at the bargain-basement 15% rate for capital gains. How much is lost by not taxing that shit as ordinary income?

Look at the big picture.

>"...bargain-basement 15% rate for capital gains."

Capital gains are not a bad thing. I have a 401K account, Roth IRA, stocks, and some property. I hope to enjoy the same tax rate as those with larger assets than myself when I sell some of my property. I think the issue is, the wealthy in many cases are selling an asset which generates an income stream and having only to pay 15%.

Millions of American's receive their income from wages or (Ordinary Income) which can be taxed at a higher rates. I don't see that being unfair, I see it as an opportunity to mirror the habits of the wealthy as best one can and reap the rewards.

My point isn't referring to middle-class folks like yourself who have some investments alongside your ordinary income. It's directed to the 1-percenters, who derive the majority of their income streams, for the majority of their lives, from assets classified as capital gains, and then are subsidized by the rest of society by having that taxed at the 15% capital gains rate.
My point was, that the amount of revenue uncollected by illegal immigrants who don't pay income taxes on their usually very low wages (net the offset gain from their production of cheap goods and services) is probably a good deal less than the amount of revenues that would be collected if those 1-percenters' capital gains were taxed closer to the ordinary income rate.

Put another way: either go after both problems, or go after the bigger of the problems. But stop the hypocrisy of scapegoating the far lesser of the problems, populated by those who have orders of magnitude less power to advocate for themselves and rebut being demonized. Like pickpockets, the real thieves are diverting attention to the scapegoats while they're the ones who really have their sticky hands around your wallet.

[funjumper101 15]

Anvilbrother

Holy fucking broken system. Look we know your here illegally, but you can pay us and by law we can't tell on you.

How else could all of the businesses that hire undocumented immigrants be able to take advantage of the low wages they'll accept? You can't exploit the needy without a "legal" way to to do so.

I see NONE of the Reich Wing Conservatives that despise "illegals" mention anything about punishing businesses that HIRE the people that they despise.

I can hear it now. The RWCs will reply with "That would hurt small businessmen. How are they supposed to find out legal or illegal status? It isn't the business owners responsibility to deal with those issues. etc, etc"

If there was a substantial fine, say $25,000.00, and a 60 day mandatory jail sentence for any business owner or corporate officer that knowingly hired illegal immigrants, the employment opportunities for the people the RWCs despise would dry up quick. The labor pool would shrink considerably. This would cause increasing wages for the people who have legal status, but won't work for cheap. A win for the folks at the low end of the economic ladder.

[billvon 3,008]

>If there was a substantial fine, say $25,000.00, and a 60 day mandatory jail
>sentence for any business owner or corporate officer that knowingly hired
>illegal immigrants, the employment opportunities for the people the RWCs
>despise would dry up quick. The labor pool would shrink considerably. This
>would cause increasing wages for the people who have legal status, but won't
>work for cheap. A win for the folks at the low end of the economic ladder.

I disagree. Crackdowns on immigrant labor have traditionally harmed lower income people. In 2011, a crackdown on illegal immigration in Georgia resulted in millions of dollars worth of crops rotting on the fields. The farmers could not get enough domestic help at any reasonable price.

So farms closed, and the rest of the people employed by those crops (other farm workers, truckers, warehouse workers, tractor salesmen, farm-supply stores) were out of a job. From an OTB article from 2011:

==========
The pain this is causing is real. People are going to lose their crops, and in some cases their farms. The small-town businesses that supply those farms with goods and services are going to suffer as well. For economically embattled rural Georgia, this could be a major blow.
==========

[funjumper101 15]

billvon

>If there was a substantial fine, say $25,000.00, and a 60 day mandatory jail
>sentence for any business owner or corporate officer that knowingly hired
>illegal immigrants, the employment opportunities for the people the RWCs
>despise would dry up quick. The labor pool would shrink considerably. This
>would cause increasing wages for the people who have legal status, but won't
>work for cheap. A win for the folks at the low end of the economic ladder.

I disagree. Crackdowns on immigrant labor have traditionally harmed lower income people. In 2011, a crackdown on illegal immigration in Georgia resulted in millions of dollars worth of crops rotting on the fields. The farmers could not get enough domestic help at any reasonable price.

So farms closed, and the rest of the people employed by those crops (other farm workers, truckers, warehouse workers, tractor salesmen, farm-supply stores) were out of a job. From an OTB article from 2011:

==========
The pain this is causing is real. People are going to lose their crops, and in some cases their farms. The small-town businesses that supply those farms with goods and services are going to suffer as well. For economically embattled rural Georgia, this could be a major blow.
==========

The Reich Wing Conservatives got exactly what they asked for in Georgia. A crackdown on undocumented immigrants. The unintended consequences of the crackdown caused major economic damage.

Imagine that. The exact results that were predicted by LIBERALS occurred exactly as predicted. The average RWC learned NOTHING from the Georgia experience. Their media outlets still promote fictitious bullshit that gets parroted by the RWCs.

Billy's post -

Maybe if we can get a Republican in the white house, he'll get that border secured.

We built the Panama Canal over 100 years ago. We can put up a 2000 mile wall line and topped with concerta wire.

Enough is enough with all the fucking illegals pouring in.
<<< End

is a perfect example of the parroting of the lies spread the Reich Wing Media.

Even if a moron like Perry became POTUS, God forbid, he would not actually work toward fencing the southern border. The hundreds of billions of dollars it would take to fence off the southern border, and billions more to adequately monitor that disaster would a total and complete waste of taxpayer money. It wouldn't work. It would right up there with the F35 as a boondoggle. I won't even mention the economic damage that would occur if such a disaster were constructed.

"All the illegals pouring in" is factually incorrect, but that never stopped the RWC media machine from repeating the lies that are believed as fact by the gullible.

They find many people who can't discern between fact and fiction, as long as the fiction has the "truthiness" required to

[airdvr 210]

funjumper101

I see NONE of the Reich Wing Conservatives that despise "illegals" mention anything about punishing businesses that HIRE the people that they despise.

Ahem...post 44 - Perhaps the government ought to spend more time going after employers who hire illegals

Do you like your crow served warm or cold?

Please don't dent the planet.

Destinations by Roxanne

[grue 1]

Andy9o8

Quote

Tell Steve jobs to stop making corrections to my typing then.

Um. He doesn't take my calls.

What, you don't have iOuija installed?

cavete terrae.

[funjumper101 15]

airdvr

***
I see NONE of the Reich Wing Conservatives that despise "illegals" mention anything about punishing businesses that HIRE the people that they despise.

Ahem...post 44 - Perhaps the government ought to spend more time going after employers who hire illegals

Do you like your crow served warm or cold?

I missed reading a post in this thread? One post. Gee, that is SO awful.
I feel really bad... NOT!

Maybe you could go find the message I replied to. At the time the message was written, that was as far as I had gotten into the thread. As of that time not a one of the RWCs had brought up the concept of going after the employers.

Just out of curiosity, how many of the RWCs went along with you, and how many didn't?

[Anvilbrother 0]

Many of us who you incorrectly call your silly childish names have called for fines, you should do a search before your wrong again.

Postes r made from an iPad or iPhone. Spelling and gramhair mistakes guaranteed move along,

[Boomerdog 0]

May I humbly and with all deference encourage you to wake up and smell the coffee.

[turtlespeed 221]

Boomerdog

May I humbly and with all deference encourage you to wake up and smell the coffee.

In reference to what?

The facts or the implication?

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[grue 1]

Boomerdog

May I humbly and with all deference encourage you to wake up and smell the coffee.

I for one fucking hate the smell of coffee.

cavete terrae.

[Boomerdog 0]

Quote

Are you implying that illegals can and do vote?
In reference to what?
The facts or the implication?

Try both.

[Boomerdog 0]

Quote

I for one fucking hate the smell of coffee.

OK...

[Anvilbrother 0]

http://national.suntimes.com/us-news/7/72/764666/social-security-audit

Quote

There are over 6.5 million “people” with Social Security numbers over the age of 112, according to an audit by the Social Security Administration’s inspector general.

Findings by the Gerontology Research Group hold that there have been only 35 people known to reach the age of 112 in the world.

The audit report found that death dates had not been entered for these individuals into their electronic file, called Numident. The study found that the SSA was not properly equipped to “annotate death information on the Numident records of numberholders who exceeded maximum reasonable life expectancies and were likely deceased.”

The report says, ”We obtained Numident data that identified approximately 6.5 million numberholders born before June 16, 1901 who did not have a date of death on their record.”

A relatively small number of Social Security numbers were used in attempt to apply for work.

“During Calendar Years 2008 through 2011, SSA received 4,024 E-Verify inquiries using the SSNs of 3,873 numberholders born before June 16, 1901,” the report says. “These inquiries indicate individuals’ attempts to use the SSNs to apply for work.”

These are just the identity thefts reported for people born before 1901 imagine the others.

Postes r made from an iPad or iPhone. Spelling and gramhair mistakes guaranteed move along,