FIASCO

[jakee 1,489]

airdvr

***Proof that Drumpf has no idea what is in the House bill just passed: https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-politics/wp/2017/05/04/trump-praises-australias-universal-health-care-system-you-have-better-health-care-than-we-do/

You didn't have the same problem when ACA was passed and the Dems didn't know either.

If you have any problems at all with the way the ACA was debated, presented and available to be evaluated before voting then you should be absolutely fucking livid with what the House Republicans are trying to do. The difference in transparency and bipartisan consultation is night and day.

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[billvon 2,991]

>So after 8 months they still didn't know what was in it?

After 8 months almost everyone knew what was in it, and it had been changed/modified a dozen times. That's one of the reasons it got so long - everyone wanted to add a little something. It could _still_ have used some more work before being finalized.

>What difference does it make?

What difference does lots of work, review and revision make? If you have to ask that . . .

>BTW...I have no problem with a single payer system with the exception of what to
>do with all of the folks who don't pay taxes.

I don't see why you wouldn't cover those classes (retirees in assisted care facilities, young children.) Pretty much everyone else pays taxes in one way or another.

[billvon 2,991]

>The difference in transparency and bipartisan consultation is night and day.

From Politico:
===================
In many ways, Republicans appear to be operating in the dark about the AHCA. There have been very few hearings. The full bill text was only unveiled hours before the vote. The Congressional Budget Office didn't have time to finish its study of the legislation. White House press secretary Sean Spicer said Wednesday it is "literally impossible" to judge the impact of the bill. For his part, Trump, in interviews and conversations with associates, has seemed to care little about what the legislation says.
===================

One rep, Chris Collins, said he hadn't read it but his staff had and told him all about it:

"I will fully admit that I did not [read it]. But I can also assure you my staff did. We have to rely on our staff. ... I'm very comfortable that we have a solution to the disaster called Obamacare. . . .We rely on our staff, and we rely on our committees, and I'm comfortable that I understand this bill in its entirety, Wolf, without poring through every word."

Oddly, then, he had to rely on the evil lying liberal media to tell him what was in the material he voted on. From The Buffalo News:
=====================
Told by a Buffalo News reporter that the state's largest loss of federal funds under the bill would be $3 billion annually that goes to the state's Essential Health Plan, Collins said: "Explain that to me."

The Essential Plan is an optional program under Obamacare, offered only by New York and Minnesota, that provides low-cost health insurance to low- and middle-income people who don't qualify for Medicaid. State Health Department figures show that more than 19,000 people in Erie and Niagara counties were on the Essential Plan in January.

Asked by The Buffalo News if he was aware of the bill's cut in funding to the Essential Plan, Collins said: "No."
=======================

[airdvr 210]

billvon

>So after 8 months they still didn't know what was in it?

After 8 months almost everyone knew what was in it, and it had been changed/modified a dozen times. That's one of the reasons it got so long - everyone wanted to add a little something. It could _still_ have used some more work before being finalized.

>What difference does it make?

What difference does lots of work, review and revision make? If you have to ask that . . .

>BTW...I have no problem with a single payer system with the exception of what to
>do with all of the folks who don't pay taxes.

I don't see why you wouldn't cover those classes (retirees in assisted care facilities, young children.) Pretty much everyone else pays taxes in one way or another.

Those aren't the folks I'm referring to.

http://www.investopedia.com/articles/markets/032916/how-big-underground-economy-america.asp

Quote

One such economist, Friedrich Schneider, estimated that the size of the U.S. underground economy (not including criminal activity such as drug dealing etc.) relative to GDP was 7.2% in 2007

GDP in 2007; 14.9 trillion

Please don't dent the planet.

Destinations by Roxanne

[ryoder 1,590]

Army secretary nominee Mark Green: Public healthcare stops people from being saved by Christianity:
http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/army-secretary-nominee-mark-green-public-healthcare-stops-people-from-being-saved-by-christianity/article/2622180

"There are only three things of value: younger women, faster airplanes, and bigger crocodiles" - Arthur Jones.

[billvon 2,991]

ryoder

Army secretary nominee Mark Green: Public healthcare stops people from being saved by Christianity:

With Obamacare keeping millions of people from prematurely meeting their maker, good Christians are being kept out of the afterlife in record numbers. Trumpcare will put an end to that - and make dying great again.

"Don't think of it as Grandma dying due to lack of healthcare. Think of it as Grandma going to Heaven in the express lane!"

[JerryBaumchen 1,363]

Hi Robert.

Quote

Former Army secretary nominee Mark Green

To be honest, I'm having trouble just keeping up with the insanity in the Trump administration.

Where do they find these guys?



Jerry Baumchen

[Phil1111 1,149]

JerryBaumchen

Hi Robert.

Quote

Former Army secretary nominee Mark Green

To be honest, I'm having trouble just keeping up with the insanity in the Trump administration.

Where do they find these guys?



Jerry Baumchen

This won't make it any easier. Lets face it trump attracts flakes like flies to a warm pile of P**p!

A former Kentucky campaign official for President Donald Trump is due in court on Friday after being charged with human trafficking in the U.S. southern state.

Timothy Nolan, a retired district court judge, was arrested last month and charged with forcing a minor to engage in commercial sex around August 2016.
http://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-trafficking-lawsuit-idUSKBN17Y299

[billvon 2,991]

>One such economist, Friedrich Schneider, estimated that the size of the U.S.
>underground economy (not including criminal activity such as drug dealing etc.)
>relative to GDP was 7.2% in 2007

Yep. And we're one of the biggest offenders. How many packers/videographers/tandem masters do you think report their income to the IRS? I'd be surprised if it's 10%.

Still, most skydivers would argue that DZ's (and their staff) are good for local economies, through increased employment, payment of property, business and sales taxes, and sales (and tax) on fuel and aircraft.

[ryoder 1,590]

From Seth Meyers last night.
Jump to 6:12 to hear a certain politician slamming the practice of rushing a bill through w/o reading it, and w/o a cost analysis: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D7hzxYvCIUo&t=6m10s

"There are only three things of value: younger women, faster airplanes, and bigger crocodiles" - Arthur Jones.

[kallend 2,027]

A new poll from Quinnipiac University shows Trump's disapproval rating rising to 58 percent — a new high in Quinnipiac's regular polling and the highest in a high-quality, non-tracking poll since his inauguration. Just 36 percent approved of Trump's job performance.

This was taken before the Comey firing.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[billvon 2,991]

Some good news - the senate is realizing that they have to keep the basic provisions of the ACA to have a chance at getting any new law passed. If only they had realized this six years ago . . .

======================
Senate GOP making tax credits look more like Obamacare

By Jennifer Haberkorn
Politico
05/12/17 05:07 AM EDT

Senate Republicans are working on a potential breakthrough that could help push through an Obamacare repeal bill – by making insurance subsidies look a lot like Obamacare.

There’s growing support for the idea of pegging the tax credits in the House repeal bill to income and making aid more generous for poorer people. But those moves — while they may win consensus among Senate moderates — are unlikely to sit well with House conservatives.

The financial assistance in the House bill “is just not robust enough to make sure that low-income individuals can actually afford a [health] plan,” said Sen. John Hoeven (R-N.D.). “If you bring those income limits down for people who really need the help, you can give them more help.”

. . . .

“Because we’re talking about a health care bill, virtually anything we do is going to have some elements of some sort of artifact of Obamacare,” said Sen. Thom Tillis (R-N.C.), who supports the emerging tax subsidies plan. “I keep telling people … don’t get caught up in appearances, let’s fix the problem.”

. . .

Lawmaker such as Sen. Bob Corker (R-Tenn.) back the idea of making bigger payments to a smaller group of people.

“I very much support lowering” the subsidy eligibility, he said. “Instead of going to 800 percent, getting it to a level where people who are lower income, lower middle income can actually afford to purchase health insurance. To do health care reform and yet people may not have the means to actually purchase health insurance policy doesn’t seem to me to take us anywhere.”

The Senate plan would also provide additional assistance to people between the ages of 50 and 64, who stand to see significant premium hikes under repeal because insurers will be able to charge them more. It's still unclear what the additional help will look like. But it will be important to the House.
==================

[billvon 2,991]

>Elections have consequences.

More consequences:

From Quinnipac - "By a 54 - 38 percent margin, American voters want the Democratic Party to win control of the U.S. House of Representatives. This is the widest margin ever measured for this question in a Quinnipiac University poll, exceeding a 5 percentage point margin for Republicans in 2013."

[yoink 321]

Then the democrats should quit sucking so much. I'm just as angry at those fuckers.

I'm sure they're all rolling in the aisles at the current trainwreck, but let's not forget that they're the imbeciles who put forward possibly the only person in the country who could lose to Donald Trump in an election.

I want them to be on the news proposing solutions. At the moment they're taking the Republican playbook of pointing fingers and laying blame but not being prepared for when the inevitable happens.

[wmw999 2,446]

Yep. They're too busy playing against each other to remember that they were elected to play for us.

Wendy P.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[Phil1111 1,149]

yoink

Then the democrats should quit sucking so much. I'm just as angry at those fuckers.

I'm sure they're all rolling in the aisles at the current trainwreck, but let's not forget that they're the imbeciles who put forward possibly the only person in the country who could lose to Donald Trump in an election.

I want them to be on the news proposing solutions. At the moment they're taking the Republican playbook of pointing fingers and laying blame but not being prepared for when the inevitable happens.

I mostly agree!

Until trump is out of office there is no point in concrete solutions. The republicans won with no firm policy outlines. They still don't.

Democrats will release and propose plans when the 2018 congressional elections get underway. Face it trump was going to make ACA "Great", cheaper and better.

Meanwhile the republicans don't need the democrats. They need budget and tax proposals that are realistic. Not trickle down economics from the rich. From billionaires. Put something realistic on paper, tell trump this is what we can expect to get. Then put it in from of Pelosi and tell her to put up or shut up.

Reform the swamp. Deal with the lobbyists that make drugs and health care unaffordable. But get rid of the nutty ideas from trump and the tea party. Put it to Pelosi again.

Go to the next election tell the electorate we hear you.We fixed ACA, look at the numbers. More insured, cheaper. We heard you. We made a mistake with trump.We helped kick him to the curb. We will be republicans with compassion. Vote for us.

[billvon 2,991]

Freedom Caucus Chairman Mark Meadows nearly cries when he hears what is actually in Trumpcare. From the Independent Journal Review:
=========================
Freedom Caucus Chairman Mark Meadows (R-N.C.), — who played a pivotal role in including state waiver options in AHCA — hadn't read the full report yet, but initially said he saw it as “good news.”

When reporters pointed out the portion of the CBO report saying individuals with preexisting conditions in waiver states would be charged higher premiums and could even be priced out of the insurance market — destabilizing markets in those states — under AHCA, Meadows seemed surprised.

“Well, that’s not what I read,” Meadows said, putting on his reading glasses and peering at the paragraph on the phone of a nearby reporter.

. . . . .

The CBO analysis was adamant that AHCA's current high-risk pool funding isn't enough to cover sick people if states use the mandate waivers.

After reading the paragraph, Meadows told reporters he would go through the CBO analysis more thoroughly and run the numbers, adding he would work to make sure the high-risk pools are properly funded.

Meadows, suddenly emotional, choked back tears and said, "Listen, I lost my sister to breast cancer. I lost my dad to lung cancer. If anybody is sensitive to preexisting conditions, it’s me. I’m not going to make a political decision today that affects somebody’s sister or father because I wouldn’t do it to myself.”
===========================

[Phil1111 1,149]

billvon

Freedom Caucus Chairman Mark Meadows nearly cries when he hears what is actually in Trumpcare. From the Independent Journal Review:
=========================
Freedom Caucus Chairman Mark Meadows (R-N.C.), — who played a pivotal role in including state waiver options in AHCA — hadn't read the full report yet, but initially said he saw it as “good news.”

When reporters pointed out the portion of the CBO report saying individuals with preexisting conditions in waiver states would be charged higher premiums and could even be priced out of the insurance market — destabilizing markets in those states — under AHCA, Meadows seemed surprised.

“Well, that’s not what I read,” Meadows said, putting on his reading glasses and peering at the paragraph on the phone of a nearby reporter.

. . . . .

The CBO analysis was adamant that AHCA's current high-risk pool funding isn't enough to cover sick people if states use the mandate waivers.

After reading the paragraph, Meadows told reporters he would go through the CBO analysis more thoroughly and run the numbers, adding he would work to make sure the high-risk pools are properly funded.

Meadows, suddenly emotional, choked back tears and said, "Listen, I lost my sister to breast cancer. I lost my dad to lung cancer. If anybody is sensitive to preexisting conditions, it’s me. I’m not going to make a political decision today that affects somebody’s sister or father because I wouldn’t do it to myself.”
===========================

Yawn

23 million less insured under revised republican ACA, nine years from now 51 million uninsured(15%).

With older insured paying up to ten times as much.
http://www.cnbc.com/2017/05/24/cbo-issues-new-estimates-on-obamacare-repeal-bill.html

Nothing like reading comprehension to bring focus to the electorate and lawmakers.Boo hoo to Meadows and his crocodile tears.

[ryoder 1,590]

Joe Scarborough: "My party is going straight to hell."
http://www.msnbc.com/morning-joe/watch/joe-my-party-is-going-straight-to-hell-954005571832

"There are only three things of value: younger women, faster airplanes, and bigger crocodiles" - Arthur Jones.

[billvon 2,991]

>Joe Scarborough: "My party is going straight to hell."

He just now noticed this?

[Phil1111 1,149]

President Trump's two elder sons and daughter-in-law huddled with Republican leaders at the party's Washington headquarters this week to discuss the GOP's strategy heading into the 2018 midterm elections and 2020 presidential race, The Washington Post reported Saturday.
http://thehill.com/homenews/news/335425-trumps-sons-daughter-in-law-huddled-with-rnc-leaders-to-discuss-strategy-report

Conflict of interests for this administration have gout the window give all the other more serious misconduct. trump's kids are supposed to be managing his business.

[jakee 1,489]

Haha, so you mean that great big stack of papers didn't really contain a valid strategy to seperate Trump's interests?

Say it ain't so!

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[Phil1111 1,149]

This week’s bombing in Manchester, England, was another gruesome reminder that the threat from radical Islamist terrorism is ongoing. And President Trump’s journey to the Middle East illustrated yet again how the country central to the spread of this terrorism, Saudi Arabia, has managed to evade and deflect any responsibility for it. In fact, Trump has given Saudi Arabia a free pass and a free hand in the region....

But Trump was talking not of his host, Saudi Arabia, but rather of Iran. Now, to be clear, Iran is a destabilizing force in the Middle East and supports some very bad actors. But it is wildly inaccurate to describe it as the source of jihadist terror. According to an analysis of the Global Terrorism Database by Leif Wenar of King’s College London, more than 94 percent of deaths caused by Islamic terrorism since 2001 were perpetrated by the Islamic State, al-Qaeda and other Sunni jihadists. Iran is fighting those groups, not fueling them. Almost every terrorist attack in the West has had some connection to Saudi Arabia. Virtually none has been linked to Iran.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/global-opinions/saudi-arabia-just-played-donald-trump/2017/05/25/d0932702-4184-11e7-8c25-44d09ff5a4a8_story.html?utm_term=.8afbd3d44747

Iran is no prize in its support for Assad and Hezbollah. But the Saudi's are worse. As the article states lining up with a Saudi-Sunni coalition against the Shia in the middle east is a big mistake.

I doubt trump could ever figure out the nuances of the middle-east Arab world.

[Stumpy 284]

Phil1111

I doubt trump could ever figure out the nuances of the middle-east Arab world.

Knowing where the middle East was would be a good start.

Never try to eat more than you can lift

[Phil1111 1,149]

Stumpy

***
I doubt trump could ever figure out the nuances of the middle-east Arab world.

Knowing where the middle East was would be a good start.

Trump Humiliates Himself By Not Knowing That Israel Is In The Middle East
http://www.politicususa.com/2017/05/22/trump-israel.html

The title is a little misleading because trump 's ego shields personal humiliations.