Baltimore prosecutor charges police with murder in death of Freddie Gray

[skypuppy 1]

normiss

Neutral, non-political, human perspective

The interesting thing to me, is how many of the "angry old white men" are refusing to acknowledge how fucked up the system is. Because racism.

neutral? non-political? do you know anything about conrad black? You think he would ever write anything like that if he hadn't ended up in jail? And he only ended up in jail because he felt he was above the little peoples' laws...

Yeah, he probably feels the us justice system is too harsh - because they sent him to jail...

If some old guy can do it then obviously it can't be very extreme. Otherwise he'd already be dead.
Bruce McConkey 'I thought we were gonna die, and I couldn't think of anyone

[Coreeece 2]

normiss

The interesting thing to me, is how many of the "angry old white men" are refusing to acknowledge how fucked up the system is. Because racism.

Do you know what it's like to live in a city like Detroit?
Do you even know what it's like to live among black people?
Have you gone to a school with a predominately black population?
Have you worked in an institution where you're the only white boy working with hundreds of blacks?

Well, I have...

We're successful, happy and proud.... We laughed at ignorant white people back in the 90's for kissing black ass on the Fresh Prince as if it was only a joke....but now we see how your patronism and condescension are just a facade into a world with a false sense of nobility, enlightenment and progressiveness only to advance your own selfish political agenda...it's sick.

Never was there an answer....not without listening, without seeing - Gilmour

[normiss 798]

Yes to all, which is a large part of why I believe what I have seen.

[Boomerdog 0]

Granted, Dershowitz has that long history of self promotion and his comments are overshadowed by that. All that stated, there's a few things that should not be ignored.

If in theory and practice justice must be blind and free of as much emotional passion as possible (as Dershowitz aptly contends), Ms Mosby has set herself up. Instead of taking a detached/dispassionate view and speaking from the confines of the press room of the building she occupies, she goes out into the street to engage the masses, the masses who were responsible for the rioting, burning, looting etc. Rightly or wrongly, she's cast her lot and this is not something lost by the Baltimore PD or the Police Union. The implied warning from the Union for her to recuse herself is that if she does not, they'll begin opposition research on her and if they find anything substantive to use against her, will use it and do so unmercifully. Her "client" is not the audience she pandered to last week but the entire people of the State of Maryland as the charges against each will be "State of Maryland v. ......
If a judge grants a change of venue, she also knows her chances of gaining the convictions she's seeking are at real risk. And...these cases have not even gone (as they must) to a Grand Jury who will probably indict to the charges sought. But what if a no bill results particularly on the Murder 2 charge? Someone's gonna be lookin' awfully stupid.

I watched, re-watched, and listened as carefully as I could to her news conference. An expert I am certainly not but I could not help but come away with the distinct impression that Mosby has way too much of her ego into this one and she would do well to heed the words of Colin Powell "to not get your ego so close to your position that if your position falls, so goes your ego," and I'd add everything else.

Depsite Dershowitz's penchant for press and publicity, he may be right on this one and if Mosby fails to deliver which stands a good possibility given all the factors and moving parts of this case, chalk this one to an epic fail and more riots. As I said previously, she better have the slam dunk goods on these six cops because right now, she's in a place where even angels fear to tread.

[SkyDekker 1,465]

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Mark my words, the Baltimore PD will become reactive for the next several months, sitting back an answering radio calls. Watch what happens to the crime rate in Baltimore, especially the homicide rate. It happened in Cincinnati after the riots there. The victims of this increase in crime will be the very same people the prosecutor says she is trying to help.

That is a political decision, one that will cost dearly. Hammer the guys for what happened after the arrest, I'm good with that if there was misconduct. Again all the facts haven't come out yet, it will be interesting to say the least.

So the prosecutor is to blame because the Baltimore PD will stop doing their job?

Where is all this moral indignation when it comes to cops and prosecutors helping put innocent people in jail and helping put innocent people to death, in their zeal to get convictions.

Many a cop has overlooked evidence pointing in a different direction to ensure the current suspect gets convicted.

Lastly, you mentioned that they should have been charged with manslaughter in stead of murder. This is pretty much what happened. Only the driver got charged with depraved-heart murder, which I think is appropriate. He should have known his actions could lead to this. This is the same appropriate charge for somebody who would for instance throw a chunk of concrete off an overpass and ends up killing some one.

[Amazon 7]

DUUUUDE... New Keyboard time?????

[skycop 0]

The facts will come out.

I think she acted hastily, with political motivations. We'll see what the results are.

But please, continue with your broad generalizations and hyperbole..........

You failed to mention what I posted earlier, if the van driver did something intentional, then hammer him.

"Just 'cause I'm simple, don't mean I'm stewpid!"

[SkyDekker 1,465]

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I think she acted hastily, with political motivations.

It is an elected position, everything she does has political motivations. Why complain about it now?

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You failed to mention what I posted earlier, if the van driver did something intentional, then hammer him

In order to find out if he is guilty so one could "hammer him" he first has to get charged with something so a court case can follow.

How else should this be handled in your opinion?

[Boomerdog 0]

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...has to get charged with something so a court case can follow.

Actually, before a court case i.e. a trial can occur, a Grand Jury has to indict on the charges.

It's kinda how we do things South of you. I'll refer you to the Fifth Amendment, US Constitution...AKA, the law or rather our law. What you guys do up North is your business.

[SkyDekker 1,465]

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Actually, before a court case i.e. a trial can occur, a Grand Jury has to indict on the charges.

Yes there are steps in between. Though not in every state.

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I'll refer you to the Fifth Amendment, US Constitution...AKA, the law or rather our law.

The part of the 5th amendment that gives the right to be indicted by a grand jury has been held not to be incorporated against the states.

So, no this isn't how you do things South of me. Every State is different when it comes to Grand Juries, how they are used etc.

[normiss 798]

Isn't there also wording similar to "public threat" or something like that?


Too busy packing for Italy to research. I'm being forced to drag my beautiful wife through the country for her birthday.

[Boomerdog 0]

This one is going to a Grand Jury.

[hajnalka 0]

Thanks.

I'm just trying to think about this in a logical, sane manner.

It's difficult. I blame the media for making it even more difficult.

[rhaig 0]

So as it turns out, the knife in question was a spring assist blade.

http://www.cnn.com/2015/05/06/us/freddie-gray-knife/

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Court documents say it was a "spring-assisted, one-hand-operated knife." Mosby has said the knife was not a switchblade.

Switchblades are illegal in Maryland, but the law is even stricter in Baltimore.

"Baltimore City has a law that says it's not only illegal to have a switchblade, but it's also illegal to have a spring-action knife," said Andrew Alperstein, a defense attorney.

So the blade was legal under state law, but not city law.

--
Rob

[SkyDekker 1,465]

According to the defence attorneys.

Looks like it isn't that easy to determine the legality of a knife. My personal opinion is that in those cases, maybe a confiscation until legality is determined is more appropriate than arrest (and a rough ride and a killing).

[skycop 0]

http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/opinion/oped/bs-ed-freddie-gray-mosby-20150505-story.html

I've said it will get interesting when the actual facts come out.
If this is true, things will get more interesting.

Those cops will have the best defense possible, and eventually the actual facts will matter, and have to be decided on by a jury.

A hastened and potentially politically motivated prosecution hurts the case, doesn't help it.


On a side note.....
The Baltimore mayor is looking more like Ray Nagin everyday. Before everyone freaks out, it's not about race, it's about incompetent leadership of a major city.

"Just 'cause I'm simple, don't mean I'm stewpid!"

[Andy9o8 2]

rhaig

So as it turns out, the knife in question was a spring assist blade.

http://www.cnn.com/2015/05/06/us/freddie-gray-knife/

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Court documents say it was a "spring-assisted, one-hand-operated knife." Mosby has said the knife was not a switchblade.

Switchblades are illegal in Maryland, but the law is even stricter in Baltimore.

"Baltimore City has a law that says it's not only illegal to have a switchblade, but it's also illegal to have a spring-action knife," said Andrew Alperstein, a defense attorney.

So the blade was legal under state law, but not city law.

The police had no probable cause to chase him down and detain him in the first place. But now they're evading to get civilians to shift their attention to shiny things instead of the real issues at hand. And so, now they're using the "standard" police brutality defense" tactic of demonizing the brutality victim and assassinating his character. "Ooh, he's had prior police contact. Ooh, he had a little knife in his pocket. Ooh, he was evasive when we made eye contact with him." All of which applies to what? 90+% of all black men walking around in their own poor black neighborhoods? That was the heinous offense for which they felt he merited a vehicular ass-kicking? God, that's almost as bad as selling loosies. Animals! Get them off the street! Make them fear!

I respect cops, a lot, when they're actually serving and protecting. I have no respect for when they behave like an army of occupation where all of the locals are presumed to be the enemy. Fuck that.

[skycop 0]

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The police had no probable cause to chase him down and detain him in the first place. But now they're evading to get civilians to shift their attention to shiny things instead of the real issues at hand.

You're right, they had no probable cause, they did have reasonable articulable................??? You may not like it, or agree with it, but..............

http://nypost.com/2015/05/05/the-dangers-of-de-policing-will-cops-just-stand-down/

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All of which applies to what? 90+% of all black men walking around in their own poor black neighborhoods?

Hmmm...........show me hard evidence of 90%, or else it's just hyperbole, wait it is hyperbole...........

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That was the heinous offense for which they felt he merited a vehicular ass-kicking?

Nope, hence the criminal charges

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Animals! Get them off the street! Make them fear!

Isn't there some type of due process thingy that could apply here?

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demonizing the brutality victim and assassinating his character.

The NUMEROUS arrests for a variety of crimes, including several felonies did that all on it's own.

"Just 'cause I'm simple, don't mean I'm stewpid!"

[rhaig 0]

I was just addressing the knife as I offered info on knives earlier in the thread.

--
Rob

[rhaig 0]

SkyDekker

According to the defence attorneys.

Looks like it isn't that easy to determine the legality of a knife. My personal opinion is that in those cases, maybe a confiscation until legality is determined is more appropriate than arrest (and a rough ride and a killing).

Really it's an officer education issue. Can't have an officer walking up to a law abiding citizen and saying "Hey, I'm not sure if your knife is legal. Give it to me until we're sure."

That may be the way you guys roll up in kanukistan, but not down here.

--
Rob

[wmw999 2,444]

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These cops will have the best defense possible, and eventually the actual facts wil matter

Is that the case when the defense attorney is defending some thug?

Wendy P.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[billvon 2,990]

>Is that the case when the defense attorney is defending some thug?

Depends. Is the thug white? Did he have Skittles on him?

[turtlespeed 220]

billvon

>Is that the case when the defense attorney is defending some thug?

Depends. Is the thug white? Did he have Skittles on him?

Did he blow up a bomb in Boston?

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[skycop 0]

Everyday,
And that matters how?

If you got in trouble, would you not seek the best counsel available? Or would you, in seeking "social justice" take a crappy public defender?

We all know when it comes to criminal defense, money talks.
Spend enough money and reasonable doubt is more likely to appear.
And yes it applies to thugs, who have money as well...........

"Just 'cause I'm simple, don't mean I'm stewpid!"

[SkyDekker 1,465]

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Can't have an officer walking up to a law abiding citizen and saying "Hey, I'm not sure if your knife is legal. Give it to me until we're sure."

That may be the way you guys roll up in kanukistan, but not down here.

I would prefer that over. I am not sure, but I'll arrest you and snap your spine on the way to the station for daring to resist.

I mean, it was a flimsy arrest, really served absolutely no purpose other than to establish dominance. How dare you try to run from me.