Russiagate

[billvon 2,991]

A few more dots being connected:

Manafort ran Trump's campaign for six months before he was let go; his Russian connections were generating too much heat for Trump. He is now the subject of an active criminal investigation by the FBI for his connections to Russia.

So why did he join the Trump campaign with all that baggage? Trump may have made him an offer he couldn't refuse. He was in pretty big trouble at that point with some unhappy Russian lenders, and they tend to take a dim view of people who abscond with millions. From the NYT:

===========
Financial records filed last year in the secretive tax haven of Cyprus, where Paul J. Manafort kept bank accounts during his years working in Ukraine and investing with a Russian oligarch, indicate that he had been in debt to pro-Russia interests by as much as $17 million before he joined Donald J. Trump’s presidential campaign in March 2016.

The money appears to have been owed by shell companies connected to Mr. Manafort’s business activities in Ukraine when he worked as a consultant to the pro-Russia Party of Regions.
============

So he was in deep trouble. What did Trump dangle to entice him (and his Russian connections) to work for the campaign? From the Chicago Tribune:

============
Chicago-based Federal Savings Bank wouldn't comment Tuesday on a report that New York prosecutors have subpoenaed records related to $16 million in loans the institution made to former Donald Trump campaign manager Paul Manafort.

The Wall Street Journal, citing an unnamed person familiar with the matter, reported Monday that the Manhattan district attorney has demanded the records from the bank, whose chief executive, Steve Calk, was an economic adviser to Trump's presidential campaign. Manafort is under scrutiny from a special prosecutor and members of Congress for his dealings with Russian interests, part of the wider investigation into ties between Russia and members of Trump's campaign and administration.
=============

"Hey, Manafort, I'll bail you out of your debt to the Russian mob as long as they, you know, help me out here, you know what I am saying?"

[rushmc 23]

billvon

>The fake news claim that Russia wanted Trump to win the election. Bill you're
>losing it... if I'm wrong produce the evidence

From the email released by Trump Junior:

================
The Crown prosecutor of Russia met with his father Aras this morning and in their meeting offered to provide the Trump campaign with some official documents and information that would incriminate Hillary and her dealings with Russia and would be very useful to your father.

This is obviously very high level and sensitive information but is part of Russia and its government's support for Mr. Trump - helped along by Aras and Emin.
================

You really have to keep up.

Did they get any info?
Nope
Was it the gov providing?
Nope

And in the end even Dershowitz says any candidate has the right to get any info on any other candidate from ANY source.
You don't seem to care that Hillary was getting info from the Ukraine now do you? Or is that different somehow?


Now,
This is what YOU are supporting today

http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2017/06/21/dershowitz-corrupt-motive-in-trump-russia-probe-is-slippery-slope-for-turning-politics-into-felony.html

And you are so damned hate Trump blind you can't even think straight anymore.

You twist on multiple fronts to try and keep this bogus bs afloat

Sad......

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[rushmc 23]

No dots

Just your delusions.......

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[rushmc 23]

You like to trot around on your high horse and complain about collusion when it comes to Trump demonstrating you have little idea what the term means.

What IS collusion is a Democrat administration using the IRS to target groups, who want to be involved with the process, by hampering their ability to raise money and work together!!!

Now the IRS is starting to lose the legal battles they caused. Only now it will not matter to the all great Obama anymore will it!

This is a good start in any event,
I hope someone goes to jail.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2017/07/20/albuquerque-tea-party-granted-tax-exempt-status-after-8-years.html

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[billvon 2,991]

>Did they get any info?

Nice backpedal!

We don't know if they got any info. They have lied about everything else, after all.

>And you are so damned hate Trump blind . . . twist. . . bogus bs afloat . . .
>delusions....... high horse. . . .

You're losing it. Your panic is making you unhinged. If it's any consolation, lots of other Trump supporters are feeling it too.

[billvon 2,991]

>What IS collusion is a Democrat administration using the IRS . . .

And here we see RushMC's pining for the days when he could just attack a Democrat, instead of taking responsibility for the dumpster fire he helped cause. It's almost a daily thing now.

[rushmc 23]

billvon

>Did they get any info?

Nice backpedal!

We don't know if they got any info. They have lied about everything else, after all.

>And you are so damned hate Trump blind . . . twist. . . bogus bs afloat . . .
>delusions....... high horse. . . .

You're losing it. Your panic is making you unhinged. If it's any consolation, lots of other Trump supporters are feeling it too.

Ah
No back peddle and nice cherry picking on your part.

No panic here. Just pity for you anymore.

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[billvon 2,991]

To review -

Junior claimed he never met with the Russians. Then he changed his story and said OK, I did meet with them, but we just talked about adopting orphans. Then he changed his story again and said that they were promising something about Hillary Clinton but he didn't take them seriously. Then the emails came out - and the emails showed that not only was he promised sensitive intelligence material from the Russian government to help Trump win the election, he said he would "love it."

And now the latest dot to be connected:

Trump had a second, previously undisclosed meeting with Putin, after a state dinner. It lasted about an hour. Trump denied it at first, tweeting:
======================
Fake News story of secret dinner with Putin is "sick." All G 20 leaders, and spouses, were invited by the Chancellor of Germany. Press knew!
======================
He (and the Kremlin) continued the denials until some of the guests at the dinner wondered publicly why he left his seat so suddenly. The White House then admitted the meeting occurred, but would not say what it was about. (And there are no records because it was just Trump, Putin and another Russian.)

Trump then claimed he just talked about adopting orphans.
==========
"I went down just to say hello to Melania. While I was there I said hello to Putin. It was not a long conversation, but it was, you know could be 15 minutes. Just talked about things. Actually, it was very interesting, we talked about adoption . . .Interesting because it was a part of the conversation that Don had in the meeting."
==========

Can't wait to see how this one evolves. "Well, OK, we talked about ending those sanctions because of how helpful he was in the election but there is NOTHING ILLEGAL about that! The FAKE NEWS is lying about it!"

[evilivan 0]

Not directed you, billvon - just the last post in the thread.

rushmc really should be given an award of some kind. He is by far the best troll ever; he has consistently taken a position that has zero factual support and is patently argumentative, and he still gets everyone trying to use rational and fact-based argument to persuade him.

"If you can keep your head when all around you have lost theirs, then you probably haven't understood the seriousness of the situation."
David Brent

[GeorgiaDon 362]

evilivan

Not directed you, billvon - just the last post in the thread.

rushmc really should be given an award of some kind. He is by far the best troll ever; he has consistently taken a position that has zero factual support and is patently argumentative, and he still gets everyone trying to use rational and fact-based argument to persuade him.

I rarely ever post here any more, because some time ago I made the decision I would never again respond directly to rushmc's trolling. It really is astonishing how much he takes over every thread here with his denial-of-reality BS. Speakers corner has become nothing much other than a big rushmc-driven trollburger.

Don

_____________________________________
Tolerance is the cost we must pay for our adventure in liberty. (Dworkin, 1996)
“Education is not filling a bucket, but lighting a fire.” (Yeats)

[billvon 2,991]

Quote

he has consistently taken a position that has zero factual support and is patently argumentative, and he still gets everyone trying to use rational and fact-based argument to persuade him.

As such he provides a fascinating view into the mind of a Trump supporter. It's often not easy to imagine how someone can maintain a view so diametrically opposed to reality - but watching Marc do so gives some clues into how people can believe such things.

[wolfriverjoe 1,523]

billvon

Quote

he has consistently taken a position that has zero factual support and is patently argumentative, and he still gets everyone trying to use rational and fact-based argument to persuade him.

As such he provides a fascinating view into the mind of a Trump supporter. It's often not easy to imagine how someone can maintain a view so diametrically opposed to reality - but watching Marc do so gives some clues into how people can believe such things.

Not really. There's no "how" or "why" to it at all.

There's nothing fascinating, at least not to me, when someone is so entrenched in their hatred that they believe anything an opponent to the target of that hatred says and support anything they do.

"There are NO situations which do not call for a French Maid outfit." Lucky McSwervy

"~ya don't GET old by being weak & stupid!" - Airtwardo

[wmw999 2,447]

Personally, I think that by defining ones self by what one is against is far weaker than by what one is for. When you know what you're for, you're not dependent on what others say.

Wendy P.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[DanG 1]

Quote

I rarely ever post here any more, because some time ago I made the decision I would never again respond directly to rushmc's trolling. It really is astonishing how much he takes over every thread here with his denial-of-reality BS. Speakers corner has become nothing much other than a big rushmc-driven trollburger

Same here. Too bad.

- Dan G

[rushmc 23]

http://www.truthrevolt.org/news/usa-today-figures-out-everyones-sick-medias-anti-trump-obsession

Nails it

And you...

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[kallend 2,027]

"Whatever you do, don't follow the money"

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[tkhayes 348]

Quote

Did they get any info?
Nope
Was it the gov providing?
Nope

the 'act' of attempting is called conspiracy and it is a crime. so whether or not they got any info does not matter. Kind of like saying "I tried to kill my wife, but she survived, so therefore I am not guilty of anything."

Was it the gov providing? Time will tell, but Jr went to the meeting EXPECTING it to be that information from that source. Also a crime.

not 'collusion'....'conspiracy'. It's a crime. even you know that.

[rushmc 23]

tkhayes

Quote

Did they get any info?
Nope
Was it the gov providing?
Nope

the 'act' of attempting is called conspiracy and it is a crime. so whether or not they got any info does not matter. Kind of like saying "I tried to kill my wife, but she survived, so therefore I am not guilty of anything."

Was it the gov providing? Time will tell, but Jr went to the meeting EXPECTING it to be that information from that source. Also a crime.

not 'collusion'....'conspiracy'. It's a crime. even you know that.

Bad analogy and you are wrong on all counts.
And my opinion is backed up by many lawyers including many left wing lawyers.

Bad PR optics?
Yes!
Crime?
Nope.

Gonna be the same when the special council gets his fishing trip shut down......

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[SkyDekker 1,465]

rushmc

http://www.truthrevolt.org/news/usa-today-figures-out-everyones-sick-medias-anti-trump-obsession

Nails it

And you...

Of course one way for the media to move on is for Trump to actually get something of substance completed. He has so far been unable to do so.

There has been no repeal and replace of healthcare.
There is been no tax reform.
The infrastructure bill is going nowhere.
Muslim ban is severely watered down.
Wall has turned into a bit of a joke.

If your president would start leading and would start doing things of substance in stead of giving absolutely bizarre interviews, better press will follow.

His speech in Poland was well received by many (though throwing your own intelligence agencies under the bus on foreign soil is not very American).

A true leader doesn't stand there and only points out why he can't get things done, he finds ways to get it done.

[kallend 2,027]

rushmc

***>Did they get any info?

Nice backpedal!

We don't know if they got any info. They have lied about everything else, after all.

>And you are so damned hate Trump blind . . . twist. . . bogus bs afloat . . .
>delusions....... high horse. . . .

You're losing it. Your panic is making you unhinged. If it's any consolation, lots of other Trump supporters are feeling it too.

Ah
No back peddle and nice cherry picking on your part.

No panic here. Just pity for you anymore.

You may not be panicking but Trump's team looks very worried:

www.washingtonpost.com/politics/trumps-lawyers-seek-to-undercut-muellers-russia-investigation/2017/07/20/232ebf2c-6d71-11e7-b9e2-2056e768a7e5_story.html?utm_term=.56272460bc1a&wpisrc=nl_draw2&wpmm=1

And his "don't follow the money" comment looks particularly suspicious.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[alinton 0]

A lawyer, a spy, a mob boss, and a money launderer walk into a bar. The
bartender says: "you guys must be here to talk about adoption."

[Phil1111 1,149]

alinton

A lawyer, a spy, a mob boss, and a money launderer walk into a bar. The
bartender says: "you guys must be here to talk about adoption."

Funny to everyone except trump supporters. Who just...don't...get...it.

[normiss 801]

It's amazing how we went from "Russia is Fake News" to "Can I Pardon Myself?" in less than a week.

[rushmc 23]

normiss

It's amazing how we went from "Russia is Fake News" to "Can I Pardon Myself?" in less than a week.

the narrative you and the left is pushing IS fake news.

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[SkyDekker 1,465]

all your homies are jumping ship bro.

The orange Russian toddler can't get anything done.

Which of course is exactly what the Russians hoped for.