covid-19

[billvon 3,006]

11 hours ago, base698 said:

A vaccine so good it doesn't protect the people who get it.

It does protect the people who get it.  But like everything else, from airbags to parachutes to getting an Uber when you are drunk, it's not 100%.

Quote

the worst of all propaganda equating kids contracting covid with being equal to ICU visits.

You haven't been doing much research if you think that's propaganda.

Aug. 16, 2021 -- The number of children hospitalized with COVID-19 in the U.S. hit a record high on Saturday, with more than 1,900 kids in hospitals. . . .

The number of newly hospitalized COVID-19 patients for ages 18-49 also hit record highs this week. A fifth of the nation’s hospitalizations are in Florida, where the number of COVID-19 patients hit a record high of 16,100 on Saturday. More than 90% of the state’s intensive care unit beds are filled.

More than 90% of the ICU beds in Texas are full as well. On Friday, there were no pediatric ICU beds available in Dallas or the 19 surrounding counties, which means that young patients would be transported father away for care — even Oklahoma City.

https://www.webmd.com/lung/news/20210816/u-s-reports-record-covid-hospitalizations-of-children

Quote

Interested in Oofscience rebuttal of leaky vaccines not being the cause of evolution in virus due to selection pressures.

You have three choices here.

1) Vaccinate no one; let millions die.  Mutations are fairly high since there's so much disease, and each replication is an opportunity to mutate.
2) Vaccinate everyone; save millions.  Mutations are lower but still significant, since there is now selective pressure (but far fewer replications.)
3) Vaccinate about half the people.  This is the highest possible mutation rate.  Not only do you have a huge reservoir of disease, you ALSO have selective pressure.  If you want new strains, this is what you do.

Which scenario do you prefer?

[billvon 3,006]

1 hour ago, ryoder said:

Oh, for chrissake!

This is AWESOME.  If this convinces people to get vaccinated, it is totally worth it!  Have Biden come out strongly against it and threaten to ban anti-venom kits.  You'll have conservatives dropping their dewormer and running out to camping stores to get those kits.

[JoeWeber 2,736]

2 hours ago, ryoder said:

Oh, for chrissake!

 

Crap. Now my kit is worthless. I even had a nice picture of a nun sucking rattlesnake venom out of a cowboy on the box.

[base698 19]

1 hour ago, billvon said:

It does protect the people who get it.  But like everything else, from airbags to parachutes to getting an Uber when you are drunk, it's not 100%.

You haven't been doing much research if you think that's propaganda.

Aug. 16, 2021 -- The number of children hospitalized with COVID-19 in the U.S. hit a record high on Saturday, with more than 1,900 kids in hospitals. . . .

The number of newly hospitalized COVID-19 patients for ages 18-49 also hit record highs this week. A fifth of the nation’s hospitalizations are in Florida, where the number of COVID-19 patients hit a record high of 16,100 on Saturday. More than 90% of the state’s intensive care unit beds are filled.

More than 90% of the ICU beds in Texas are full as well. On Friday, there were no pediatric ICU beds available in Dallas or the 19 surrounding counties, which means that young patients would be transported father away for care — even Oklahoma City.

https://www.webmd.com/lung/news/20210816/u-s-reports-record-covid-hospitalizations-of-children

You have three choices here.

1) Vaccinate no one; let millions die.  Mutations are fairly high since there's so much disease, and each replication is an opportunity to mutate.
2) Vaccinate everyone; save millions.  Mutations are lower but still significant, since there is now selective pressure (but far fewer replications.)
3) Vaccinate about half the people.  This is the highest possible mutation rate.  Not only do you have a huge reservoir of disease, you ALSO have selective pressure.  If you want new strains, this is what you do.

Which scenario do you prefer?

Graph below shows cases per 100k for < 5 and 5-17.  There was a spike but it doesn't seem that much different than the previous wave.  2.3 to 2.6 per 100k.  Given 77 million kids that comes to 2000 hospitalized kids if every one of them were infected with covid at the same time.  

And again I'm being charitable.  I'm assuming all under 17 at the higher hospitalization rate of 2.6.  also assuming hospitalization means with covid and not broken arm then tests while treated (which has and does happen) as alluded to above by someone else.

https://gis.cdc.gov/grasp/covidnet/covid19_3.html

 

Also note the common propaganda technique here :

“That means if your child’s in a car wreck, if your child has a congenital heart defect or something and needs an ICU bed, or more likely, if they have COVID and need an ICU bed, we don’t have one,” Clay Jenkins, a Dallas County judge, said on Friday."

Why quote a Dallas county judge and not someone in the hospital?

https://gis.cdc.gov/grasp/covidnet/covid19_3.html

Edited September 23, 2021 by base698

[ryoder 1,590]

30 minutes ago, JoeWeber said:

Crap. Now my kit is worthless. I even had a nice picture of a nun sucking rattlesnake venom out of a cowboy on the box.

A discussion of snakebite requires a clip from "Bananas"(1971):

 

Edited September 23, 2021 by ryoder

[base698 19]

On 9/22/2021 at 8:27 AM, wmw999 said:

Tô go along with that are the people who died early in the pandemic who weren’t classified as Covid because they died at home, and their authorities assumed all Covid deaths were in hospitals. They probably don’t balance out, but error is rarely only in one direction. 
It’s nearly always safer to ascribe problems to error than to conspiracy. 
Wendy P. 

https://sanjosespotlight.com/santa-clara-county-revises-total-covid-deaths-by-over-20/

https://www.google.com/amp/s/wpde.com/amp/news/nation-world/man-who-died-in-motorcycle-crash-counted-as-covid-19-death-in-florida-report-07-18-2020

In addition in overzealous use of ventilators they were basically executing people early in the pandemic before treating like other respiratory disease with oxygen and steroids.  Treatment has improved dramatically.

[gowlerk 2,216]

13 hours ago, base698 said:

I've not seen this anywhere but the worst of all propaganda equating kids contracting covid with being equal to ICU visits.

What is happening is that the sheer number of kids contracting the delta variant is leading to some of them getting very sick. As always when you deal with small fractions of a very large number those fractions become large themselves. Of course all this is completely preventable.

[gowlerk 2,216]

13 hours ago, base698 said:

A vaccine so good it doesn't protect the people who get it.

It is good enough that if everyone would get vaccinated the R number would drop low enough that the virus would disappear before long. As far a I know no vaccine is 100% effective on an individual basis. Several have been 100% effective in a society. But some people are too stupid and/or selfish to understand what is really a simple thing.

[nwt 131]

55 minutes ago, base698 said:

Also note the common propaganda technique here :

“That means if your child’s in a car wreck, if your child has a congenital heart defect or something and needs an ICU bed, or more likely, if they have COVID and need an ICU bed, we don’t have one,” Clay Jenkins, a Dallas County judge, said on Friday."

Why quote a Dallas county judge and not someone in the hospital?

Lol you're the one who cited the reference. What do you think you're proving by pointing out flaws in references you're citing yourself?

37 minutes ago, base698 said:

https://sanjosespotlight.com/santa-clara-county-revises-total-covid-deaths-by-over-20/

https://www.google.com/amp/s/wpde.com/amp/news/nation-world/man-who-died-in-motorcycle-crash-counted-as-covid-19-death-in-florida-report-07-18-2020

In addition in overzealous use of ventilators they were basically executing people early in the pandemic before treating like other respiratory disease with oxygen and steroids.  Treatment has improved dramatically.

This, combined with an excess death measure lower than COVID deaths, could be compelling evidence that COVID deaths are being over-counted.

As it turns out, excess deaths (675K - 850K) are the same or higher than COVID deaths (680K), indicating that COVID deaths are either accurate or under-counted.

[base698 19]

27 minutes ago, nwt said:

Lol you're the one who cited the reference. What do you think you're proving by pointing out flaws in references you're citing yourself?

Mr Billvon, quoted the WebMD article in reference to me saying kids dying was propaganda.  In that article they claim 1900 kids were hospitalized.

I think that's fishy propaganda because:

If every child had covid in the country at the same time that would only equate to 2000 hospitalized kids based on the quoted CDC data  above.

Dude they quoted about kids being sent to Oklahoma was a judge, and not at anyway affiliated with the hospital or public health.

Edited September 23, 2021 by base698

[base698 19]

32 minutes ago, gowlerk said:

What is happening is that the sheer number of kids contracting the delta variant is leading to some of them getting very sick. As always when you deal with small fractions of a very large number those fractions become large themselves. Of course all this is completely preventable.

See above.  A rate of 2.6 per hundred thousand equals 2000 hospitalizrd kids if all 77 million kids contracted covid.

Not even considering, some kids are vaccinated, a lot had covid and have immunity and the rate is half for children under 5.  Having 2000 kids in the hospital the same week seems impossible.  

Edited September 23, 2021 by base698

[olofscience 480]

4 minutes ago, base698 said:

See above. 

So...are you going to address my last post, or just ignore it and pretend your point wasn't completely demolished?

Also waiting for your rebuttal on my calculations for age group 40-49. We can discuss the statistics of covid and children afterwards.

[base698 19]

Just now, olofscience said:

So...are you going to address my last post, or just ignore it and pretend your point wasn't completely demolished?

Also waiting for your rebuttal on my calculations for age group 40-49. We can discuss the statistics of covid and children afterwards.

I'm on parental leave and have sporadic access to mobile internet.  Its on my list :)

[olofscience 480]

1 minute ago, base698 said:

I'm on parental leave and have sporadic access to mobile internet.  Its on my list :)

Sure thing. I shall throw myself out of aircraft in the meantime.

[nwt 131]

10 minutes ago, base698 said:

Mr Billvon, quoted the WebMD article in reference to me saying kids dying was propaganda.  In that article they claim 1900 kids were hospitalized.

Dude they quoted about kids being sent to Oklahoma was a judge, and not at anyway affiliated with the hospital or public health.

Right... Billvon quoted an article from WebMD and then you quoted an article from CBS and pointed out a flaw in it... Completely separate articles...

[base698 19]

2 minutes ago, nwt said:

Right... Billvon quoted an article from WebMD and then you quoted an article from CBS and pointed out a flaw in it... Completely separate articles...

Its from the WebMD article.  The link is the CDC data from my screenshot.  

 

Edited September 23, 2021 by base698

[nwt 131]

33 minutes ago, base698 said:

Its from the WebMD article.  The link is the CDC data from my screenshot.  

 

Looks like WebMD isn't such a great source.

[headoverheels 333]

44 minutes ago, base698 said:

See above.  A rate of 2.6 per hundred thousand equals 2000 hospitalizrd kids if all 77 million kids contracted covid.

Not even considering, some kids are vaccinated, a lot had covid and have immunity and the rate is half for children under 5.  Having 2000 kids in the hospital the same week seems impossible.  

 On September 21st, the Texas Department of State Health Services listed 253 cases of children hospitalized with covid (now 237 cases in screen shot below).   Multiplying by US population/Texas population, then scaling downward to adjust for the higher overall infection rate in Texas vs. US overall, that 237 would be about 2300 kids for the entire country.  So 2000 current may not be that unlikely.

[billvon 3,006]

2 hours ago, base698 said:

Also note the common propaganda technique here :

Followed not two posts later by:

Quote

In addition in overzealous use of ventilators they were basically executing people early in the pandemic

Now that's funny.

Quote

Why quote a Dallas county judge and not someone in the hospital?

Because he is the person who does the COVID-19 updates for Dallas County, and thus would have the best access to that information.  

https://www.dallascounty.org/covid-19/judge-press-releases.php

[billvon 3,006]

1 hour ago, base698 said:

Not even considering, some kids are vaccinated, a lot had covid and have immunity and the rate is half for children under 5.  Having 2000 kids in the hospital the same week seems impossible.  

Less than half of those kids can even get vaccinated, since vaccines for under-12 kids are not approved yet.   Thus the higher rates.

And no, "a lot" did not have COVID already.  So far there have been about 43 million reported COVID cases in the US.  Even if that is underreported by a factor of 2, that means only about 25% of the US has had a COVID infection at some point.  Far less than half.

We are seeing a rise in child infections/hospitalizations because:

1) Delta is far more infectious than earlier strains and more kids are getting infected
2) Most kids are not eligible for a vaccination
3) Kids have become the latest political lever, and many republicans are going to great lengths to ensure that attempts to protect them from COVID fail.

 

[JerryBaumchen 1,373]

Hi folks,

OK, you Canadians:  What is going on?

'he asked the nurse why she vaccinated his wife without approval, without his consent'

Canadian man punches nurse in the face multiple times after his wife is vaccinated for Covid-19 without his consent (msn.com)

What I really want to know is since when does a woman have to have her spouse's consent before doing almost anything?

What a Neanderthal.

Jerry Baumchen

[ryoder 1,590]

37 minutes ago, JerryBaumchen said:

Hi folks,

OK, you Canadians:  What is going on?

'he asked the nurse why she vaccinated his wife without approval, without his consent'

Canadian man punches nurse in the face multiple times after his wife is vaccinated for Covid-19 without his consent (msn.com)

What I really want to know is since when does a woman have to have her spouse's consent before doing almost anything?

What a Neanderthal.

Jerry Baumchen

It must be in the Quran somewhere; Just ask the Taliban.

[headoverheels 333]

53 minutes ago, JerryBaumchen said:

 

'he asked the nurse why she vaccinated his wife without approval, without his consent'

Canadian man punches nurse in the face multiple times after his wife is vaccinated for Covid-19 without his consent (msn.com)

 

From the article, it is not apparent whether the nurse had consent at all.  I can't imagine that it isn't standard procedure to have the vaccinee sign a consent first, though.

 

[ryoder 1,590]

5 minutes ago, headoverheels said:

From the article, it is not apparent whether the nurse had consent at all.  I can't imagine that it isn't standard procedure to have the vaccinee sign a consent first, though.

 

Hunt for husband who 'punched nurse for vaccinating his wife without his consent'

The man from Quebec, Canada told the staff at Brunet pharmacy that they needed his consent before his wife received the jab. He could not understand that this was not the case. Pharmacy staff stated that they did not need anyone's permission but the person who was receiving the vaccine.

Implication here that she consented.

[lippy 918]

1 hour ago, ryoder said:

It must be in the Quran somewhere; Just ask the Taliban.

Better yet ask Windsor, he’s studied that book extensively