DNC Hopefuls

[JoeWeber 2,820]

18 minutes ago, brenthutch said:

Actually the Russian are helping Bernie.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/bernie-sanders-briefed-by-us-officials-that-russia-is-trying-to-help-his-presidential-campaign/2020/02/21/5ad396a6-54bd-11ea-929a-64efa7482a77_story.html

That's good. As long as they're helping both sides it all cancels out.

[gowlerk 2,249]

1 hour ago, brenthutch said:

Actually the Russian are helping Bernie.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/bernie-sanders-briefed-by-us-officials-that-russia-is-trying-to-help-his-presidential-campaign/2020/02/21/5ad396a6-54bd-11ea-929a-64efa7482a77_story.html

Yes, I know. I'm not really much of a chess player. But even I can look a couple moves ahead.

[turtlespeed 226]

Now THIS is how you properly Godwin!

 

[JerryBaumchen 1,432]

5 hours ago, gowlerk said:

Yes, I know. I'm not really much of a chess player. But even I can look a couple moves ahead.

Hi Ken,

Reminds me of how CREEP did everything that they could to get McGovern nominated.  And, it worked.

But, as my grandmother used to say:  'Watch what you wish for.'

'I am not a crook.'  

Jerry Baumchen

[yoink 321]

8 hours ago, gowlerk said:

Yes, I know. I'm not really much of a chess player. But even I can look a couple moves ahead.

We should pick a date when surprising and shocking information about Bernie is leaked to the press. 

I'm going with 11 days prior to the election. It worked last time.

Edited February 23, 2020 by yoink

[ryoder 1,590]

30 minutes ago, yoink said:

We should pick a date when surprising and shocking information about Bernie is leaked to the press. 

I'm going with 11 days prior to the election. It worked last time.

Well, this came out during the 2016 campaign:

https://www.newyorker.com/humor/borowitz-report/sanders-admits-receiving-free-checking-from-big-banks

[JerryBaumchen 1,432]

1 hour ago, ryoder said:

Well, this came out

Hi Robert,

I remember when that came out, and I thought, no big deal.  My bank gives me free checking for maintaining a certain minimum amount of money in my accounts.

Now, if they ( all of those banks ) did this just for Bernie, then it would be something.  If it is normal for those banks; then, so what.

Jerry Baumchen

[mistercwood 287]

6 minutes ago, JerryBaumchen said:

Now, if they ( all of those banks ) did this just for Bernie, then it would be something.  If it is normal for those banks; then, so what.

Look closer at the url...

[JerryBaumchen 1,432]

47 minutes ago, mistercwood said:

Look closer at the url...

Hi mister,

I just re-read the entire article ( for the 3rd time ).  I do not see where it was just for him & only him.

Do you see it that way?  Maybe we are interpreting something differently.

Jerry Baumchen

[mistercwood 287]

The whole piece reads as satire - he got "free checking" because he maintained a certain minimum balance of $500, this sounds like a normal discount extended to anyone who does the same. The Clinton campaign "jumps" on that and spins it as him paying $500 to banks for favours. There's also the reference to him having auto-cover that I presume provides the discount that is also referenced as him being on the take agin.

Plus the article is listed under Humour in the link, pretty much seals it.

[ryoder 1,590]

12 minutes ago, JerryBaumchen said:

Hi mister,

I just re-read the entire article ( for the 3rd time ).  I do not see where it was just for him & only him.

Do you see it that way?  Maybe we are interpreting something differently.

Jerry Baumchen

Hint: when you see the name "Andy Borowitz" as the author of an article, it is firmly tongue-in-cheek.

Try some of his other articles: https://www.newyorker.com/contributors/andy-borowitz

Edited February 24, 2020 by ryoder

[JerryBaumchen 1,432]

3 hours ago, ryoder said:

Hint: when you see the name "Andy Borowitz" as the author of an article, it is firmly tongue-in-cheek.

Try some of his other articles: https://www.newyorker.com/contributors/andy-borowitz

Hi Robert,

Re:  'Well, this came out during the 2016 campaign:'

Time to move on.

How about this ( and this is not humorous ):  https://www.politico.com/news/2020/02/23/sanders-democratic-establishment-panic-mode-117065

Jerry Baumchen

[airdvr 210]

Bernie Sanders' disastrous answer on '60 Minutes'

Cooper: Do you have -- a price tag for all of these things?

Sanders: No, I don't. We try to -- no, you mentioned making public colleges and universities tuition free and canceling all student debt, that's correct. That's what I want to do. We pay for that through a modest tax on Wall Street speculation.

Cooper: But you say you don't know what the total price is, but you know how it's gonna be paid for. How do you know it's gonna be paid for if you don't know how much the price is?

Sanders: Well, I can't -- you know, I can't rattle off to you every nickel and every dime. But we have accounted for -- you -- you talked about "Medicare for All." We have options out there that will pay for it.

Bernie has no idea how all this gets paid for.  The CBO estimates...

Among the most expensive elements of the Sanders plan are:
His single-payer health care plan, which would replace all private health insurance with a government-run program. The center-left Urban Institute estimated last year that such a plan would increase federal spending on health care by about $34 trillion over the next decade, an estimate in line with projections by the Rand Corp. and other analysts.
Sanders' "Green New Deal" proposal to end the nation's reliance on fossil fuels will cost $16.3 trillion over the next decade, according to the campaign's calculations.
Sanders says on his website that he will spend $2.5 trillion over the next decade to build 10 million more units of affordable housing.
Sanders has endorsed proposals to spend $1 trillion over the next decade on improving the nation's infrastructure.
Sanders has proposed to eliminate tuition and fees at all public colleges and universities and to pay off all $1.6 trillion in student debt. Sanders puts the 10-year cost of tuition-free public college at $480 billion (though other estimates are somewhat higher). That would bring the cost of his higher education agenda to slightly above $2 trillion.
Sanders has proposed an array of increases in federal spending on K-12, including a guaranteed $60,000 minimum salary for all teachers, that would likely cost slightly more than $1 trillion over a decade.
*Sanders' website also says he supports universal preschool for 3- and 4-year-olds, as well as universal child care support. In a 2016 analysis of Sanders' program, MacGuineas' group put the 10-year cost of that proposal at $350 billion.
*Sanders' plan to raise Social Security benefits would cost about $275 billion over a decade, MacGuineas' group has calculated. (Riedl puts the cost much higher in his estimates.)

 

So in the end just another tax and spend, with the emphasis on spend.  Any candidate promising to shift the burden of student loans onto the general public can go suck it in my book.

[yoink 321]

37 minutes ago, airdvr said:

Bernie Sanders' disastrous answer on '60 Minutes'

Cooper: Do you have -- a price tag for all of these things?

Sanders: No, I don't. We try to -- no, you mentioned making public colleges and universities tuition free and canceling all student debt, that's correct. That's what I want to do. We pay for that through a modest tax on Wall Street speculation.

Cooper: But you say you don't know what the total price is, but you know how it's gonna be paid for. How do you know it's gonna be paid for if you don't know how much the price is?

Sanders: Well, I can't -- you know, I can't rattle off to you every nickel and every dime. But we have accounted for -- you -- you talked about "Medicare for All." We have options out there that will pay for it.

Bernie has no idea how all this gets paid for.  The CBO estimates...

Among the most expensive elements of the Sanders plan are:
His single-payer health care plan, which would replace all private health insurance with a government-run program. The center-left Urban Institute estimated last year that such a plan would increase federal spending on health care by about $34 trillion over the next decade, an estimate in line with projections by the Rand Corp. and other analysts.
Sanders' "Green New Deal" proposal to end the nation's reliance on fossil fuels will cost $16.3 trillion over the next decade, according to the campaign's calculations.
Sanders says on his website that he will spend $2.5 trillion over the next decade to build 10 million more units of affordable housing.
Sanders has endorsed proposals to spend $1 trillion over the next decade on improving the nation's infrastructure.
Sanders has proposed to eliminate tuition and fees at all public colleges and universities and to pay off all $1.6 trillion in student debt. Sanders puts the 10-year cost of tuition-free public college at $480 billion (though other estimates are somewhat higher). That would bring the cost of his higher education agenda to slightly above $2 trillion.
Sanders has proposed an array of increases in federal spending on K-12, including a guaranteed $60,000 minimum salary for all teachers, that would likely cost slightly more than $1 trillion over a decade.
*Sanders' website also says he supports universal preschool for 3- and 4-year-olds, as well as universal child care support. In a 2016 analysis of Sanders' program, MacGuineas' group put the 10-year cost of that proposal at $350 billion.
*Sanders' plan to raise Social Security benefits would cost about $275 billion over a decade, MacGuineas' group has calculated. (Riedl puts the cost much higher in his estimates.)

 

So in the end just another tax and spend, with the emphasis on spend.  Any candidate promising to shift the burden of student loans onto the general public can go suck it in my book.

This has always been my biggest issue with Bernie's position. 

I'm OK with some of these, but all of them in a single agenda is far too much. That said, I still think he'll do less damage over the next 4 years than Trump.

 

[JoeWeber 2,820]

1 minute ago, yoink said:

This has always been my biggest issue with Bernie's position. 

I'm OK with some of these, but all of them in a single agenda is far too much. That said, I still think he'll do less damage over the next 4 years than Trump.

 

I believe if he get's the nomination he'll cause exactly as much damage as Trump.

[ryoder 1,590]

49 minutes ago, yoink said:

This has always been my biggest issue with Bernie's position. 

I'm OK with some of these, but all of them in a single agenda is far too much. That said, I still think he'll do less damage over the next 4 years than Trump.

 

The bottom line is what his agenda is remains irrelevant unless both houses of congress are willing to pass it. The job of the executive branch is to carry out the law. Congress makes the law.

Edited February 24, 2020 by ryoder

[DJL 235]

20 hours ago, yoink said:

We should pick a date when surprising and shocking information about Bernie is leaked to the press. 

I'm going with 11 days prior to the election. It worked last time.

They won't release anything until he's through the Primaries.  Republicans and Russians want a Trump vs. Bernie matchup because it's Trump's best chance.

[JerryBaumchen 1,432]

36 minutes ago, ryoder said:

The bottom line is . . . 

Hi Robert,

If he gets the nomination ( IMO Super Tuesday should be a make/break deal ), the DNC will water it all down.

IMO airdvr should re-check on the promises Trump made; and how many have come to fruition.

It's called politics, the art of compromise; not The Art of the Deal.

Jerry Baumchen

[SkyDekker 1,465]

On 2/23/2020 at 4:31 AM, brenthutch said:

Actually the Russian are helping Bernie.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/bernie-sanders-briefed-by-us-officials-that-russia-is-trying-to-help-his-presidential-campaign/2020/02/21/5ad396a6-54bd-11ea-929a-64efa7482a77_story.html

Of course they are. A Trump vs.Bernie match-up would sow the most discourse. If I wanted to heavily divide  apopulation, that would be the exact two candidates I would want. Specially in a country which has done little, if anything to try and prevent foreign information warfare.

[SkyDekker 1,465]

1 hour ago, airdvr said:

So in the end just another tax and spend, with the emphasis on spend.  Any candidate promising to shift the burden of student loans onto the general public can go suck it in my book.

But of course heartily support your money going to CEOs.

Bernie should have said that the work generated by his plans would increase tax revenues enough to pay for itself. That is what the American public has faithfully swallowed for decades now.

[turtlespeed 226]

1 hour ago, DJL said:

They won't release anything until he's through the Primaries.  Republicans and Russians want a Trump vs. Bernie matchup because it's Trump's best chance.

I disagree.

Bide v Trump would be an easier trump victory.

So would Buttigieg,  So would Warren, even B-Berg.

[DJL 235]

Just now, turtlespeed said:

I disagree.

Bide v Trump would be an easier trump victory.

So would Buttigieg,  So would Warren, even B-Berg.

You think Bernie has a better chance than any other candidate?

There IS Bernie "dirt" out there, by the way and we're not hearing a peep.  Let's put a pin in this one.  If Bernie DOES win the Primary you'll see an explosion of anti-Bernie narratives that aren't even whispers right now.  

[turtlespeed 226]

4 minutes ago, DJL said:

You think Bernie has a better chance than any other candidate?

There IS Bernie "dirt" out there, by the way and we're not hearing a peep.  Let's put a pin in this one.  If Bernie DOES win the Primary you'll see an explosion of anti-Bernie narratives that aren't even whispers right now.  

Yeah - I do - 

We will see what happens tomorrow.

I'm hoping that if Sanders is installed, then the House and the Senate will reign him in.

Maybe we can have a Bipartisan effort and get back on good terms. 

[brenthutch 444]

6 hours ago, JoeWeber said:

I believe if he get's the nomination he'll cause exactly as much damage as Trump.

Because if he gets the nomination, Trump will get four more years. IOW exactly as much damage as a Trump.

[JoeWeber 2,820]

1 hour ago, brenthutch said:

Because if he gets the nomination, Trump will get four more years. IOW exactly as much damage as a Trump.

By God you're right. Never occurred to me.