crotalus01 0 #1 June 1, 2006 had my first cutaway this weekend on jump #52, it was a malfunction i had never seen before. i deployed at around 4K on the last load of the day. when i looked up to do a controlability check, i had line twists. the risers were completely straight coming off my shoulders, but there were 4 complete twists in my lines midway between the top of the risers and the start of the cascades, and my slider was hung up in them. i tried to kick out of it, but i could only get about half a twist out before it snapped me back around. about 2.5K i pulled left and right and chopped it since i was flying away from the DZ and it was already pretty dark. reserve deployed with no problems and i PLFed right at the edge of the DZ. my question is, how the hell did i get 4 twists right in the center of my lines like that? i very likely was slightly unstable when i deployed (2nd jump on a new container and right before deployment i yanked on the chest strap - old container has a really wide strap, this one is really thin - stupid i know but it was kinda slapping me and i wanted to make sure; noobie thing i guess). but if the bag lifted off my back spinning shouldnt it have twisted my risers? found my main and freebag the next morning (too dark to look when i landed the reserve). anyone have any ideas? i wish i had pictures of it. edit to add as far as i could tell i had an on-heading opening, there was no spinning and the canopy was square and flying straight. but with those twists it was not safely landable so it had to go. As for me and my house, we will serve the LORD... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
crotalus01 0 #2 June 1, 2006 anyone??? anyone of you up-jumpers have any ideas how this mal hapened? or is it just one of those "shit happens" things? As for me and my house, we will serve the LORD... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kelpdiver 2 #3 June 1, 2006 could be a step through, but the one I had I was able to ID on the ground as "not right" and fix. No idea what it would look like on opening, but would mean a cutaway. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
crotalus01 0 #4 June 1, 2006 thanks, but not a step-through. ran my lines 5 times as i suck at packing (never packed a mal though). very distinct 4 twists right in the center of my lines hanging up my slider. risers coming off my shoulders were perfectly straight. weird huh? As for me and my house, we will serve the LORD... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
yamtx73 0 #5 June 1, 2006 I'm not an up jumper but I've seen this same thing on a student rig... fortunately the Navigator was big enough I was able to just pull the risers apart and clear the twists...The only naturals in this sport shit thru feathers... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kelpdiver 2 #6 June 1, 2006 aye - my line twists tend to have my head pinned forward...but I recall one that was higher up and that one was harder to clear. It was the only time I had to employ the scissor kick method to get myself undone - the minor ones undo themselves and the head pinners I use my hands to spin me out of it from below. Nice thing about a big rectangular canopy is it happily flies straight while I deal with this. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
justinb138 0 #7 June 1, 2006 Quote my question is, how the hell did i get 4 twists right in the center of my lines like that? i very likely was slightly unstable when i deployed You just answered your own question. Quote i tried to kick out of it, but i could only get about half a twist out before it snapped me back around. Did you try twisting the other way to make sure you were going in the right direction? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AggieDave 6 #8 June 1, 2006 QuoteDid you try twisting the other way to make sure you were going in the right direction? On a large canopy on a light wingloading if you have uneven risers in linetwists it can cause the problem as described here. On a smaller canopy it'll put you on your back spinning. On a large canopy you might get a slight turn and if the canopy is twisted the same way as the turn it will be much harder to overcome the forces in the turn with the twists to untwist yourself. Same kind of reaction, though. Grab the "longer riser" and pull down HARD to even the risers as you grab the other riser and kick out like normal.--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bch7773 0 #9 June 1, 2006 Quote i tried to kick out of it, but i could only get about half a twist out before it snapped me back around. about 2.5K i pulled left and right and chopped it its possible that if it was twisting you back into the twists that you were kicking the wrong way. If line twists are new to you, then somebody didn't learn via S/L MB 3528, RB 1182 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
crotalus01 0 #10 June 1, 2006 unfortunately linetwists is not new to me. and i have kicked out of way more serious looking twists than these (like from the base of my neck to the slider one day when i got slammed). normally i wouldnt consider linetwist to be a malfunction since i fly a pretty big canopy, but these just wouldnt come out. As for me and my house, we will serve the LORD... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Scrumpot 1 #11 June 1, 2006 Do you single-stow each line-bite or double stow them? Do you single only the "locking" stows, then double the rest? Or some combination thereof? Also, I have seen where a low-time jumper/packer such as yourself has missed a grommet in the bag flap/cover and stowed a bite. Do you have a 2 grommet or a 4 grommet bag? There are actually several possibilities to have induced what you are describing to occur, based on several variables that maybe with more info we can discern. If your 1st 2-3 stow bites released evenly as they should as the bag came off your back, but the 3rd or 4th got hung up, even just briefly because of one of these potential variables, it is quite conceivable that your twists (or even a small tension knot combined with them) could occur exactly where they did, and as you are describing. Chances are though, that now at this point, you will probably never KNOW. Hope at least this much helps. Blues, -Grantcoitus non circum - Moab Stone Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
crotalus01 0 #12 June 1, 2006 hey thanks for the info Grant. i think we are looking at a tension knot from some PMs i have received. thanks all for speculating what it could have been. btw Grant thanks for the info on the bag grommets. i have a 4 grommet bag and have never missed one (but wouldnt say i never would). never even thought about what the results would be if someone skipped a grommet until you brought it up. thanks for something to seriously think about. blues, dan As for me and my house, we will serve the LORD... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Trae 1 #13 June 1, 2006 in reply to "the risers were completely straight coming off my shoulders, but there were 4 complete twists in my lines midway between the top of the risers and the start of the cascades, and my slider was hung up in them. i tried to kick out of it, but i could only get about half a twist out before it snapped me back around." ................................... I'm wondering if the slider was holding the twists as a makeshift knot. The midway location of the twist /snag /knot suggests the twists developed as the slider was coming down and trapped it twisting around it. This would create a different situation than if the slider was above or below the twists and may be why you couldn't kick out. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
crotalus01 0 #14 June 2, 2006 more food for thought. thanks Trae. As for me and my house, we will serve the LORD... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sundevil777 102 #15 June 2, 2006 I think it had nothing to do with body position. I think that if your slider is only part way down, and at the position where the line twists start, means that the slider hung up on something, and when just one grommet gets stopped, you can imagine how that might cause the canopy to twist up. Do you check the brake lines for twists? That can cause the slider to hang up. Also, were you sure that one brake didn't perhaps get unstowed prematurely?People are sick and tired of being told that ordinary and decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired. I’m certainly not, and I’m sick and tired of being told that I am Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
crotalus01 0 #16 June 2, 2006 both brakes were stowed. we checked that when we recovered the canopy. i think AggieDave may be right and it was a tension knot or as you said the slider hung a grommet. i am definitely going to start double checking that my brakelines are untwisted and clean before packing now. thanks all for the replies. As for me and my house, we will serve the LORD... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bmcd308 0 #17 June 13, 2006 Great quote from Javelin guy: "Oh, shit. That was Dan? I haven't even cashed that guy's check yet." ---------------------------------- www.jumpelvis.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
