Kim Potter found guilty

[gowlerk 2,246]

I must say I am surprised. I expected a different result. To tell the truth I was hoping for a different result. I find this unsettling after following the trial somewhat. But I guess it's not as bad as the truck driver in CO getting 100 or so years for essentially the same thing. Making an error on the job.

[billvon 3,063]

4 minutes ago, gowlerk said:

I must say I am surprised. I expected a different result. To tell the truth I was hoping for a different result. I find this unsettling after following the trial somewhat. But I guess it's not as bad as the truck driver in CO getting 100 or so years for essentially the same thing. Making an error on the job.

Yeah, this is definitely one that could have gone either way.  It's pretty clear that she honestly grabbed the wrong weapon.

But you can also make the argument that shooting someone who is driving a car down the street with either weapon is a pretty big mistake.

[JerryBaumchen 1,425]

4 minutes ago, gowlerk said:

I must say I am surprised. I expected a different result. To tell the truth I was hoping for a different result. I find this unsettling after following the trial somewhat. But I guess it's not as bad as the truck driver in CO getting 100 or so years for essentially the same thing. Making an error on the job.

Hi Ken,

I agree 100%. I'm hoping that she gets a light sentence.

It does now look like the Colorado truck driver might have his sentence altered to something more reasonable.  We can only hope.

Jerry Baumchen

PS)  We have minimum sentencing here in Oregon also; I am completely against it.  There is a reason why a judge is called a judge.

 

[BIGUN 1,397]

12 hours ago, billvon said:

grabbed the wrong weapon

I struggle with this. Cops are taught to wear the Taser on their non-dominant side and the pistol on their dominant side. The Taser is yellow, the pistol is black. 

[airdvr 210]

2 hours ago, BIGUN said:

I struggle with this. Cops are taught to wear the Taser on their non-dominant side and the pistol on their dominant side. The Taser is yellow, the pistol is black. 

There's probably quite a bit of difference in how it feels in your hand.  I would assume a service weapon would weigh more?

[BIGUN 1,397]

1 hour ago, airdvr said:

There's probably quite a bit of difference in how it feels in your hand.  I would assume a service weapon would weigh more?

True. It doesn't weigh the same, feel the same, look the same, not worn on the same side . . .

 

Edited December 24, 2021 by BIGUN
Short Course: She fucked up.

[SkyDekker 1,465]

4 hours ago, BIGUN said:

True. It doesn't weigh the same, feel the same, look the same, not worn on the same side . . .

 

Having held both and fired one of those, yeah there is a massive difference in the two.

As most of us skydivers know, when shit hits the fan it is mostly muscle memory that takes over. You have to wonder how often they did drills where the taser was the first step, or if they teach that in high stress situations the service weapon is the go-to?

[BIGUN 1,397]

46 minutes ago, SkyDekker said:

You have to wonder how often they did drills where the taser was the first step

It would appear she pulled her reserve before cutting away.

Quote

 

To avoid confusion, officers typically carry their stun guns on their weak sides, away from handguns holstered on their dominant hand’s side. That’s how Potter carried hers.

https://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/explainer-confuse-gun-taser-81894695

 

 

[SkyDekker 1,465]

1 minute ago, BIGUN said:

It would appear she pulled her reserve before cutting away.

No doubt. My question is if she ever actually trained to cut away her main prior to pulling her reserve.

In other words, did every high stress scenario she trained always have her pulling her pistol?

(I am not expecting you to have this answer lol, just kind of wondering out loud)

[BIGUN 1,397]

Just now, SkyDekker said:

No doubt. My question is if she ever actually trained to cut away her main prior to pulling her reserve.

In other words, did every high stress scenario she trained always have her pulling her pistol?

(I am not expecting you to have this answer lol, just kind of wondering out loud)

I get it. She had to have been trained and certified before carrying it, so I really don't know where or how things went wrong. But, they did. Horribly. 

[billeisele 130]

Yep, this is a tough one. I'm hoping they will review the current training protocols to try and ID why and how this could have occurred.

It's interesting how she was handled vs. how Alec Baldwin has been handled.

[billvon 3,063]

6 hours ago, billeisele said:

It's interesting how she was handled vs. how Alec Baldwin has been handled.

Not quite the same.

She was a police officer trained to use a weapon, and issued that weapon with the expectation that she would use it (and respect it) as the deadly weapon it was.

He was an actor issued a prop that was presented as an inoperable fake.

[kallend 2,105]

4 hours ago, billvon said:

Not quite the same.

She was a police officer trained to use a weapon, and issued that weapon with the expectation that she would use it (and respect it) as the deadly weapon it was.

He was an actor issued a prop that was presented as an inoperable fake.

"Not quite the same"?  Not remotely the same.  

[JoeWeber 2,810]

13 hours ago, billeisele said:

Yep, this is a tough one. I'm hoping they will review the current training protocols to try and ID why and how this could have occurred.

It's interesting how she was handled vs. how Alec Baldwin has been handled.

Seriously? I nearly choked on my hydrogen peroxide gargle reading that.

[BIGUN 1,397]

7 hours ago, billvon said:

He was an actor issued a prop that was presented as an inoperable fake.

The only change Hollywood needs to make is to not point a weapon directly at people. If the cameras' on your right, you shoot two inches left of the person and if the cameras' on your left  . . . 

Plus look past the shot to make sure nothing is in the path. 

Edited December 25, 2021 by BIGUN

[JoeWeber 2,810]

41 minutes ago, BIGUN said:

The only change Hollywood needs to make is to not point a weapon directly at people. If the cameras' on your right, you shoot two inches left of the person and if the cameras' on your left  . . . 

Plus look past the shot to make sure nothing is in the path. 

How about ditching the stupid union that "qualifies" stupid people in charge of serious shit?

[Coreece 190]

37 minutes ago, BIGUN said:

8 hours ago, billvon said:

He was an actor issued a prop that was presented as an inoperable fake.

The only change Hollywood needs to make is to not point a weapon directly at people. If the cameras' on your right, you shoot two inches left of the person and if the cameras' on your left  . . . 

Plus look past the shot to make sure nothing is in the path. 

There's really no excuse for it.  This has happened before and plenty of safety measure have been put in place to prevent it.  Besides, it's completely unnecessary.  Adding muzzle flash and sound fx in post is an amateur task, an intern could do it.

[JerryBaumchen 1,425]

5 hours ago, BIGUN said:

The only change Hollywood needs to make is to not point a weapon directly at people. If the cameras' on your right, you shoot two inches left of the person and if the cameras' on your left  . . . 

Plus look past the shot to make sure nothing is in the path. 

Hi Keith,

You mean like this:  14-Year-Old Killed by Stray Bullet in Dressing Room in Police Shooting | PEOPLE.com

Jerry Baumchen

[billvon 3,063]

7 hours ago, BIGUN said:

The only change Hollywood needs to make is to not point a weapon directly at people.

I definitely disagree there.

I've been to sound stages during shooting and there are people _everywhere._  There are camera and boom operators, FX people controlling things, safety people ready to catch people during stunts (not even hazardous stunts, think diving over a box.)  There are photographers and directors peering at things from unusual angles.  There are assistants hanging around with scripts and towels.  There's no way to reliably make an accidentally fired weapon miss everyone there.  The only way to ensure that is to ensure that the weapon is safed.

That shouldn't be hard to do, and it's unfortunate that people seem to have to relearn this lesson every ten years or so.

[Coreece 190]

Nice Resumes of those in charge:

"Responsible for overseeing all weapons on set was the production's property key assistant and armorer, Hannah Gutierrez-Reed, daughter of long-time industry armorer Thell Reed.[6] Rust was Gutierrez-Reed's second film serving as lead armorer. On her first film, The Old Way, several crew members complained about her handling of firearms, including an incident in which she discharged a weapon without warning and caused lead actor Nicolas Cage to walk off set.[7]

Dave Halls was the assistant director. In the aftermath of the incident, former colleagues reported that Halls faced complaints in 2019 about his behavior on two episodes of Into the Dark, in which he disregarded safety protocols, and ignored blocked exits and fire lanes.[8][9] In the same year, Halls had been fired from working on the film Freedom's Path after a firearm discharged unexpectedly on set, wounding a crew member.[10][11] On the set of the independent film One Way, a crew member warned producers about Halls's disregard for safety measures and said, "That man is a liability. He's going to fucking kill someone someday, and you're going to be responsible."[12] The Hollywood Reporter reported a number of complaints raised during the production of 2019's The Tiger Rising, which also featured Rust executive producers Ryan Donnell Smith, Allen Cheney, Emily Hunter Salveson, and Ryan Winterstern.[13]"  (note: I didn't check the references yet)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rust_shooting_incident

 

A $35 dollar amateur set of real muzzle flashes could've saved that woman's life.

So easy even the kids are doing it these days:

 

Edited December 26, 2021 by Coreece

[rifleman 70]

Apparently, a Danish company has been working on a product called Violette, a firearms system that uses a small amount of propane mixed with air. This simulates the bang and flash of a firearm. The company approached Hollywood about 5 years ago but companies liked the product but weren't interested in investing in their development.

https://youtu.be/QSKq-_JvYEc

[BIGUN 1,397]

23 hours ago, JoeWeber said:

the stupid union that "qualifies" stupid people in charge of serious shit?

Well, there is that.

[BIGUN 1,397]

18 hours ago, JerryBaumchen said:

You mean like this:

Yeah, Jerry. Just like that. How sad is that.

[BIGUN 1,397]

16 hours ago, billvon said:

and there are people _everywhere._ 

I've only been to two and it was some time ago. Didn't realize it had gotten complicated. I'll defer to you on this one. 

[Coreece 190]

1 hour ago, rifleman said:

Apparently, a Danish company has been working on a product called Violette, a firearms system that uses a small amount of propane mixed with air. This simulates the bang and flash of a firearm. The company approached Hollywood about 5 years ago but companies liked the product but weren't interested in investing in their development.

Right, because there's already a solution.

"As of today, it is now policy on The Rookie that all gunfire on set will be Air Soft guns with CG muzzle flashes added in post," Hawley continued. "There will be no more 'live' weapons on the show. The safety of our cast and crew is too important. Any risk is too much risk."

That decision was made 1 day after the rust shooting.  People can make it as difficult or as easy as they want. 

If you want to spend a load of money on state of the art equipment for the best cg possible, great -  there are even ways to offset the cost.  If you don't, that's fine too - there are plenty of options where the sacrifice in quality is negligible and won't make or break your B movie anyway.  

The people saying quality cg still looks shitty are mostly professionals breaking it down frame by frame and comparing any flaws to their subjective view of both reality and perfection - It's not worth dying for.