The wall

[JerryBaumchen 1,365]

19 minutes ago, yobnoc said:

Damn, you old :-P

Hi yobnoc,

Better than not.

Jerry Baumchen

[BIGUN 1,317]

2 hours ago, JerryBaumchen said:

Given that, I think I can honestly say, 'No.'  Is that a sufficient answer?

I can accept that.

On a lighter note . . . Dammit man, your batting average ain't that good  

Keith

[yobnoc 142]

1 hour ago, JerryBaumchen said:

Hi yobnoc,

Better than not.

Jerry Baumchen

Touché

[BIGUN 1,317]

4 hours ago, DJL said:

You're citing examples of countries who use walls AND lethal force, and/or they're protecting against terrorism and/or warfare, and they're installed in places requiring a much shorter length.  In locations and in situations similar to the border with Mexico they also have the same shortcomings, namely that they don't actually prevent crossing unless there is also active surveillance and the ability to respond

Oh for the love of . . . If you guys ain't going to look it up - I'll hand feed it to you. I cherry-picked the Border fences that were to prevent illegal immigration; not conflict zones. I didn't specify Saudi/Yemen as the illegal immigrant wall, so I'll take the hit for that.  

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Border_barrier   

[BIGUN 1,317]

5 hours ago, SkyDekker said:

A very regular US-based dropzone.com poster and fellow skydiver committed suicide and not a single dropzone.com Republican stood up for spending billions to provide proper healthcare to their fellow countrymen and women.

Crime by illegal immigrants is much less of a concern than crime by American Citizens. Under Obama illegal immigration was at an all-time low. Under Trump's policy that has turned into a clusterfuck.

huh? You didn't even try to connect the dots there. 

[JerryBaumchen 1,365]

27 minutes ago, BIGUN said:

Dammit man, your batting average ain't that good  

Hi Keith,

I vote for what I think is best for my country not what I think is best for me.

Jerry Baumchen

[BIGUN 1,317]

1 minute ago, JerryBaumchen said:

I vote for what I think is best for my country not what I think is best for me.

It was light-hearted, Jerry. A joke. We all believe we're voting for what's best for the country. Well, those of us that vote, anyway. But, that's a different thread.

[Coreece 190]

1 hour ago, jakee said:

And yet Texas has over 1100 murders a year. Is that your solution for those 1100 families, tell them their loved one is only half as dead?

If I really didn't have anything relevant to say, I'd probably just keep my mouth shut rather than ask them some type of snide-ass loaded question that really had nothing to do with what we were actually talking about.

 

2 hours ago, jakee said:

Or or are you going to tell them sorry, I only care about crime that illegals commit, I have no interest in hard discussions about the majority of crime that happens in the country?

This is a thread called The Wall, and among a slew of other problems related to the border crisis, we are discussing how better border security might affect the level of crime committed by undocumented immigrants.

If there was a thread about domestic violence and we were discussing how to reduce spousal murder rates, I might talk about some reasonable gun restrictions that would apply to domestic violence situations only.  That doesn't mean that I don't care about other types of murders, or that spousal murders are less significant because they're not as common and therefore not worthy of any exclusive mitigation effort, especially if it's not applicable to all types of murder.

[gowlerk 2,204]

58 minutes ago, Coreece said:

If I really didn't have anything relevant to say, I'd probably just keep my mouth shut rather than ask them some type of snide-ass loaded question that really had nothing to do with what we were actually talking about.

There are a lot of posts here that are really just people reacting because they feel they need to. A lot of people feel it's important to say something when really it just seems to be an attempt to get the last word in. Sometimes I'm guilty as well but I am trying to do it less. We are all here for different reasons I suppose.

[Coreece 190]

12 minutes ago, gowlerk said:

1 hour ago, Coreece said:

If I really didn't have anything relevant to say, I'd probably just keep my mouth shut rather than ask them some type of snide-ass loaded question that really had nothing to do with what we were actually talking about.

There are a lot of posts here that are really just people reacting because they feel they need to. A lot of people feel it's important to say something when really it just seems to be an attempt to get the last word in. Sometimes I'm guilty as well but I am trying to do it less. We are all here for different reasons I suppose.

It's all good.  I'm probably coming off a bit more irritated than I actually am anyway.

[DJL 235]

5 hours ago, BIGUN said:

Oh for the love of . . . If you guys ain't going to look it up - I'll hand feed it to you.

I'm not going to go down the list but I'm familiar with these examples.  Isreal has walls and fences in some places to stop immigration (they don't actually stop them) and in some places to prevent terrorist attacks (they kill people at these locations).  The ones in Spain are actually in Morocco and they're newsworthy because they've killed people who have tried to cross the fences in the Spanish/EU territory cities.

Again, your list of countries and fences is not realistic for the US/Mexico border.

[wolfriverjoe 1,523]

On 4/14/2019 at 9:55 PM, BIGUN said:

https://www.usatoday.com/border-wall/us-mexico-interactive-border-map/

That's a map of current places where there's fences or walls. 

Not of Trump's plan to build a wall along the entire border.

 

He's had to walk it back some, because of things like opposition, funding and reality.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-46824649

[SkyDekker 1,465]

2 hours ago, wolfriverjoe said:

That's a map of current places where there's fences or walls. 

Not of Trump's plan to build a wall along the entire border.

 

He's had to walk it back some, because of things like opposition, funding and reality.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-46824649

These people simply don't live in any version of reality. Only feelings of fear, revenge and anger matter.

[BIGUN 1,317]

4 hours ago, SkyDekker said:

These people simply don't live in any version of reality. Only feelings of fear, revenge and anger matter.

"These people?!?!" Imagine if someone said that about those of ethnic background. 

Or, I could have simply posted the wrong map. Fear, revenge and anger - give me a break . 

[BIGUN 1,317]

6 hours ago, wolfriverjoe said:

That's a map of current places where there's fences or walls. 

Not of Trump's plan to build a wall along the entire border.

My bad - https://www.texasobserver.org/map-trump-border-wall-locations-texas/

[BIGUN 1,317]

16 hours ago, DJL said:

and in some places to prevent terrorist attacks

Don't you find it interesting that anyone who flies on an airline is more subject to background and physical examinations than anyone coming across the border? Don't hear anyone from the Democrat Party whining about the barriers in airports. 

[jakee 1,498]

4 minutes ago, BIGUN said:

My bad - https://www.texasobserver.org/map-trump-border-wall-locations-texas/

Sounds like those are planned sections of wall the administration wants to push through with the funding currently available.

 

Doesn’t change the fact that the stated plan has always been to get full funding for a full wall.

[jakee 1,498]

2 minutes ago, BIGUN said:

Don't you find it interesting that anyone who flies on an airline is more subject to background and physical examinations than anyone coming across the border? Don't hear anyone from the Democrat Party whining about the barriers in airports. 

You don’t remember hearing anyone whine about the Patriot Act, DHS, the TSA, body scanners, body searches and having to take your shoes off?

 

Amazing selective memory you have there!

[BIGUN 1,317]

2 minutes ago, jakee said:

Sounds like those are planned sections of wall the administration wants to push through with the funding currently available. Doesn’t change the fact that the stated plan has always been to get full funding for a full wall.

I "think" that's true. And, I'm OK with that. 

Edited April 16, 2019 by BIGUN
correction

[SkyDekker 1,465]

11 minutes ago, BIGUN said:

"These people?!?!" Imagine if someone said that about those of ethnic background. 

Or, I could have simply posted the wrong map. Fear, revenge and anger - give me a break . 

Yes "these people".

If you don't understand the difference between referring to people as "these people" due to a characteristic they have no control over and referring to "these people" for a characteristic they have full control over, you are one of those people.

[BIGUN 1,317]

2 minutes ago, jakee said:

You don’t remember hearing anyone whine about the Patriot Act, DHS, the TSA, body scanners, body searches and having to take your shoes off?

Amazing selective memory you have there!

I did not communicate it, but I meant now - not then ( and, I was one of them whining about them)..

But, it hasn't changed or been brought up now that the Democrats are in the House.   

[BIGUN 1,317]

2 minutes ago, SkyDekker said:

Yes "these people".

If you don't understand the difference between referring to people as "these people" due to a characteristic they have no control over and referring to "these people" for a characteristic they have full control over, you are one of those people.

I assume you meant, "Trait" vs. characteristic.

[DJL 235]

9 minutes ago, BIGUN said:

Don't you find it interesting that anyone who flies on an airline is more subject to background and physical examinations than anyone coming across the border? Don't hear anyone from the Democrat Party whining about the barriers in airports. 

There has been plenty whining about airport security.  I don't find it interesting because are internationally the specific target of terrorists.  There's nothing surprising about the safeguards we've put on those attempting to board an airplane.  I don't like it but it's an unfortunate reality.

[BIGUN 1,317]

Just now, DJL said:

I don't like it but it's an unfortunate reality.

Glad you understand. 

[DJL 235]

8 minutes ago, BIGUN said:

Glad you understand. 

Ha, therefore, BUILD THE WALL!  Anyway, I'm still not concerned about terrorists trying to sneak into the US.  Not because I don't think they can but it's cost prohibitive to build a physical barrier against both illegals and terrorists.  It's simply too easy to get in by other ways and there are better ways of tracking and solving both threats to our national sovereignty and security.  So to quit the one-line nay-saying what I DO believe to be the solution is a combination of  E-Verify, tightening of restrictions on refugees, loosening and expanding the work visa program, US support of countries in the Western Hemisphere from which these people are coming.

Edited April 16, 2019 by DJL