Toxic positivity...

[Nataly 38]

I feel so bad for this current generation who is growing up with their "image" being so public and on display and so easy to judge and criticise...  We keep driving the message that people should be happy / grateful / positive / woke...  And they should be these things ALL THE TIME.  Ah, but they should also be "authentic" and vulnerable and flawed...

Jesus...  What a mind-fuck!!  We are robbing people of the ENTIRE range of human emotions, which INCLUDES all the "ugly" ones like anger, envy, depression, frustration...  These are not only normal, they are healthy!!!  We can't be perfect all of the time.  People are a hot mess of feelings, and that is a good thing!

OBVIOUSLY we should practice gratitude for the things we have.  OBVIOUSLY we should try not to be too self-absorbed / tone-deaf.  OBVIOUSLY things could always be worse and/or someone *else* has it worse...  No one is so unique that he/she is the first to experience whatever-it-is-he/she-is-going-through.

But yeah.  Nothing and no one is perfect.  Spending all your time "faking" positivity seems to me like it's just as bad (if not worse) as dwelling on *only* the bad stuff...

I know one thing...  Last year I decided I sure as fuck was not going to pretend anymore that everything was always fine.  Everything is NOT fine, and here's the real irony: giving myself the freedom to say so has meant that I have never been happier!!  Some things in my life are super shitty, and that's ok!  I'm working on it.  Some days are bad...  Some are good...  I have profound moments of self-doubt and short bursts of joyfulness...  But I am sooooooo DONE with faking it.

Yesterday was a hard day.  Today was better.  I don't know about tomorrow...  And that's fine.  Not great.  Not amazing.  Not horrible.  Just fine.

[oldwomanc6 60]

Wow,  Nataly, I never once thought you ever faked anything (at least here).  

You have always struck me a person with your heart on your sleeve (a good thing, IMO), but with a genuinely positive outlook.  

You can always come here to vent when needed, as far as I'm concerned.     Sometimes, a place to do that is needed by everyone at times.

[Nataly 38]

5 hours ago, oldwomanc6 said:

Wow,  Nataly, I never once thought you ever faked anything (at least here).  

You have always struck me a person with your heart on your sleeve (a good thing, IMO), but with a genuinely positive outlook.  

You can always come here to vent when needed, as far as I'm concerned.     Sometimes, a place to do that is needed by everyone at times.

Well, I am a straight talker...  I went through a period of oversharing (and learned my lesson).  But like everyone, the temptation is strong to always present a positive image.  I'm sick of that.  I'm not doing it anymore!

You gotta keep some things to yourself jn a professional context.  That's unavoidable.  But I'm not superwoman.  I'm flawed.  I fuck up all the time.  I'm not pretending everything is a life lesson anymore.  Know what I mean??

[wmw999 2,527]

Wait 20 years, and you'll realize that your body, if it's doing everything you want it to and keeps you active, is beautiful exactly as it is. That's at least as big a revelation. I used to want (narrower hips, less weight, more height -- all that stuff). Now I'm thrilled at the body I've been issued. I'm in my mid-60's, still don't think of a day of lifting boxes or a 10-mile hike as something I have to train for, and can do whatever I want pretty much -- it's perfect! Achieve that earlier, and you'll start to keep your body in shape for what it can do for you, rather than what it looks like to others.

Wendy P.

[neilmck 36]

Hitting 50 years old was one of the greatest things that ever happened to me.  Now I truly don't give a damn and I don't worry about the negative stuff anymore.

20 years ago I had an older colleague who, every time I screwed up, would tell me not to worry as no one will care in 20 years time.  Well it took me 20 years to discover he was right.  So enjoy yourself and worry about in 20 years time.

Edited December 7, 2020 by neilmck

[NewGuy2005 53]

23 hours ago, Nataly said:

Some things in my life are super shitty, and that's ok!  I'm working on it.  Some days are bad...  Some are good...  I have profound moments of self-doubt and short bursts of joyfulness...  But I am sooooooo DONE with faking it.

Yesterday was a hard day.  Today was better.  I don't know about tomorrow...  And that's fine.  Not great.  Not amazing.  Not horrible.  Just fine.

Take it from someone that's a 61 yeas old student of human nature.  That's about as good as it gets.  Congratulations!

[Nataly 38]

On 12/8/2020 at 1:58 AM, NewGuy2005 said:

Take it from someone that's a 61 yeas old student of human nature.  That's about as good as it gets.  Congratulations!

Yay??

[NewGuy2005 53]

Yay? Yes.  

Edited December 9, 2020 by NewGuy2005

[riggerrob 643]

Good points Nataly,

Sometimes other people's expectations are absolutely ridiculous!

For example, last year I fell on the Skytrain and cut my forehead. The next thing I hear is worried people asking "Are you okay! Are you okay?"

I sarcastically replied: "No I am not okay. I fell and I am bleeding from my forehead."

[d123 3]

Some people run away into "forced" positivism when their unconscious mind generates "negative" emotions, which are properly justified to be generated by the "source bellow the eternal fountain of emotions".

It's a thing which conditions their behavior, making them unfit to deal with a wide range of experiences, many of them not bad at all when dealt with properly.

It takes a great deal of courage to feel whatever we are feeling and to understand that feeling, thinking, speaking and acting upon are totally different things, with different implications. Wisdom & wits I guess.

Edited December 9, 2020 by d123

[riggerrob 643]

Good point dear d123,

Some people instinctively "retreat" to false optimism.

OTOH some people instinctively over-react. ... fear the worst ...

My ex-wife used to get furious at me if I scared her (e.g. driving on ice). Her fear hormones, adrenaline, dopamines, etc. rose much faster than her logical mind could invent solutions. Ergo scary emotions dominated her mind during potential accidents.

I had not planed to scare her, nor was I happy about sliding sideways down an icy road, but I maintained my cool and avoided a collision. It helped that I grew up in a climate with plenty of snow and ice and had briefly lost control dozens of times on slippery roads. But I had also learned how to quickly regain control on icy roads, so I expected to conclude, upright, in the middle of the road, with no dents, dismemberment or deaths.

Yes, something scary happened, but she was the one who chose to be terrified.

I - on the other hand - was too busy avoiding a collision to get scared. It was only afterwards that I acknowledged that I was scared.

We hope that is the difference between the general public and skydivers. We hope that skydivers are too busy solving problems (fight or flight) to relax into "freezing" in the face of danger.

[Nataly 38]

On 12/10/2020 at 12:30 AM, d123 said:

feeling, thinking, speaking and acting upon are totally different things, with different implications. 

Exactly!!!  Acknowledging that something is shitty isn't a bad thing.  A long as you are doing your best to deal with it.

Pretending everything is great is just ignoring reality...  And anyway, I don't want to be that person who needs outside validation to feel OK.  I want to work towards *actually* being OK - and that ain't always pretty!!  

[Nataly 38]

11 hours ago, riggerrob said:

Yes, something scary happened, but she was the one who chose to be terrified.

I - on the other hand - was too busy avoiding a collision to get scared. It was only afterwards that I acknowledged that I was scared.

We hope that is the difference between the general public and skydivers. We hope that skydivers are too busy solving problems (fight or flight) to relax into "freezing" in the face of danger.

I know exactly what you mean!!  I'm very level-headed and calm under pressure...  I have a friend for whom EVERYTHING is a drama.  I don't know how he can live like that! 

I told him once that I was annoyed that I had dropped my bike.  I was pleased that it was only very minimally scratched.  Half an hour later my doorbell rings and there he is - almost in tears - trying to give me a big hug...  I'm like "dude, what's wrong, what happened?"  (I thought his dad died or something serious.)

And he went on a long rant about how *I* nearly died (by dropping the bike in a parking lot!!!) and he couldn't believe he had almost lost me and why wasn't I more upset???  Honestly it took me a second to realise WTF he was on about...  He was just turning absolutely nothing into a mountain of anxiety...

We're not such good friends anymore...  I don't need that kind of nonsense in my life!

Edited December 11, 2020 by Nataly

[oldwomanc6 60]

On 12/10/2020 at 3:39 PM, riggerrob said:

Good point dear d123,

Some people instinctively "retreat" to false optimism.

OTOH some people instinctively over-react. ... fear the worst ...

My ex-wife used to get furious at me if I scared her (e.g. driving on ice). Her fear hormones, adrenaline, dopamines, etc. rose much faster than her logical mind could invent solutions. Ergo scary emotions dominated her mind during potential accidents.

I had not planed to scare her, nor was I happy about sliding sideways down an icy road, but I maintained my cool and avoided a collision. It helped that I grew up in a climate with plenty of snow and ice and had briefly lost control dozens of times on slippery roads. But I had also learned how to quickly regain control on icy roads, so I expected to conclude, upright, in the middle of the road, with no dents, dismemberment or deaths.

Yes, something scary happened, but she was the one who chose to be terrified.

I - on the other hand - was too busy avoiding a collision to get scared. It was only afterwards that I acknowledged that I was scared.

We hope that is the difference between the general public and skydivers. We hope that skydivers are too busy solving problems (fight or flight) to relax into "freezing" in the face of danger.

I have to disagree with you on this point.

Fear is what it is.  Just because you weren't afraid (while you had some modicum of control), doesn't mean that she chose to be afraid in a situation out of her control.      Even you admit to being afraid  after the fact.   Why would you dis her for being afraid during the incident?

How would you have felt if the shoe was on the other foot?

[neilmck 36]

I find fear to be a useful emotion, it is there to protect by making you avoid dangerous situations.  However when it is too late and you are in danger and you can do something to save yourself it gets out of the way and let's you concentrate on what you need to do.  Hence, big problem in the plane, no problem outside the plane.  This explains why the passenger is always more frightened than the driver of a car.

[wmw999 2,527]

4 hours ago, neilmck said:

However when it is too late and you are in danger and you can do something to save yourself it gets out of the way and let's you concentrate on what you need to do.  Hence, big problem in the plane, no problem outside the plane.

This. 100% this. If I'm the passenger in a car and it's scary out there, I've been known to close my eyes for a few seconds. My fear will do nothing to help the driver, and it scares me.

Wendy P.

[neilmck 36]

4 hours ago, wmw999 said:

I've been known to close my eyes for a few seconds.

I've even been known to swear :)

Edited December 15, 2020 by neilmck

[riggerrob 643]

I sort of half understand your point of view.

Some pilots get nauzeous when riding in the back of some-other-pilot's airplane, but are perfectly calm when at the controls.

When riding as a passenger during scary maneuvers (e.g. spinning out of control on ice), I tend to bite my tongue to avoid distracting the driver. I might vent a few profanities. After the fact, there is little point to venting profanities at the driver because he was doing the best he could during a dangerous maneuver. By remaining outwardly calm, I half the number of toxic psycho-chemicals coursing through my veins.

I try to analyse the situation enough to invent a strategy to avoid repeating the driver's mistakes, but after that try to avoid re-thinking the scary parts too many times. Rethinking the scary moments because that path leads to PTSD and madness. PTSD is a sign of a mind too cluttered with old fears.

Edited December 15, 2020 by riggerrob

[neilmck 36]

I get your point about the importance of controlling your fear when someone else is driving.  At first I used to freak out when my children started to learn to drive, which is the worst thing you can do.  Now I just close my eyes when they are parking.

[Nataly 38]

On 12/15/2020 at 7:46 AM, oldwomanc6 said:

I have to disagree with you on this point.

Fear is what it is.  Just because you weren't afraid (while you had some modicum of control), doesn't mean that she chose to be afraid in a situation out of her control.      Even you admit to being afraid  after the fact.   Why would you dis her for being afraid during the incident?

How would you have felt if the shoe was on the other foot?

Yep - some very good points...  I myself have been surprised by people's fight/flight responses in a crisis...  It truly is difficult to guess who will lose their shit, who will be calm, who will stand out as a leader...  

My work colleague told me of a time where a fire broke out on a ship he was working on...  Without missing a beat, someone took charge, addressed the situation, stopped the fire...  When the actual fire-fighters arrived on the scene, no one could identify who had been the big hero!!!  (Because he/she was wearing a full fire-protection suit and a mask...)  Through a series of interviews, they deduced that it was one of the engineers and oddly this engineer had ZERO recollection of the event.  A complete blank.  Years later he still maintained that he remembered only that there was a signal from the horn that announced there was a fire onboard, and next thing he knew, he was talking to the fire-fighters!!!!  And yet when the shit hit the fan, in complete confidence he masterfully dealt with the situation.

Crazy!

[neilmck 36]

This is one of the reasons I get annoyed by people who keep claiming that parachuting is perfectly safe and even safer than driving a car.  You then get people who in order to have the courage to jump convince themselves that nothing bad can happen to them.  It is only when things go wrong in the sky that they have to suddenly confront their fears (and potentially panicking) instead of having done that when they were on the ground.

[Nataly 38]

Going back to the original topic, I was reflecting today on the past few months and thinking how (badly) I have been coping with my job loss...  It occurred to me that I was going through something like the stages of grief.  Denial, Anger, Bargaining, Depression, Acceptance...  And a bit of back and forth between these...  I've just been too preoccupied to see the pattern!!

And obviously when I googled it, this isn't a novel idea but today I found it very comforting to see that tons and tons and tons has been written on the subject...  It's funny how you don't *really* think about these things until it happens to you.  Must be a coping mechanism - guess if you stopped to think about *every* horrible thing in the world, you'd just want to kill yourself!!!  

[oldwomanc6 60]

4 hours ago, Nataly said:

Going back to the original topic, I was reflecting today on the past few months and thinking how (badly) I have been coping with my job loss...  It occurred to me that I was going through something like the stages of grief.  Denial, Anger, Bargaining, Depression, Acceptance...  And a bit of back and forth between these...  I've just been too preoccupied to see the pattern!!

And obviously when I googled it, this isn't a novel idea but today I found it very comforting to see that tons and tons and tons has been written on the subject...  It's funny how you don't *really* think about these things until it happens to you.  Must be a coping mechanism - guess if you stopped to think about *every* horrible thing in the world, you'd just want to kill yourself!!!  

Yep, it did get a little off topic and started talking about what is or not in your control vs your original idea of putting a false front on what one is actually feeling.  

[Nataly 38]

5 hours ago, oldwomanc6 said:

Yep, it did get a little off topic and started talking about what is or not in your control vs your original idea of putting a false front on what one is actually feeling.  

I think the younger me would have tried to pretend that everything is ok. 

I *am* resilient/fearless/strong but I don't feel that way ALL the time...

[oldwomanc6 60]

15 hours ago, Nataly said:

I think the younger me would have tried to pretend that everything is ok. 

I *am* resilient/fearless/strong but I don't feel that way ALL the time...

No one is, and if they tell you they are, they are FUCKING LYING!

 

eta: or they are not right in the head.

Edited December 19, 2020 by oldwomanc6