Stupid firearm accident thread

[SkyDekker 1,465]

3 hours ago, turtlespeed said:

Do we just give them a pass?  Do we set a different standard for the inhabitants of "those" neighborhoods?

>>>  If so, where does the double or triple standard end?

Well, you did start with programs that were specifically in place to target "them". The war on drugs was in large part aimed at incarcerating black Americans.

[DJL 235]

16 hours ago, SkyDekker said:

Well, you did start with programs that were specifically in place to target "them". The war on drugs was in large part aimed at incarcerating black Americans.

Just to point out the very brief distinction, that's not what it set out to do but that's what it did.  When we asked "How do we do this?" the answer was to focus on the poor areas and the poor areas looked like black Americans.  The solution then became to over-police and go to war against black Americans.  The lessons were all expended on them and now that the opioid crisis is a white rural issue our hears and wallets are wide open - because we know better.  Right?  I not going to say that it's entirely a racial thing that we're now so supportive of drug users but there's certainly a stark difference in approaches.

[Coreece 190]

17 hours ago, SkyDekker said:

21 hours ago, turtlespeed said:

Do we just give them a pass?  Do we set a different standard for the inhabitants of "those" neighborhoods?

>>>  If so, where does the double or triple standard end?

Well, you did start with programs that were specifically in place to target "them". The war on drugs was in large part aimed at incarcerating black Americans.

Do you think that a war on guns would have a different effect?

But anyway, you'll start hearing a lot more about black incarceration levels and Biden's 1994 crime bill now that he's running for office.  The bill called for the sentencing commission to study the 100-to-1 rule which lead to their strong recommendation against it because of the racial disparity and detrimental effect on the black community.

Around the same time Clinton made a speech speaking out against the mass incarceration of blacks, but then signs a bill disapproving amendments based on the sentencing commissions recommendations, thus leaving that 100-1 rule intact.  And then they'll try to tell you that it was all just an "unintended consequence."

[Coreece 190]

1 hour ago, DJL said:

17 hours ago, SkyDekker said:

Well, you did start with programs that were specifically in place to target "them". The war on drugs was in large part aimed at incarcerating black Americans.

Just to point out the very brief distinction, that's not what it set out to do but that's what it did.  When we asked "How do we do this?" the answer was to focus on the poor areas and the poor areas looked like black Americans.  The solution then became to over-police and go to war against black Americans.  The lessons were all expended on them and now that the opioid crisis is a white rural issue our hears and wallets are wide open - because we know better.  Right?  I not going to say that it's entirely a racial thing that we're now so supportive of drug users but there's certainly a stark difference in approaches.

I can pretty much agree with all of that, but I think some of the differences in approach can be attributed to the healthcare industry's role in the problem and the sheer number of people that have been affected by it, along with the liberal call against the war on drugs in general.

[billvon 2,991]

21 hours ago, turtlespeed said:

This we can agree on.  I want better schooling for all - BUT -  Logistics.  How do we make the teachers want to teach in that environment?

Pay them - a lot.  Forgive their educational debts if they teach there for 4 years.  That both gets good teachers there and injects a lot of money into that community.  Stores will appear if a dozen highly paid people start looking for places to shop.

[SkyDekker 1,465]

2 hours ago, DJL said:

Just to point out the very brief distinction, that's not what it set out to do but that's what it did. 

You may want to do a bit more reading on that.

 

https://www.cnn.com/2016/03/23/politics/john-ehrlichman-richard-nixon-drug-war-blacks-hippie/index.html

 

"We knew we couldn't make it illegal to be either against the war or black, but by getting the public to associate the hippies with marijuana and blacks with heroin. And then criminalizing both heavily, we could disrupt those communities," Ehrlichman said. "We could arrest their leaders. raid their homes, break up their meetings, and vilify them night after night on the evening news. Did we know we were lying about the drugs? Of course we did."

Edited June 19, 2019 by SkyDekker

[DJL 235]

56 minutes ago, SkyDekker said:

You may want to do a bit more reading on that.

https://www.cnn.com/2016/03/23/politics/john-ehrlichman-richard-nixon-drug-war-blacks-hippie/index.html

"We knew we couldn't make it illegal to be either against the war or black, but by getting the public to associate the hippies with marijuana and blacks with heroin. And then criminalizing both heavily, we could disrupt those communities," Ehrlichman said. "We could arrest their leaders. raid their homes, break up their meetings, and vilify them night after night on the evening news. Did we know we were lying about the drugs? Of course we did."

Interesting.

[DJL 235]

2 hours ago, Coreece said:

I can pretty much agree with all of that, but I think some of the differences in approach can be attributed to the healthcare industry's role in the problem and the sheer number of people that have been affected by it, along with the liberal call against the war on drugs in general.

Definitely, we've learned a lot since our solution of over policing everything has failed. 

[gowlerk 2,193]

"May be an accident", 12 yo girl arrested...

https://www.cbs42.com/top-stories/girl-12-in-custody-after-2-teen-boys-shot-1-critical/2084194352

[gowlerk 2,193]

Be careful where you walk. Accidents happen...

https://www.wsmv.com/news/man-accidentally-shot-outside-clarksville-home/article_67aefd64-921e-11e9-849a-4347ed902a65.html

[turtlespeed 220]

On 6/18/2019 at 4:46 PM, SkyDekker said:

Well, you did start with programs that were specifically in place to target "them". The war on drugs was in large part aimed at incarcerating black Americans.

That doesn't answer any of the above asked questions.

[turtlespeed 220]

11 hours ago, billvon said:

Pay them - a lot.  Forgive their educational debts if they teach there for 4 years.  That both gets good teachers there and injects a lot of money into that community.  Stores will appear if a dozen highly paid people start looking for places to shop.

I'm game for a test area, or three.

Seems like it warrants at least a chance.

 

 

[SkyDekker 1,465]

11 hours ago, turtlespeed said:

That doesn't answer any of the above asked questions.

It would indeed require some thinking.

Since you had programs in place specifically targeting black people, I don't think it is much of a stretch to have programs in place to help black people. When people get treated differently and kicked down, the reaction is: oops, yes we shouldn't have done that, my bad. When people get treated differently and are being helped, the reaction is: this is unfair and horrible, all people are equal, this needs to be stopped immediately.

[wolfriverjoe 1,523]

7 hours ago, SkyDekker said:

When minorities who have historically been discriminated against get treated differently and are being helped, the reaction is: this is unfair and horrible, all people are equal, this needs to be stopped immediately.

FIFY 

[turtlespeed 220]

11 hours ago, SkyDekker said:

It would indeed require some thinking.

Since you had programs in place specifically targeting black people, I don't think it is much of a stretch to have programs in place to help black people. When people get treated differently and kicked down, the reaction is: oops, yes we shouldn't have done that, my bad. When people get treated differently and are being helped, the reaction is: this is unfair and horrible, all people are equal, this needs to be stopped immediately.

That still doesn't answer the questions.

[gowlerk 2,193]

Latest deaths.... A young adult, a teenage victim, and of course another two year old.....

https://www.koin.com/news/crime/2-families-grieve-he-killed-his-best-friend-/2088621555

https://www.wndu.com/content/news/Police-investigate-shooting-on-South-Bends-west-side-511554461.html

https://fox28media.com/news/local/child-2-dead-from-accidental-shooting-in-greenville-county

Killing machines don't actually make very good toys. But they are great at producing "thoughts and prayers".

[Coreece 190]

35 minutes ago, gowlerk said:

https://www.koin.com/news/crime/2-families-grieve-he-killed-his-best-friend-/2088621555

There obviously needs to be more laws against pointing a loaded gun at someone and pulling the trigger.  After all, states with more gun laws have less gun deaths.  Maybe we need 5 more.  Ya, 5 more laws against pointing a loaded gun at someone and pulling the trigger, that should teach them!

[gowlerk 2,193]

1 minute ago, Coreece said:

There obviously needs to be more laws against pointing a loaded gun at someone and pulling the trigger.  After all, states with more gun laws have less gun deaths.  Maybe we need 5 more.  Ya, 5 more laws against pointing a loaded gun at someone and pulling the trigger, that should teach them!

Or, maybe people who can't handle dangerous toys should not have them.

[Coreece 190]

2 minutes ago, gowlerk said:

4 minutes ago, Coreece said:

There obviously needs to be more laws against pointing a loaded gun at someone and pulling the trigger.  After all, states with more gun laws have less gun deaths.  Maybe we need 5 more.  Ya, 5 more laws against pointing a loaded gun at someone and pulling the trigger, that should teach them!

Or, maybe people who can't handle dangerous toys should not have them.

Yes, there are laws against consuming alcohol and using guns.  We just need more!

Edited June 21, 2019 by Coreece

[gowlerk 2,193]

Just now, Coreece said:

Yes, the are laws against consuming alcohol and using guns.

I was not aware of laws against consuming alcohol. Do tell.

[Coreece 190]

2 minutes ago, gowlerk said:

I was not aware of laws against consuming alcohol.

Well, there should be.  That'll fix the problem!

[gowlerk 2,193]

1 minute ago, Coreece said:

Well, there should be.  That'll fix the problem!

Would that stop the 2 yo from picking up the bottle and drinking himself to death?

[Coreece 190]

2 minutes ago, gowlerk said:

4 minutes ago, Coreece said:

Well, there should be.  That'll fix the problem!

Would that stop the 2 yo from picking up the bottle and drinking himself to death?

100,000+ children are poisoned by dangerous substances within their reach every year, get rid of them all!

[gowlerk 2,193]

6 minutes ago, Coreece said:

100,000+ children are poisoned by dangerous substances within their reach every year, get rid of them all!

Of course. That makes it okay. I get it. As long as you have killing machines to play with the dead kids are just someone else’s heartache. 

[Coreece 190]

6 minutes ago, gowlerk said:

14 minutes ago, Coreece said:

100,000+ children are poisoned by dangerous substances within their reach every year, get rid of them all!

Of course. That makes it okay. I get it. As long as you have killing machines to play with the dead kids are just someone else’s heartache. 

70+ kids accidentally get killed with a gun and you want to get rid of guns.  700+ kids accidentally die from dangerous substances, so why not get rid of all those as well?

Edited June 21, 2019 by Coreece