Hey look: Another one ...

[christelsabine 1]

http://www.news-record.com/news/wisconsin-police-black-man-dies-after-shot-by-officer/article_6637170e-c4f1-11e4-b380-4fd0b5c0ea3a.html

Seems to appear on a weekly (?) basis .....

dudeist skydiver # 3105

[lawrocket 3]

Are you once again putting the US down?

Okay. I'll just speak for all Americans when I say that it indeed is terrible. Semi weekly is a pretty awful track record and the death toll from American police is a disgrace.

We know that Germany is way better at it that the US, but show a little class. Your country is pretty much considered square km by square km the all time champ at killing people. Show some grace. America will never be as effective as Germany at killing its citizenry so stop rubbing it in.

America doesn't even want to be good at it. So we'll concede defeat. Hopefully this will end your persistent taunting.

My wife is hotter than your wife.

[BillyVance 34]

Ooooooo BURN!!



Oh by the way, where's that turd mpohl? Haven't seen him since the community bitch-slapped him in the GOP hates America thread.

"Mediocre people don't like high achievers, and high achievers don't like mediocre people." - SIX TIME National Champion coach Nick Saban

[skycop 0]

Quote

The officer went to an apartment where he thought the man had gone, and forced his way inside after hearing a disturbance. Koval said the officer was assaulted by the 19-year-old and then fired at him. Koval said he believes there was more than one shot fired.

Hmmm, again this was 100% preventable, fighting with an armed man is a VERY bad idea.

Speaking of Germany, if you decide to fight the Polizei I would assure you there is not a good outcome.

We'll see how the investigation plays out.

"Just 'cause I'm simple, don't mean I'm stewpid!"

[christelsabine 1]

Me... putting the US down? You guys are doing that yourselves on a regular basis, right? You do not need aliens for that.

And for the rest of your post ...

Some time ago, I showed my doubts about your professionalism, I hereby repeat it. Such a load of nonsense.

dudeist skydiver # 3105

[christelsabine 1]

Which community? You and 2 or 3 other oldies on board form *a community* ??

dudeist skydiver # 3105

[masterblaster72 0]

Since you're German I suppose you can expect Godwin to be invoked immediately at any hint of criticism of the US. Such is the highly sophisticated level of discussion in this forum.

Be humble, ask questions, listen, learn, follow the golden rule, talk when necessary, and know when to shut the fuck up.

[turtlespeed 220]

christelsabine

Me... putting the US down? You guys are doing that yourselves on a regular basis, right? You do not need aliens for that.

And for the rest of your post ...

Some time ago, I showed my doubts about your professionalism, I hereby repeat it. Such a load of nonsense.

Which part is nonsense?
The per square kilometer of citizenry killing?

I'm pretty sure you guys still hold that title.

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[BillyVance 34]

christelsabine

Which community? You and 2 or 3 other oldies on board form *a community* ??

Nobody, except you perhaps, care much for Mpohl's posting style. Not all of them choose to stand up and tell him off.

His last few posts smacked of white power aryan nation neo nazi ideologue. Get somebody mad, sometimes they show their true colors.

"Mediocre people don't like high achievers, and high achievers don't like mediocre people." - SIX TIME National Champion coach Nick Saban

[BIGUN 1,313]

christelsabine

Which community? You and 2 or 3 other oldies on board form *a community* ??

You're here, aren't you?

Nobody has time to listen; because they're desperately chasing the need of being heard.

[wolfriverjoe 1,523]

skycop

Quote

The officer went to an apartment where he thought the man had gone, and forced his way inside after hearing a disturbance. Koval said the officer was assaulted by the 19-year-old and then fired at him. Koval said he believes there was more than one shot fired.

Hmmm, again this was 100% preventable, fighting with an armed man is a VERY bad idea.

Speaking of Germany, if you decide to fight the Polizei I would assure you there is not a good outcome.

We'll see how the investigation plays out.

For anyone that wants to discuss the actual facts (or at least reported facts) of the incident, rather than just snipe at each other:

This is somewhat local to me. Madison is a couple hours away. It's all over the local news.
And the cops are doing a pretty good job of getting the info out. They aren't stalling or stonewalling. They are (of course) not telling everything they know, but it's a long, long way from what happened in Ferguson.

Madison has been the "Liberal Hotbed" of Wisconsin for a long, long time. WI is a pretty conservative state overall, and Madison is one of the few areas that is predominantly liberal.

The cops there are, overall, pretty good. But they've 'opened their mouth and shot themselves in the foot' a few times over the years.

As Skycop quoted above, the cops responded to a call, followed the "He went thataway" from the complainants, forced their way into an apartment, and dude attacked the cop.
Cop was in full uniform, accompanied by a bunch of other uniforms, they had pounded on the door and announced "Police! Open the door!"
And there were cop cars all over the street with their lights on (No chance whatsoever that he thought that it was a home invasion).

The protesters are doing the 'Hands up, don't shoot' chant, but that really doesn't appear to be the case here.

His mom has been on the news, tearfully asking why her son has become another statistic, claiming that he wouldn't have attacked the cop, her son wouldn't do something like that.

But he has a conviction for armed robbery (haven't seen any details on that).

And in a refreshing note, Wisconsin (particularly Milwaukee) has had a number of questionable cases of 'suspect deaths', some while in custody. So the policy has been put in place that in these sorts of cases, the investigation is not done by the agency that is being investigated.
It must be done by an external agency. In this case, it's going to be done by the Wisconsin Dept of Justice.

So I have a reasonably solid expectation that the investigation will be fairly and competently done.

And if the facts that are coming out are correct, then it sounds like a clean shoot.

Now back to your regular "I know you are but what am I" bickering.

"There are NO situations which do not call for a French Maid outfit." Lucky McSwervy

"~ya don't GET old by being weak & stupid!" - Airtwardo

[lawrocket 3]

christelsabine

Me... putting the US down? You guys are doing that yourselves on a regular basis, right? You do not need aliens for that.

And for the rest of your post ...

Some time ago, I showed my doubts about your professionalism, I hereby repeat it. Such a load of nonsense.

I have long stated that I have issues with the whole sense of supremacy thing with Germans. It's gotten Germany into trouble in the past. When a language has a specific word for taking pleasure in the suffering of others it says something. And I do detect a great deal of schadenfreude from you with every sad event that occurs in the U.S.

Here's the thing. I don't paint myself as the moral high ground. I don't say that everyone should do things like me. I don't say that everybody else should do what the US does because other places aren't the US. US history has its share of genocide. You could ask the Indians of the Ohio Valley had we not killed them all. I get that.

But when I read that Oskar Groening is to be tried on thousands of counts of accessory to murder while doing government work it seemed somewhat clear that this is a pretty historically fresh thing.

Note about Godwin: yes. It's a little difficult to discuss Germany's historical moral shortcomings without reference to that period of time. But in the interest of fairness I did put a reference to the Soviet Union in there, since I listed Germany as merely the square km for square km champ at killing civilians. That was a reference to the USSR's massive geographical coverage.

Yes, if you were not so snobby and holier than thou I wouldn't have as much of a problem.

My wife is hotter than your wife.

[masterblaster72 0]

lawrocket

I listed Germany as merely the square km for square km champ at killing civilians.

Since that's the second time this is mentioned, I'll call the bs. That title would go to Rwanda, not Germany.

Be humble, ask questions, listen, learn, follow the golden rule, talk when necessary, and know when to shut the fuck up.

[christelsabine 1]

Schadenfreude is not my characteristic.

Welcome to 2015!

This is actual:

http://www.presstv.ir/Detail/2015/03/08/400810/US-has-systemic-problem-with-racism

Comparing *Deutsches Reich* (btw: more than 70 yrs ago) with todays Germany is daffy.

You should clean your own back yard, instead of digging out old shit of other countries. That does not help your own problems.

It's all over the media. That killing of black people in the US is pure racism. How should I - a white German with Jewish background - feel any schadenfreude over killing those poor souls? Just idiotic.

dudeist skydiver # 3105

[BillyVance 34]

Quote

The Holocaust was a genocide in which approximately six million Jews were killed by the Nazi regime and its collaborators. An additional five million non-Jewish victims of Nazi mass murders are included by some historians bringing the total to approximately eleven million. Killings took place throughout Nazi Germany and German-occupied territories.

From 1941 to 1945, Jews were targeted and methodically murdered in a genocide, one of the largest in history, and part of a broader aggregate of acts of oppression and killings of various ethnic and political groups in Europe by the Nazis. Every arm of Germany's bureaucracy was involved in the logistics of the genocide, turning the Third Reich into "a genocidal state". Non-Jewish victims of broader Nazi crimes include Gypsies, Poles, communists, homosexuals, Soviet POWs, and the mentally and physically disabled. In total, approximately 11 million people were killed, including approximately one million Jewish children. Of the nine million Jews who had resided in Europe before the Holocaust, approximately two-thirds were killed. A network of about 42,500 facilities in Germany and German-occupied territories were used to concentrate, confine, and kill Jews and other victims. Between 100,000 and 500,000 people were direct participants in the planning and execution of the Holocaust.

Quote

The Rwandan Genocide was a genocidal mass slaughter of Tutsi and moderate Hutu in Rwanda by members of the Hutu majority. During the approximate 100-day period from April 7, 1994, to mid-July, an estimated 500,000–1,000,000 Rwandans were killed,[1] constituting as much as 20% of the country's total population and 70% of the Tutsi then living in Rwanda. The genocide was planned by members of the core political elite known as the akazu, many of whom occupied positions at top levels of the national government. Perpetrators came from the ranks of the Rwandan army, the National Police (gendarmerie), government-backed militias including the Interahamwe and Impuzamugambi, and the Hutu civilian population.

Rwanda 10,169 square miles in size
Germany 137,847 square miles in size

Rwanda - using 500,000 deaths = 49.17 deaths per square mile
using 1,000,000 deaths = 98.34 deaths per square mile

Germany - 79.80 deaths per square mile

But then you have concentration camps not only in Germany, but also Poland and other neighboring countries that Nazy Germany controlled. So it all depends on how you look at it.

Germany not only exterminated Jews, they also targeted gays and lesbians, the disabled, and communists.

Sorry, but you Germans are gonna be wearing that badge of shame for at least as long as there are people who experienced or lived through it, are still alive to tell about it.

"Mediocre people don't like high achievers, and high achievers don't like mediocre people." - SIX TIME National Champion coach Nick Saban

[lawrocket 3]

You've seen my comments with regard to the state of US policing. I will not say that it is primarily due to any institutional racism, though this is a factor in many instances. There is a lot of culture clash, but police aren't trusted here like they were.

I understand that Germany is a different place now. Understand that the US is also a changing place. My backyard has a whole pile of compost and it bothers me. I will not, however, look to blaming racism so easily. It's a cop out and won't solve the problem.

My wife is hotter than your wife.

[turtlespeed 220]

BillyVance

Quote

The Holocaust was a genocide in which approximately six million Jews were killed by the Nazi regime and its collaborators. An additional five million non-Jewish victims of Nazi mass murders are included by some historians bringing the total to approximately eleven million. Killings took place throughout Nazi Germany and German-occupied territories.

From 1941 to 1945, Jews were targeted and methodically murdered in a genocide, one of the largest in history, and part of a broader aggregate of acts of oppression and killings of various ethnic and political groups in Europe by the Nazis. Every arm of Germany's bureaucracy was involved in the logistics of the genocide, turning the Third Reich into "a genocidal state". Non-Jewish victims of broader Nazi crimes include Gypsies, Poles, communists, homosexuals, Soviet POWs, and the mentally and physically disabled. In total, approximately 11 million people were killed, including approximately one million Jewish children. Of the nine million Jews who had resided in Europe before the Holocaust, approximately two-thirds were killed. A network of about 42,500 facilities in Germany and German-occupied territories were used to concentrate, confine, and kill Jews and other victims. Between 100,000 and 500,000 people were direct participants in the planning and execution of the Holocaust.

***The Rwandan Genocide was a genocidal mass slaughter of Tutsi and moderate Hutu in Rwanda by members of the Hutu majority. During the approximate 100-day period from April 7, 1994, to mid-July, an estimated 500,000–1,000,000 Rwandans were killed,[1] constituting as much as 20% of the country's total population and 70% of the Tutsi then living in Rwanda. The genocide was planned by members of the core political elite known as the akazu, many of whom occupied positions at top levels of the national government. Perpetrators came from the ranks of the Rwandan army, the National Police (gendarmerie), government-backed militias including the Interahamwe and Impuzamugambi, and the Hutu civilian population.

Rwanda 10,169 square miles in size
Germany 137,847 square miles in size

Rwanda - using 500,000 deaths = 49.17 deaths per square mile
using 1,000,000 deaths = 98.34 deaths per square mile

Germany - 79.80 deaths per square mile

But then you have concentration camps not only in Germany, but also Poland and other neighboring countries that Nazy Germany controlled. So it all depends on how you look at it.

Germany not only exterminated Jews, they also targeted gays and lesbians, the disabled, and communists.

Sorry, but you Germans are gonna be wearing that badge of shame for at least as long as there are people who experienced or lived through it, are still alive to tell about it.

Unless you are Iranian. They teach that it never happened.

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[BillyVance 34]

Quote

turtlespeed

***

Quote

The Holocaust

Unless you are Iranian. They teach that it never happened.

"Mediocre people don't like high achievers, and high achievers don't like mediocre people." - SIX TIME National Champion coach Nick Saban

[masterblaster72 0]

BillyVance

Rwanda 10,169 square miles in size
Germany 137,847 square miles in size

Rwanda - using 500,000 deaths = 49.17 deaths per square mile
using 1,000,000 deaths = 98.34 deaths per square mile

Germany - 79.80 deaths per square mile

But then you have concentration camps not only in Germany, but also...
...

I could argue this but it's one of those internet arguments where I'd still feel like a retard if I won it.

I raise your hand in victory sir. All yours.

Be humble, ask questions, listen, learn, follow the golden rule, talk when necessary, and know when to shut the fuck up.

[skycop 0]

Quote

This is somewhat local to me. Madison is a couple hours away. It's all over the local news.
And the cops are doing a pretty good job of getting the info out. They aren't stalling or stonewalling. They are (of course) not telling everything they know, but it's a long, long way from what happened in Ferguson.

This is the absolute key, getting facts out QUICK. They absolutely failed at that in Ferguson.
People may not like them, but facts are facts.
I've seen some earlier interviews with Madison's Police Chief, he's well spoken and pretty candid.
This will be a study of the exact opposite of what happened media wise from the PD in Ferguson.

"Just 'cause I'm simple, don't mean I'm stewpid!"

[lawrocket 3]

skycop

Quote

This is somewhat local to me. Madison is a couple hours away. It's all over the local news.
And the cops are doing a pretty good job of getting the info out. They aren't stalling or stonewalling. They are (of course) not telling everything they know, but it's a long, long way from what happened in Ferguson.

This is the absolute key, getting facts out QUICK. They absolutely failed at that in Ferguson.
People may not like them, but facts are facts.
I've seen some earlier interviews with Madison's Police Chief, he's well spoken and pretty candid.
This will be a study of the exact opposite of what happened media wise from the PD in Ferguson.

I can't say that I'm confident that the results will be any different.

My wife is hotter than your wife.

[kallend 2,027]

BillyVance

Sorry, but you Germans are gonna be wearing that badge of shame for at least as long as there are people who experienced or lived through it, are still alive to tell about it.

In my experience, Germans are more willing to confront the Nazi past than southern whites are to confront Jim Crow and lynchings. In fact many southern whites seem determined to disenfranchise minorities once again.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[masterblaster72 0]

kallend

***

In my experience, Germans are more willing to confront the Nazi past than southern whites are to confront Jim Crow and lynchings.

+1, from my experiences as well.

Be humble, ask questions, listen, learn, follow the golden rule, talk when necessary, and know when to shut the fuck up.

[christelsabine 1]

Quote

....
Sorry, but you Germans are gonna be wearing that badge of shame for at least as long as there are people who experienced or lived through it, are still alive to tell about it.

Wrong. I do not wear that badge, my kids don't. It's people like you who use it to sidetrack from own waste dumps.

Wrong again: Our history will not only been told by survivors but, taught in history lessons in our schools for next thousand years. That's fully OK.

But, will that help your actual prestige in the world? Surely not.

Enjoy yourself digging out our history - helps, perhaps, to forget your presence?

dudeist skydiver # 3105

[lawrocket 3]

kallend

***
Sorry, but you Germans are gonna be wearing that badge of shame for at least as long as there are people who experienced or lived through it, are still alive to tell about it.

In my experience, Germans are more willing to confront the Nazi past than southern whites are to confront Jim Crow and lynchings. In fact many southern whites seem determined to disenfranchise minorities once again.

And in my experience Southern Whites are float more willin to confront the racism of past and present than the Northern Whites who continue to deny its very existence while relegating blacks to slums and ghettos and practicing the de facto segregation and bigotry while transferring intent to Southerners who have made great strides. By no means are they done but Northern Whites have a pretty good history of being bigots and acting like they aren't.

Edited to add: Or England. Remember Enoch Powell?

My wife is hotter than your wife.