Longmont City Council will take up skydiving noise

[BigMikeH77 0]

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would I.... nope not now and most likely never will because that fund does little, it's a drop of water in a vast ocean, (those I know who did get funding said it was helpful to them, what few there are) and because I don't agree with how OUR due monies is wasted on other pet projects that have little to do with true advocacy and keeping skydivers protected to use FFA's.

From my understanding, the AAD Fund is not supported by USPA membership dues and donations are completely optional. That being said, I can't imaging there is a vast ocean amount of money being misused. Are you upset with the way in which your dues are spent in general?

[grimmie 186]

stratostar

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CQS attacked airport access first. That didn't work too well.

I contributed to the airport access fund this year and plan to do the same next year. How about you?

So you think that AAD fund had anything to do with keeping CQS from getting any where for the last two yrs? ROFLMAO

Yea that is a good one. Had nothing to do with it at all! The federal aviation laws is what stopped them and will stop them again, not the tiny minor threat of the USPA AAD fund.... LOL

You did, good for you, feel free to again, no one is stopping you. Did I and would I.... nope not now and most likely never will because that fund does little, it's a drop of water in a vast ocean, (those I know who did get funding said it was helpful to them, what few there are) and because I don't agree with how OUR due monies is wasted on other pet projects that have little to do with true advocacy and keeping skydivers protected to use FFA's.

Stratostar. You know, and I know, without really knowing, that the USPA is on top of the Longmont issues.

You also know that the AAD fund has helped DZOs win FAA Part 16 cases, which affects all of us for the good in the long haul.

The fund is used for cases that will have a positive outcome, furthering our quest to rightfully access airports for skydiving.

You contradict yourself by saying it does no good and then saying it has helped the few that received funding.

While I am with you, and take issue with certain ways our "dues" are spent, I think that contributing to the AAD fund is a good thing.

And as far as your dues money being spent, how much FREE information and assistance has the USPA given you over the years to get your own DZ running? More than your $35 per year I'm sure.

Don't throw the baby out with the bathwater...

[mirage62 0]

Hey does this dz ever have a boogie? Wouldn't it be great to have a boogie that was nothing more to come and fun jump?Really run that Otter up and down? No public comments.....just skydivers having fun?

Kevin Keenan is my hero, a double FUP, he does so much with so little

[FlyingRhenquest 1]

mirage62

Hey does this dz ever have a boogie? Wouldn't it be great to have a boogie that was nothing more to come and fun jump?Really run that Otter up and down? No public comments.....just skydivers having fun?

There was a swooping competition a while back you can find on teh youtubes. Having a boogie 10 minutes from the house would be a lot of fun. It'd finally give me an excuse to get a kegerator and grill and have a bunch of skydivers over for a cook-out!

I'm trying to teach myself how to set things on fire with my mind. Hey... is it hot in here?

[Boomerdog 0]

I truly share your sentiment to ignore these people and let them bitch and moan. But we do so at the potential peril of the sport we love. Yup, I'm new to skydiving; introduced to it in my 50's and now hoplessly hooked and loving every minute of it.

BUT I AM NOT new to the game of politics and how it is played and the potential political weapons that CQS has at their disposal.

Whether anyone here wants to admit it or stay silent, here's a dose of reality; these people are at war with the sport of skydiving. First rule of war is to "know thy enemy." Rest assured, CQS may be a little slow on the uptake as their efforts have spanned a few years. But with every effort in their struggle, they are learning and eventually they will find a weak point and exploit it.

Yes, all of us here are aware of FAA Use Regulations. Please DON'T rest on this single point of law. Remember, there's the EPA, OSHA and other state and federal agencies that have their statutory compliance requirements. The airport and the DZ must also comply with these laws as well.

I trust everyone has seen the CQS Facebook page and there is a posting on lead tetraethyl in AVGAS. Lead in AVGAS is legal of course but it also speaks to the creative angles CQS will pursue. I"m not giving them ideas...it should be credibly assumed that they already know the alternate strategies to pursue as such a posting demonstrates.

What's next, clandestine photography and a sympathetic journalist to get inside the fenceline to take pictures then publish a story that fits their narative and makes the sport of skydiving out to be comprised of people who disregard the laws by their craven selfishness?

Once a group such as CQS is successful, it WILL NOT STOP THERE. Other groups in other cities will benchmark their tactics and strategies and CQS will be all too happy to help. Sympathetic politicians who see an opportunity to get elected will glom on.

The terms of the war then change and WE will be on the defensive as we watch DZ's unpopular with a community disappear.

So...today, I will leave work and tonight, I will write a cheque out to the USPA legal fund to protect my interests and the interest of every skydiver here. In the interest of full disclosure, I am a USPA member. I am not part of any of the inner workings nor do I volunteer extra time to support the USPA, but I might have to start. If our enemies AND THEY ARE OUR ENEMIES (for that is how they see us) are successful in Longmont, whose next?

So, for the cost of two jumps "all the way up," I'll be writing a cheque. I humbly encourage the same from others. Perhaps all you can give is the cost of one hop and pop and forgo that one jump every month so you'll still have a DZ nearby and your "family" of fellow skydivers. I will also make a committment to make monthly contributions to this fund. I would encourage everyone to consider this as well but ultimately we all have to make our own choices in such matters and I will wholeheartedly respect those decisions.

What's the cliche, "Think Globally, Act Locally." Think Strategic, Execute Tactically!"

Hate to break the bad news folks but don't underestimate the possibility that all of us will be affected if CQS prevails in Longmont, Colorado. The problem WILL NOT go away. I've read the articles on the net and conclude, THIS IS A FIGHT to finality and there WILL BE a clear winner and clear loser.
Choose which one you want to be and act accordingly.
I will now step off my soapboax and sincerely thank everyone here for reading. Agree or throw rocks if you like.

[obelixtim 150]

Well said. Never underestimate your enemy.

My computer beat me at chess, It was no match for me at kickboxing....

[normiss 841]

It REALLY helps that they use lies though.

There are no hush kits for Otters, nor do they use AVGAS.




ETA: Lawsuit filed

PS: be sure to Google how close she actually lives to the DZ/airport area.
PPS: The lawsuit has lies in it.

[Trafficdiver 8]

My opinion is that she is filing this lawsuit so she does not have to return the money sent to her. She has had some donations sent to her and promised to return all of the money if the lawsuit does not move forward, well filing it is moving forward.

So she files the suit, drops it before she has to put any real money into lawyer fees, and she pockets whatever money is left over.

Then she can afford the hardwood floors she bitched about not having on the CQS FB page.

[FlyingRhenquest 1]

Heh heh, well I was out at the grill on the runway at the airport listening in on a couple of Longmont city councilmen discussing their bid for reelection. I made sure to vote for the guy I recognized when I was doing my research on the candidates. Perhaps I should step up and run in the next cycle of elections. Work that's not programming doesn't ever really feel productive to me, but I suppose I can't ignore the country's political situation and continue to work on my orbital fortress of doom forever. I could dip my toe into politics and make a run for senate eventually. I'm not sure my platform of "IP reform and promising to call every Congressman I meet a goat fucker" would get very far, though.

I'm trying to teach myself how to set things on fire with my mind. Hey... is it hot in here?

[theonlyski 8]

I just read the document... What a crock...

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Damages for past and future pain and suffering, annoyance, disturbance and discomfort, both temporary and permanent, and both physical and mental, caused by the acts of the Defendant:

"I may be a dirty pirate hooker...but I'm not about to go stand on the corner." iluvtofly
DPH -7, TDS 578, Muff 5153, SCR 14890
I'm an asshole, and I approve this message

[normiss 841]

Yeah.
She's suing because she's crazy.
Trying to blame the DZ for her insanity seems transparent to me.

Hopefully a judge will see this rather quickly.

[theonlyski 8]

normiss

Yeah.
She's suing because she's crazy.
Trying to blame the DZ for her insanity seems transparent to me.

Hopefully a judge will see this rather quickly.

Maybe they could counter-sue for the constant headache they've gotten from her.

"I may be a dirty pirate hooker...but I'm not about to go stand on the corner." iluvtofly
DPH -7, TDS 578, Muff 5153, SCR 14890
I'm an asshole, and I approve this message

[normiss 841]

Or just counter for attorney's fees.

Can you take someone's home for a civil suit in CO?


Bunk house....landing area out back of the house.
The neighbors will love it.
All that shit in the driveway will be gone.
Nobody wants Sanford and Son in their neighborhood.

[theonlyski 8]

normiss

Or just counter for attorney's fees.

Can you take someone's home for a civil suit in CO?


Bunk house....landing area out back of the house.
The neighbors will love it.
All that shit in the driveway will be gone.
Nobody wants Sanford and Son in their neighborhood.

I was just thinking it looked like a bunk house already, with a pop-up trailer and all.

5 bedrooms, 3.5 baths. Small lot though, only 1/4 of an acre, but yeah, if you can get landing permission, that'd be sweet in the back yard. Pool and all!

The estimates of the values in the area put that house lower than many of the others.

"I may be a dirty pirate hooker...but I'm not about to go stand on the corner." iluvtofly
DPH -7, TDS 578, Muff 5153, SCR 14890
I'm an asshole, and I approve this message

[Boomerdog 0]

My friend, in a war, the first casualty IS the truth.

In politics, the truth is not an issue IT IS WHAT SELLS and persuades the majority or the influential powers that be to get on your side.

Truth and facts are always preferred, the question is now how you "wrap the package."

This is NOT a time for underestimations.

[Boomerdog 0]

I've had to learn that ya can't stay on the sidelines. Sometimes ya have to show up and get in the game.

I do admire your campaign promises. They are both relevant and the one about the Congressman is well overdue.

[skyjumpenfool 2]

Just read the lawsuit... It's one thing to type up a list of accusations, it's an other thing to prove them. This is just more of the Gibbsmonster's "scare" tactics.

Is there a leagal fund available for direct donation?

Birdshit & Fools Productions

"Son, only two things fall from the sky."

[ctrph8 0]

That is a very good question! I'd throw in if it meant the attorneys would go after her for harassment or whatever else they can come up with.

skyjumpenfool

Is there a leagal fund available for direct donation?

[Boomerdog 0]

I have read the lawsuit. Given the fact that it is the federal government and not the state who regulates navigable airspace, chances are the supremacy clause (federal trumps state) will in all likelihood, prevail. But the lady and her ilk think they have a case.

[tkhayes 348]

Given the FAA interventions already, I would expect this to be summarily dismissed in the first couple of hearings.

[ryoder 1,590]

Relevant to the claims of "trespassing" in the suit:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Air_rights

I got a chuckle out of the article mentioning "spite poles".
I have actually seen these.
Many years ago I was taking flight lessons at 4IN9 (Wawasee Airport in Syracuse IN).
The moron who owned the land due West across the road from the threshold of Rwy 07/25, actually erected a set of tall vertical poles, (like utility poles), in the flight path of any a/c departing 25, or arriving on 07.

Of course the authorities promptly made the fool take them down.

"There are only three things of value: younger women, faster airplanes, and bigger crocodiles" - Arthur Jones.

[chemist 0]

spite poles?! what a bastard!

[BigMikeH77 0]

Yes, because to some folks, having tall and intrusive poles on "your" property is less offensive than aircraft doing their thing.

[Boogers 0]

ryoder

I got a chuckle out of the article mentioning "spite poles".

It reminded me of the Germans placing poles in big open fields in France to prevent Allied gliders from landing in them on D-Day.

[theonlyski 8]

Apparently many people out there don't understand that the FAA trumps local government.

http://www.aopa.org/News-and-Video/All-News/2013/October/31/aopa-calls-lawsuit-to-close-santa-monica-airport-meritless.aspx?WT.mc_sect=tts&WT.mc_id=131101epilot

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Santa Monica Municipal Airport was founded in 1917, when few structures were present, and it has a storied aviation heritage. In the early 1920s, it was the home of Douglas Aircraft Co., which built the first houses near the field for its employees. Since then it has become surrounded by industrial and office buildings, and more homes have been built near both ends of its single, 5,000-foot runway.

Though those homes were built long after the airport was established, homeowners complain about noise and exhaust from aircraft using the airport.

In a statement, City Manager Rod Gould said city officials have met with the FAA and, “proposed possibilities for changes, including operational changes.” Gould stated that, “The FAA representatives were polite and respectful. But, they were simply unwilling or unable to agree to any changes that could bring significant relief to Airport neighbors. They believe that the city is legally obligated to continue operating the Airport as it now operates and to keep operating it forever because of the post-War transfers."

The FAA has offered options to the city to enhance safety of the airport but the city has flatly rejected them.

I for one am GLAD the FAA isn't backing down on these things. More airports for us to use.

But same story, different book... houses built and bought decades after the airport was established and they're bitching about noise and smells associated with the airport.

"I may be a dirty pirate hooker...but I'm not about to go stand on the corner." iluvtofly
DPH -7, TDS 578, Muff 5153, SCR 14890
I'm an asshole, and I approve this message