Tandem Terminal

[Marisan 0]

How fast is Tandem Terminal?
I chased one with no drogue back in the beginning of Tandems and even in a no lift dive they were pulling away from me. So how fast were they actually going.

[jerry81 10]

That will really depend on the weight of the tandem and how it's flown. Most of the ones I've filmed where they were deliberately taken to terminal, I could keep up on my head. About 160mph, tops.
Deliberately taking a tandem to terminal is not a good idea, to be clear.

I'm sure they can go a lot faster, though...

[ryoder 1,590]

It also depends on altitude.
Some years back I did a tandem terminal training jump at a DZ at 5150MSL in CO.
Exit was 12,500AGL.
Protrack reading showed 204mph when I pitched drogue ~9000AGL, and it had not leveled off.
I'd estimate combined body weight at ~420#

"There are only three things of value: younger women, faster airplanes, and bigger crocodiles" - Arthur Jones.

[tkhayes 348]

I went as passenger for a big guy getting his ratings 20 years ago. he was a big guy and so am I. we hit exactly 200mph flat no drogue indicated on the Protrack....

[riggerrob 643]

During Argus testing, Strong strapped a 500 pound dummy to a DHT and tossed it out of an airplane. When the dummies exceeded 200 miles per hour, the Argus brain decided "this is crazy" and turned off. It created a dusty crater in the desert.

After a second dummy created another (expensive) crater, Strong banned them for tandems.

500 pound barrels are standard cargo for military TIs resupplying troops behind enemy lines. The problem started with AAD engineers not knowing how fast tandem terminal was.
Fortunately, they corrected the software and it stays awake/functional faster than 200 mph and they are approved in Strong tandems.

Edited to correct brand of AAD

[jimjumper 25]

If you need some in-depth info, you might want to talk to Jim Wallace. He did drogue-less tandem RW (2 tandems docking) for the movie Bucket List. They probably did 10-15 practice jumps with staggered drouge throws after attempting RW. Craig O'brien did the camera work while head-down and then digitally inverted the film. I seem to recall Morgan Freeman's stunt double was good size, so they were probably going pretty fast!

[MakeItHappen 15]

jimjumper

If you need some in-depth info, you might want to talk to Jim Wallace. He did drogue-less tandem RW (2 tandems docking) for the movie Bucket List. They probably did 10-15 practice jumps with staggered drouge throws after attempting RW. Craig O'brien did the camera work while head-down and then digitally inverted the film. I seem to recall Morgan Freeman's stunt double was good size, so they were probably going pretty fast!

I recall Tom Sanders saying he did some drogueless freefall video with another person on top of his back to give him a really fast fall rate.

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[Anachronist 2]

Just out of curiosity, how long/when was the period of no-drogue tandems? Was it ever "normal" or were they still "experimental" before they figured out the drogue thing?

[IJskonijn 45]

Bill Morrisey gave a two-piece interview to Skydive Radio a few shows back, show #222 and #223. A very interesting listen into tandem jumping history, and from what I gather from that the drogue thing came along relatively early in the tandem development.

[riggerrob 643]

The period of no-drogue tandems was short because high-speed openings are hard on the human body and even harder on main canopies.
Ted Strong started experimenting with tandems in January 1983. Relative Workshop stated a few months later.
Strong's only canopy (main and reserve) was the Mighty Mack Master 425 made of F-111 fabric.
After tearing too many mains, Strong introduced drogues. By 1984 drogues were standard on Strongs. RWS introduced drogue S a year or two later.
All the early, drogue-less Strong containers were updated at the factory.

I have only jumped a drogue-less Vector and only for one day. By 1987 it was considered obsolete.