Green new deal equals magical thinking

[SkyDekker 1,465]

  On 4/30/2019 at 10:08 AM, brenthutch said:

March 20, 2000

According to Dr David Viner, a senior research scientist at the climatic research unit (CRU) of the University of East Anglia ,within a few years winter snowfall will become “a very rare and exciting event”. “Children just aren’t going to know what snow is,” he said.

Who's the denier now?

Should note that link is dead.

When googling for that exact wording, the first page of hits is all denier sites.

[DJL 235]

  On 4/30/2019 at 6:28 PM, SkyDekker said:

When googling for that exact wording, the first page of hits is all denier sites.

It's making the rounds in the denier world so they're all worked up about it (Totally not parroting denier talking points).  I posted a PDF copy of it from the wattsup page above.

[kallend 2,106]

  On 4/30/2019 at 3:15 PM, brenthutch said:

Your conflating climate with weather. 

 

Hypocrisy score 100%

[turtlespeed 226]

  On 4/30/2019 at 5:50 PM, DJL said:

I think a good benchmark of the dangers  of climate change is that the US Navy has a strategy in place for its effects.

https://www.usni.org/magazines/proceedings/2017/october/war-plan-orange-climate-change

BWAAWAWAWAAAWWAA - You are relying on Naval Intelligence?

 

 

[kallend 2,106]

  On 4/30/2019 at 9:59 PM, turtlespeed said:

BWAAWAWAWAAAWWAA - You are relying on Naval Intelligence?

 

 

Who do you rely on, Alex Jones?  (Most of your posts read that way).

[turtlespeed 226]

  On 4/30/2019 at 10:19 PM, kallend said:

Who do you rely on, Alex Jones?  (Most of your posts read that way).

Absolutely not.  I'm much closer to aligning with your Hero - Michael Moore.

[brenthutch 444]

  On 4/30/2019 at 6:28 PM, SkyDekker said:

Should note that link is dead.

When googling for that exact wording, the first page of hits is all denier sites.

I wonder why the link is dead.  Hmmmm?

Edited May 1, 2019 by brenthutch

[billvon 3,070]

  On 5/1/2019 at 1:56 AM, brenthutch said:

I wonder why the link is dead.  Hmmmm?

No doubt a big conspiracy!  The truth is out there.

[brenthutch 444]

The conspiracy is that the .15C warming we have experienced in the last two decades is somehow an existential threat to our planet and unless we turn control of our lives over to the government and spend TRILLIONS of dollars we are all doomed.  At least that is what the Democrats are telling us.

To be clear, in the past twenty years the planet has warmed one and a half TENTHS of a degree centigrade.

[DJL 235]

  On 5/1/2019 at 11:33 AM, brenthutch said:

The conspiracy is that the .15C warming we have experienced in the last two decades is somehow an existential threat to our planet and unless we turn control of our lives over to the government and spend TRILLIONS of dollars we are all doomed.  At least that is what the Democrats are telling us.

No, that's what your denier talking point fringe sources are telling you about what Democrats think so you can dismiss it as libtards being panicked and triggered little brainless bitches who can't man up and burn oil like grandpa did.  You have yet to make a reasoned and valid point so you have to resort to that kind of hyperbole.

Edit:  So again, where is your body of research showing that there is not risk to the environment and our national and global interests based upon the man made effects of global warming? (And to be clear, we did graduate to actually understand that these are man made, right?  We don't have to go back to discussing whether this is just some sort of natural cycle?)

Edited May 1, 2019 by DJL

[DJL 235]

  On 4/30/2019 at 9:59 PM, turtlespeed said:

BWAAWAWAWAAAWWAA - You are relying on Naval Intelligence?

Would you rather rely on street interviews with people being asked a question that isn't about the issue? 

[turtlespeed 226]

  On 5/1/2019 at 12:32 PM, DJL said:

Would you rather rely on street interviews with people being asked a question that isn't about the issue? 

I think you missed the oxymoron.

[DJL 235]

  On 5/1/2019 at 1:18 PM, turtlespeed said:

I think you missed the oxymoron.

Who you calling an oxy moron?!?!

[brenthutch 444]

  On 5/1/2019 at 12:30 PM, DJL said:

No, that's what your denier talking point fringe sources are telling you about what Democrats think so you can dismiss it as libtards being panicked and triggered little brainless bitches 

https://www.axios.com/

• Sen. Bernie Sanders tweeted "I am proud to be an original co-sponsor of the Green New Deal proposal. We must address the existential crisis of planetary climate change."
• Sen. Cory Booker likened the GND to fighting Nazis and going to the Moon, reports the Washington Times.
• Sen. Kamala Harris, via C-SPAN: "We have to have goals. It's a resolution that requires us to have goals and think about what we can achieve and put metrics on it."
• Sen. Elizabeth Warren tweeted that she is "excited" to back the GND after initially saying she backed the general "idea" of it.
• Sen. Amy Klobuchar: "I see it as aspirational, I see it as a jump-start. So I would vote yes, but I would also, if it got down to the nitty-gritty of an actual legislation as opposed to, 'Oh, here are some goals we have,' that would be different for me," reports The Hill.
• Sen. Kristin Gillibrand: "It's got this aspirational goal of net zero carbon emissions in ten years," reports Newsweek.

[turtlespeed 226]

  On 5/1/2019 at 1:23 PM, DJL said:

Who you calling an oxy moron?!?!

I see what you did there.

 

Where was the comma supposed to be placed?

[turtlespeed 226]

  On 5/1/2019 at 1:52 PM, brenthutch said:

https://www.axios.com/

• Sen. Bernie Sanders tweeted "I am proud to be an original co-sponsor of the Green New Deal proposal. We must address the existential crisis of planetary climate change."
• Sen. Cory Booker likened the GND to fighting Nazis and going to the Moon, reports the Washington Times.
• Sen. Kamala Harris, via C-SPAN: "We have to have goals. It's a resolution that requires us to have goals and think about what we can achieve and put metrics on it."
• Sen. Elizabeth Warren tweeted that she is "excited" to back the GND after initially saying she backed the general "idea" of it.
• Sen. Amy Klobuchar: "I see it as aspirational, I see it as a jump-start. So I would vote yes, but I would also, if it got down to the nitty-gritty of an actual legislation as opposed to, 'Oh, here are some goals we have,' that would be different for me," reports The Hill.
• Sen. Kristin Gillibrand: "It's got this aspirational goal of net zero carbon emissions in ten years," reports Newsweek.

The basis of these comments are to be alarmists.

This is advocating the practice of something like demanding 100 times what you want so that when you eventually settle, you get 10%.

Its manipulative and dishonest. 

[DJL 235]

  On 5/1/2019 at 1:52 PM, brenthutch said:

https://www.axios.com/

• Sen. Bernie Sanders tweeted "I am proud to be an original co-sponsor of the Green New Deal proposal. We must address the existential crisis of planetary climate change."
• Sen. Cory Booker likened the GND to fighting Nazis and going to the Moon, reports the Washington Times.
• Sen. Kamala Harris, via C-SPAN: "We have to have goals. It's a resolution that requires us to have goals and think about what we can achieve and put metrics on it."
• Sen. Elizabeth Warren tweeted that she is "excited" to back the GND after initially saying she backed the general "idea" of it.
• Sen. Amy Klobuchar: "I see it as aspirational, I see it as a jump-start. So I would vote yes, but I would also, if it got down to the nitty-gritty of an actual legislation as opposed to, 'Oh, here are some goals we have,' that would be different for me," reports The Hill.
• Sen. Kristin Gillibrand: "It's got this aspirational goal of net zero carbon emissions in ten years," reports Newsweek.

You know, I'll have to meet you in the middle on this one considering I responded thinking I was in the "Global Warming Ended..." forum.  While I'm not a huge fan of the GND I understand that some of its goals are based upon the fact that measures we put into place can't marginalize those who are the least able to prioritize its overall goals.  We can't have $10/gal gas, we can't have $100k electric cars but I don't think the social salvation items are necessary for us to turn the ship around and I don't think that "the Left" as a whole feels that way either.  However, I don't think that even what they say about equates to government control of our lives, Trillions wasted, or even that the statements above are all that alarmist.  Even R Senator Lamar Alexander says we need to treat our plan like a modern Manhattan Project.

[brenthutch 444]

Yes, the OP was about the GND, a socialist utopian fantasy (just watch the video earlier in the thread).

It is not just the GND, Beto's climate plan has a five TRILLION dollar price tag, and it is being criticized for not being ambitious enough.

[DJL 235]

  On 5/1/2019 at 2:18 PM, brenthutch said:

Yes, the OP was about the GND, a socialist utopian fantasy (just watch the video earlier in the thread).

It is not just the GND, Beto's climate plan has a five TRILLION dollar price tag, and it is being criticized for not being ambitious enough.

Beto who.....  I saw the video, she has a solid future narrating children's books if the political thing doesn't pan out.

[billvon 3,070]

  On 5/1/2019 at 11:33 AM, brenthutch said:

The conspiracy is that the .15C warming we have experienced in the last two decades is somehow an existential threat to our planet and unless we turn control of our lives over to the government and spend TRILLIONS of dollars we are all doomed.  At least that is what the Democrats are telling us.

Uh huh.  Because in reality, temperature means nothing, and any time we massively mess with the environment everything turns out great.

[brenthutch 444]

  On 5/1/2019 at 3:24 PM, billvon said:

Uh huh.  Because in reality, temperature means nothing, and any time we massively mess with the environment everything turns out great.

1.5 TENTHs of one degree = MASSIVELY messing with the environment?  

[billvon 3,070]

  On 5/1/2019 at 3:31 PM, brenthutch said:

1.5 TENTHs of one degree = MASSIVELY messing with the environment?  

Increasing the CO2 content of the atmosphere by 50% = massively messing with the atmosphere.  (BTW it's not 1.5 tenths.)

[brenthutch 444]

According to NOAA, 2018 global temperatures were .79 degrees above the twentieth century average.  Two decades prior it was .64 above.

.79-.64=.15

[billvon 3,070]

  On 5/1/2019 at 3:50 PM, brenthutch said:

According to NOAA, 2018 global temperatures were .79 degrees above the twentieth century average.  Two decades prior it was .64 above.

.79-.64=.15

Average temperatures (averaged over a decade) have increased 1.3F since the 1950's.  They have increased 1.8F since the 1880's.

You can, of course, try to cherrypick years to reduce that, or switch to degrees C to try to minimize it. or use a smaller timeframe to try to make the data say what you want.  But that doesn't change the facts.

[turtlespeed 226]

  On 5/1/2019 at 3:50 PM, brenthutch said:

According to NOAA, 2018 global temperatures were .79 degrees above the twentieth century average.  Two decades prior it was .64 above.

.79-.64=.15

I think what Bill is saying is that the atmosphere has 50% more CO2 - which IS in fact a huge messing with - if its true.

IF the earth has 50% more - or 150% of what it had - it would seem that .15 is not very significant.

Or maybe he is saying that you are missing that the average would be 0. and .64 plus your .15 being .79 is significant.