A few good things to come out of Charlottesville

[gowlerk 2,216]

Quote

(So if you want to mention Dixiecrats as a history lesson, fine, but it has basically nothing to do with the current political situation.)

Actually it does have a lot to do with the current situation. They all became Republicans. That is the current state of affairs. You need to understand that to understand the present. Of course, the Marc is merely obfuscating as a troll. He is perfectly well aware of all of the history. This thread must be a lot of fun for him.

Always remember the brave children who died defending your right to bear arms. Freedom is not free.

[rushmc 23]

pchapman

(So if you want to mention Dixiecrats as a history lesson, fine, but it has basically nothing to do with the current political situation.)

You are wrong as history does matter.

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[DJL 235]

gowlerk

Quote

(So if you want to mention Dixiecrats as a history lesson, fine, but it has basically nothing to do with the current political situation.)

Actually it does have a lot to do with the current situation. They all became Republicans. That is the current state of affairs. You need to understand that to understand the present. Of course, the Marc is merely obfuscating as a troll. He is perfectly well aware of all of the history. This thread must be a lot of fun for him.

The same garbage is all over Conservative talk radio, fox news, etc. I listen to in while I drive and at every corner they take it back to this same bullshit.

"I encourage all awesome dangerous behavior." - Jeffro Fincher

[rushmc 23]

DJL

***

Quote

(So if you want to mention Dixiecrats as a history lesson, fine, but it has basically nothing to do with the current political situation.)

Actually it does have a lot to do with the current situation. They all became Republicans. That is the current state of affairs. You need to understand that to understand the present. Of course, the Marc is merely obfuscating as a troll. He is perfectly well aware of all of the history. This thread must be a lot of fun for him.

The same garbage is all over Conservative talk radio, fox news, etc. I listen to in while I drive and at every corner they take it back to this same bullshit.

And you support the same bullshit lie the dems have pushed for years

You just have to live with it

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[rushmc 23]

gowlerk

Quote

(So if you want to mention Dixiecrats as a history lesson, fine, but it has basically nothing to do with the current political situation.)

Actually it does have a lot to do with the current situation. They all became Republicans. That is the current state of affairs. You need to understand that to understand the present. Of course, the Marc is merely obfuscating as a troll. He is perfectly well aware of all of the history. This thread must be a lot of fun for him.

Cool
Now you can support this assertion with printed history.

We can wait.

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[gowlerk 2,216]

Quote

And you support the same bullshit lie the dems have pushed for years

Please, what lie are you referring to?

Always remember the brave children who died defending your right to bear arms. Freedom is not free.

[rushmc 23]

gowlerk

Quote

And you support the same bullshit lie the dems have pushed for years

Please, what lie are you referring to?

Ya
Like you didn't know.

Quote

They all became Republicans

Back your statment up!

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[gowlerk 2,216]

rushmc

***

Quote

And you support the same bullshit lie the dems have pushed for years

Please, what lie are you referring to?

Ya
Like you didn't know.

Quote

They all became Republicans

Back your statment up!



http://cjonline.com/blog/lucinda/2013-02-05/how-dixiecrats-became-republicans

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Southern_Democrats

Always remember the brave children who died defending your right to bear arms. Freedom is not free.

[pchapman 279]

rushmc

***

(So if you want to mention Dixiecrats as a history lesson, fine, but it has basically nothing to do with the current political situation.)

You are wrong as history does matter.

Then let me restate:
Yes history does matter.
But you misstate the implications, so "your history" doesn't matter.
The fact that some "Democrats" with now-distasteful ideas existed 50 to 150 years ago, has little bearing on the policies of the "Democrats" or their party today. (Although those ideas have somewhat more influence on the practices of the Republican party in attempting to win support.)

[rushmc 23]

gowlerk

******

Quote

And you support the same bullshit lie the dems have pushed for years

Please, what lie are you referring to?

Ya
Like you didn't know.

Quote

They all became Republicans

Back your statment up!



http://cjonline.com/blog/lucinda/2013-02-05/how-dixiecrats-became-republicans

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Southern_Democrats

Did you ever read what you posted???



BTW
I asked for printed history.

I have posted college history papers that support what I am saying

I am guessing you cant do the same

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[gowlerk 2,216]

Quote

I am guessing you cant do the same

I can't be bothered looking for documents to support well known facts. I've fed your trolls enough for today.

Always remember the brave children who died defending your right to bear arms. Freedom is not free.

[rushmc 23]

gowlerk

Quote

I am guessing you cant do the same

I can't be bothered looking for documents to support well known facts. I've fed your trolls enough for today.

gowlerk facts only I am guessing

Anyway
you could not do it if you tried

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[SkyDekker 1,465]

Quote

I asked for printed history.

Why, would be rather useless for you wouldn't it?

There is more than enough evidence to suggest that the Dixiecrat movement broke the traditional allegiance to Democrats and helped start the rise of the Republican Party in the south.

Your inability to find written support for this just bolsters my first statement.

[DJL 235]

rushmc

******

Quote

(So if you want to mention Dixiecrats as a history lesson, fine, but it has basically nothing to do with the current political situation.)

Actually it does have a lot to do with the current situation. They all became Republicans. That is the current state of affairs. You need to understand that to understand the present. Of course, the Marc is merely obfuscating as a troll. He is perfectly well aware of all of the history. This thread must be a lot of fun for him.

The same garbage is all over Conservative talk radio, fox news, etc. I listen to in while I drive and at every corner they take it back to this same bullshit.

And you support the same bullshit lie the dems have pushed for years

You just have to live with it

No, I know exactly when the Republican party started and exactly who was doing what and when. That doesn't change what I know about who is doing what now. I went to a college that fought in the Civil War, waking up to formation in front of a statue of Gen Jackson and next to a chapel named after him, and next to the grave sites of cadets who died fighting against the Union. That school now graduates hundred of officers into the US military yearly and there's no confusion as to which side of history we were on in those earlier years.

I'm still confused about what lie you refer to. NOBODY is claiming that it wasn't the Democratic party who led the secession from the Union. The ONLY people continuously talking about it are Far Right Republicans.

"I encourage all awesome dangerous behavior." - Jeffro Fincher

[pchapman 279]

rushmc

BTW
I asked for printed history.

Plenty of printed history is at least partially online.

Here you go:

E.g. "The Irony of the Solid South: Democrats, Republicans, and Race, 1865-1944" from the U of Alabama Press, by a U. of Alabama at Birmingham prof, 2013. (Yeah, some pinko America hater I'm sure.)

In his epilogue about the post war era he is fairly damning -- the federal Democratic party was leaving old ideas about economic and racial domination behind, leaving the south to turn more to the more welcoming Republican party.
(excuse any OCR errors)

Quote

The party [Democratic Party] signed its own death warrant because segregation was the linchpin of southern white unity regardless of rank, class, type, or intelligence. And because segregation could not be held separate from economics, religion, cultural health, or even other aspects of white supremacy, incursions on Jim Crow risked all. As Temple Graves put it, segregation "is nor an argument in the South. It is a major premise." The only real question that remained was if and when another party would step up to capitalize on the South’s estrangement from the Democratic party. By 1944 it was clear that once a party (even the formerly reviled Republican Party) could resolve, and then learn how to distinguish itself from the liberal national Democrats on the point of white supremacy, it—not the Old Democratic Party "Of our fathers” – would be on its way to becoming the new party of the South: the party of southern white culture and the southern way of life.

Many have pointed to 1964 as the critical moment the South became Republican—when Barry Goldwater's presidential candidacy and opposition to the Civil Rights Act began to swing the South toward the GOP. Richard Nixon, in his characteristically earthy fashion, called that idea so much "bullshit." He thought he saw the origins in 1952. Generally speaking, Nixon was more right than wrong. The true foundations for the South to go Republican were actually set far earlier than 1964, in the twin cataclysm that was the Great Depression and World War II, perhaps even before, in the trauma of Reconstruction and its New South-boosterism past.

The irony of all of this is that the very things that made the South solid for Democracy in the first place were the same things that—once threatened by the national parry—presaged the end of Democratic solidarity in the South. The other great irony is that this took place not in the cauldron of Goldwater's 1964, or the 1968 and 1972 struggles between Richard Nixon and George Wallace for the white vote, or in the 1980s rise of Ronald Reagan and the Religious Right. It took place simultaneously and parallel with and actually within the salad days of the New Deal.

(Of course when Gowler wrote "they all became Republicans", he didn't mean every single one, 100.000% of them did.)

[rushmc 23]

pchapman

***
BTW
I asked for printed history.

Plenty of printed history is at least partially online.

Here you go:

E.g. "The Irony of the Solid South: Democrats, Republicans, and Race, 1865-1944" from the U of Alabama Press, by a U. of Alabama at Birmingham prof, 2013. (Yeah, some pinko America hater I'm sure.)

In his epilogue about the post war era he is fairly damning -- the federal Democratic party was leaving old ideas about economic and racial domination behind, leaving the south to turn more to the more welcoming Republican party.
(excuse any OCR errors)

Quote

The party [Democratic Party] signed its own death warrant because segregation was the linchpin of southern white unity regardless of rank, class, type, or intelligence. And because segregation could not be held separate from economics, religion, cultural health, or even other aspects of white supremacy, incursions on Jim Crow risked all. As Temple Graves put it, segregation "is nor an argument in the South. It is a major premise." The only real question that remained was if and when another party would step up to capitalize on the South’s estrangement from the Democratic party. By 1944 it was clear that once a party (even the formerly reviled Republican Party) could resolve, and then learn how to distinguish itself from the liberal national Democrats on the point of white supremacy, it—not the Old Democratic Party "Of our fathers” – would be on its way to becoming the new party of the South: the party of southern white culture and the southern way of life.

Many have pointed to 1964 as the critical moment the South became Republican—when Barry Goldwater's presidential candidacy and opposition to the Civil Rights Act began to swing the South toward the GOP. Richard Nixon, in his characteristically earthy fashion, called that idea so much "bullshit." He thought he saw the origins in 1952. Generally speaking, Nixon was more right than wrong. The true foundations for the South to go Republican were actually set far earlier than 1964, in the twin cataclysm that was the Great Depression and World War II, perhaps even before, in the trauma of Reconstruction and its New South-boosterism past.

The irony of all of this is that the very things that made the South solid for Democracy in the first place were the same things that—once threatened by the national parry—presaged the end of Democratic solidarity in the South. The other great irony is that this took place not in the cauldron of Goldwater's 1964, or the 1968 and 1972 struggles between Richard Nixon and George Wallace for the white vote, or in the 1980s rise of Ronald Reagan and the Religious Right. It took place simultaneously and parallel with and actually within the salad days of the New Deal.

(Of course when Gowler wrote "they all became Republicans", he didn't mean every single one, 100.000% of them did.)

A profs opinion. But it still does not show the Republican party changed. It still had northerns who were opposed to slavery.

What you post is not a research paper of history page. It is an opinion of one (most likely Democrat prof)
Please, supply think for me.

Thanks
Marc

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[rushmc 23]

I found the author and he is credited with being a detailed researcher.

I also found some reviews of his book that are very positive.

Some things to think about.

Some reviews.

http://www.uapress.ua.edu/product/Irony-of-the-Solid-South,5635.aspx

he talks about the changing south but no where do I see a claim that says the fundamental republican party was changed/reversed

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[pchapman 279]

rushmc

What you post is not a research paper of history page. It is an opinion of one (most likely Democrat prof)
Please, supply think for me.

Thanks
Marc

Sorry, no time for writing a master's thesis on the subject, after which you would say, "hmm, I still need more proof". You've sucked me in enough into this.

So to end my involvement in this, I'll just leave you with one peer reviewed journal article that sticks more to clearly identified voter turnout than less verifiable opinions on causes. Still, no one paper is the end of all discussion and certainly won't be for you.

The Transformation of the Southern Democratic Party
Merle Black
Emory University
THE JOURNAL OF POLITICS, Vol. 66, No. 4, November 2004, Pp. 1001–1017 (a reputable journal published by the U. of Chicago press)

Quote

The emergence of the Republican party as a realistic alternative to the Democrats
is the most dramatic story in southern politics during the late twentieth and
early twenty-first centuries (Black and Black 2002; Rhodes 2000).

Quote

In 1952 the South was the most important example of a one-party political system in the United States. The Democratic party claimed 77% of southern voters. Democratic identification functioned as a cultural norm. Any waveringfrom this identity, any willingness to think of oneself as an “independent” or, scarcely imaginable, to conceive of oneself as a “Republican,” were signs of deviation from regional orthodoxy.
For a variety of reasons—the rise of an urbanized middle class, the growth of the civil rights movement and federal intervention in civil rights during the administration of President Lyndon B. Johnson, the activation of conservative white religious groups, and increased campaigning by Republican candidates in the South—the size of the Democratic majority among southern voters contracted enormously during the next three decades (Bass and DeVries 1976; Beck 1977; Black 1976; Black and Black 1987).

Quote

The Republican party strengthened and consolidated its lead among white southerners in the 1990s (Bullock, Gaddie, and Hoffman 2002; Knuckey 2001). By 2002, according to the exit poll, merely 26% of white southern voters were Democrats, the lowest level of identification ever observed in the region.

Cheers.

EDIT: We also may have that issue that you could say you're not arguing the point I'm arguing about, that we're arguing slightly different things. It is pretty clear that the Democrats were the ones who went with the civil rights movement more than the Republicans, and so lost the south.

[rushmc 23]

pchapman

EDIT: ...... It is pretty clear that the Democrats were the ones who went with the civil rights movement more than the Republicans, and so lost the south.

No
This is not clear at all

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[SkyDekker 1,465]

Yes it is pretty clear.

Why did the Dixiecrats break from the Democratic Party? Held their own convention, supported the Republican Presidential candidate etc. Why do you think that happened?

[rushmc 23]

SkyDekker

Yes it is pretty clear.

Why did the Dixiecrats break from the Democratic Party? Held their own convention, supported the Republican Presidential candidate etc. Why do you think that happened?

Sorry
You try to simplify it to support your assertion.

Cant be done

http://factmyth.com/factoids/democrats-and-republicans-switched-platforms/

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[SkyDekker 1,465]

I am asking you for your opinion on something. Are you saying your opinion is too simplified to state?

FYI, from your link:

Quote

The problem isn’t proving specific changes (for example showing that the southern bloc used to vote Democratic Party and now they vote Republican),

[gowlerk 2,216]

Quote

A profs opinion. But it still does not show the Republican party changed. It still had northerns who were opposed to slavery.

Oh Marc. Come now. Even the KKK does not advocate a return to slavery. EVERYONE is opposed to slavery. The Republican Party is 100% opposed to slavery. And I clearly stated that the R party DOES NOT support the KKK. All that is being said here is that the R party has become the one of only two parties that they now belong to. And that there is an element within the party that welcomes them.

Read my words carefully. You may get their meaning for a change.

Always remember the brave children who died defending your right to bear arms. Freedom is not free.

[DJL 235]

rushmc

***Yes it is pretty clear.

Why did the Dixiecrats break from the Democratic Party? Held their own convention, supported the Republican Presidential candidate etc. Why do you think that happened?

Sorry
You try to simplify it to support your assertion.

Cant be done

http://factmyth.com/factoids/democrats-and-republicans-switched-platforms/

And just to check, can we use factmyth.com instead of snopes.com ?

"I encourage all awesome dangerous behavior." - Jeffro Fincher

[normiss 806]

rushmc

***He's just "involver", not reading anything factual.

This is one of your hero's I will bet

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2017/08/23/this-is-cnn-don-lemon-accuses-trump-inciting-civil-war.html

Maybe this will help YOUR see what insane really is......

One of my "hero's" what exactly???

My "YOUR" what see "insane"???

Do you even English bro?
I'd suggest an ESL class.