tdog 0 #1 March 13, 2006 So, I was watching some survival show on the Discovery Channel.... The plot... The guy parachutes into the middle of nowhere, where he was "dropped off" by a pilot... He has 5 days to get out, with no map, no phones, no anything... Anyway... He landed in a tree... And pulled out a bag of tricks that I had never thought of... He was hanging in his harness too high to jump, and no branches to grab to climb down... So, he deployed his reserve, got out of his harness, and slipped down the reserve lines, then slipped down the canopy, and got 15 feet closer to the ground, from which point he could jump... Now, with a hook knife, I suppose you could cut half your reserve lines and get even closer to the ground... Now, I know the "standard" tree landing is wait for help... But, I thought I would share this "alternate" method... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mdrejhon 8 #2 March 13, 2006 That's really interesting! Tree landing survival, if you're stuck in a remote area. The jump from 15 feet couldn't have been fun, though...! I hope Discovery Channel paid for the rig, which no doubt probably stayed stuck in the tree in the middle of nowhere Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites NWFlyer 2 #3 March 13, 2006 QuoteSo, I was watching some survival show on the Discovery Channel.... The plot... The guy parachutes into the middle of nowhere, where he was "dropped off" by a pilot... He has 5 days to get out, with no map, no phones, no anything... Except the guys with cameras following him around, presumably. Interesting idea, but given that I expect my tree landings will likely be not too far from whatever DZ I was planning to land on, I'd probably stick with the old "wait for help" technique. Good to know there's another option just in case."There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites billvon 3,006 #4 March 13, 2006 >got out of his harness, That's the part that's easier said than done. At least one person has strangled themselves trying to do that. People jumping in such areas might want to consider bringing a rappel kit - 20-40 meters of 5-6mm cord, a sling or two and a few biners. It's fairly light, and comes in useful for rappeling and a host of other things. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Liemberg 0 #5 March 13, 2006 Quotedeployed his reserve, got out of his harness, and slipped down the reserve lines, then slipped down the canopy, and got 15 feet closer to the ground I saw one person do that and severly burn her hands; so when you are going to slide down along a bunch of nylon strings, be sure to wear gloves. I know of another person doing that and ending up INSIDE his round reserve.... I'd stick to "standard" for the time being. Then again, when it's a Ray Mears Bushcraft Survival kind of thing and you have to catch a rabit and roast it over a fire that you'll have to make without matches or lighters, then maybe it's a smart plan... "Whoever in discussion adduces authority uses not intellect but memory." - Leonardo da Vinci A thousand words... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites tdog 0 #6 March 13, 2006 QuoteQuotedeployed his reserve, got out of his harness, and slipped down the reserve lines, then slipped down the canopy, and got 15 feet closer to the ground I saw one person do that and severly burn her hands; so when you are going to slide down along a bunch of nylon strings, be sure to wear gloves. I know of another person doing that and ending up INSIDE his round reserve.... I'd stick to "standard" for the time being. Then again, when it's a Ray Mears Bushcraft Survival kind of thing and you have to catch a rabit and roast it over a fire that you'll have to make without matches or lighters, then maybe it's a smart plan... Hey, this guy already has jumped a 25 foot cliff into a river with unknown depth, and ate a raw live fish, so this guy has done nothing "standard". This guy (Bear Grylls I think is his name) talks to the camera man about a parachuting accident that broke his back, and in freefall he actually flew mantis and free flew a bit, so I guess he is a skydiver in addition someone who likes cooked rattle snake for dinner... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites councilman24 37 #7 March 13, 2006 We used to put 50' of cord on the back of the student chest mount reserves. Not to rappel with but to lower so we could get the rescue rope to them. That was always the hardest part. There are now small self rescue kits sold for firefighters. IIRC New York is using them or soon to. Provides a line, lowering device (not traditional device) and anchor biner or clip. The good old days, when we all knew not to climb down inside the round reserve, when we all knew that chest straps could easily break a neck trying to drop a few feet, when we all knew to put you legs together and cover your arm pits with your hands. But, landing in the grass is always nice.I'm old for my age. Terry Urban D-8631 FAA DPRE Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites OSOK 0 #8 March 13, 2006 any idea the name of this show? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Candy 0 #9 March 13, 2006 Quoteany idea the name of this show? "Survivor Man" I think. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites LouDiamond 1 #10 March 13, 2006 QuoteSo, he deployed his reserve, got out of his harness, and slipped down the reserve lines, then slipped down the canopy, Thats been a standard taught at most military jumps schools using rounds for several decades. It also helps to cross ones ankles and rotate ones forearms up and in front of your face. Branches have a way of finding all the soft spots on a person if you knwo what I mean."It's just skydiving..additional drama is not required" Some people dream about flying, I live my dream SKYMONKEY PUBLISHING Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites magnio 0 #11 March 13, 2006 I landed in a tree on my second jump, a few kilometres from the landing area (no, I didn't steer or look around to see where I was supposed to land...). I got stuck about 20-25ft above ground and never had the slightest idea about getting out of the harness - I was mortified and feared the canopy would rip apart and I would fall down and die. I had brought my mobile phone and after wapping around for the phone number of my jumpmaster I called in and told them I was ok, but stuck in a tree somewhere I had no idea where was. They searched for me for an hour and a half before finding me, then spent half an hour getting me down. This included cutting my main and praying that they were able to hold me and I was able to cling to the tree fast enough to not fall down. Later they told me they had been in serious doubt about doing this, as the possibility of me falling down was probably around 50/50. Quite scary to think about afterwards. For some reason this encouraged me to continue jumping :-) Pictures from the rescue operation: http://www.geekhouse.no/Gallery/dyva20050430 (No, I didn't open the RSL, as it was too far above/behind my head and sight, and I was too scared to touch anything on my equipment.) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Orange1 0 #12 March 13, 2006 Technically, this is not tree landing technique, but tree escape technique...Skydiving: wasting fossil fuels just for fun. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites NWPoul 1 #13 March 13, 2006 Quote... He landed in a tree... And pulled out a bag of tricks that I had never thought of... He was hanging in his harness too high to jump, and no branches to grab to climb down... So, he deployed his reserve, got out of his harness, and slipped down the reserve lines, then slipped down the canopy, and got 15 feet closer to the ground, from which point he could jump... Now, with a hook knife, I suppose you could cut half your reserve lines and get even closer to the ground... Now, I know the "standard" tree landing is wait for help... But, I thought I would share this "alternate" method... H-mm, I thought this is a standard technique and learned at FJC in "landing on obstacles" section =/...Why drink and drive, if you can smoke and fly? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites JohnRich 4 #14 March 13, 2006 QuoteQuotehe deployed his reserve, got out of his harness, and slipped down the reserve lines, then slipped down the canopy, and got 15 feet closer to the ground, from which point he could jump... H-mm, I thought this is a standard technique and learned at FJC in "landing on obstacles" section =/... Yes, I'm surprised that this doesn't seem to be common knowledge any more amongst the newer jumpers. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Chizazz 0 #15 March 14, 2006 QuoteQuoteany idea the name of this show? "Survivor Man" I think. Nah, that Survivor Man is something different. I watched this show too. It was "Ultimate Survival: The Rockies". Hey-o. http://dsc.discovery.com/fansites/upcomingshows/upcomingshows.html Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Scoop 0 #16 March 15, 2006 Slightly off topic: there was a similar program in the UK featuring either Chris Ryan or Andy McNab (one of the ex-SAS turned writers) except in this he was also being hunted down by a militia force and his 5 day journey was also an E&E exercise. He even managed to sort out some badass booby traps and nearly froze to death sleeping out in the open with just his camcorder recording his thoughts. If I remember he was actually recovered next day and given medical treatment and then continued although failing his exercise. Now he is hardcore! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites tdog 0 #17 March 15, 2006 Quote Yes, I'm surprised that this doesn't seem to be common knowledge any more amongst the newer jumpers. My ears have been wide open, learning as much as I can... I don't think anyone has accused me of ignoring what people have been teaching (if you heard the skydivingradio.com interview of Bill Booth, about an hour of the Q&A questions were mine.) I guess some of the "seasoned jumpers" just did not care to share this one. I have audited or participated in FJC with 3 different instructors, and I have been part of 20 or so people's A licence progression. The only way "newer jumpers" get info is to learn it from those who know it or invent it - and in this case, it just never was taught to me by the seasoned jumpers... So, who is to blame? Just kidding, on the blame part! I don't want to start an arguement. Actually - it would be super cool if there was an online repository for skydiving knowledge that people could blog or post to... Not a forum like this where needles are stuck in haystacks, but some sort of organized database approved and organized by moderators.... Like a knowledge-base... Everything from 4way exits, to plan "C" and "D" emergency skills... A reference guide more complete than the SIM... Something that would trancend the geographic bubbles of knowledge that seem to have boarders (one DZ's instructors have different knowledge than another - combine both and you win) Maybe I will make one, if the "oldtimers" would be interested in posting to it so the "newtimers" could learn. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites JohnRich 4 #18 March 15, 2006 QuoteThe only way "newer jumpers" get info is to learn it from those who know it or invent it - and in this case, it just never was taught to me by the seasoned jumpers... So, who is to blame? Your first jump class instructor. If your first jump class was in Kansas, or some other place where there are no trees, then I'll forgive him. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites agent_lead 0 #19 March 15, 2006 survivorman is the shit! man that guy is amazing...-------------------------------------------- www.facebook.com/agentlead Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites ZigZagMarquis 9 #20 March 15, 2006 ... hmmm... reminds me of a "no shit, there I was story" one of the old "grey hairs" at the DZ tells... it goes like this... he was on a night combat jump in Vietnam, wound up hung-up in a tree at night, didn't know exactly how high up he was... did the "deploy the reserve" and shimmy down the reserve lines as described above, but in the dark, wound-up on the inside of the reserve chute... now stuck in side his reserve at the "bottom", he's thinking "this is just great"... he's debating whether to cut himself out, but still isn't sure how high up he is OR wait for the VC to find him... anyway, one of his buddies comes along and cuts him out, seems he was like a foot off the ground at that point... don't know if it was a Bull Shit story or not, but funny. Anyway, TDOG, let us know when you're going for "intentional power line landing" training... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites ZigZagMarquis 9 #21 March 16, 2006 QuoteQuoteQuotehe deployed his reserve, got out of his harness, and slipped down the reserve lines, then slipped down the canopy, and got 15 feet closer to the ground, from which point he could jump... H-mm, I thought this is a standard technique and learned at FJC in "landing on obstacles" section =/... Yes, I'm surprised that this doesn't seem to be common knowledge any more amongst the newer jumpers. JR... its been awhile since I went through or taught a FJC, but what I recall being taught... and teaching... were ... PLAN A... techniques on how to avoid landing on obstacles... PLAN B... what to do if it was absolutely unavoidable... and... PLAN C... if you do get hung-up on an obstacle, STAY - PUT and wait for help to arrive. Its not like we drop student skydivers into the Amazon Jungle or behind the beaches of Normandy at night. My point is... while it may make an iteresting story to know this tid-bit of 411... how to get yourself out of a tree by deploying your reserve and using it to climb down. Chances are no student skydiver is going to have to rescue one-self like that, so, I really don't think teaching them in FJC that if they're hung up in a tree or power line or light pole, that the first thing they should think to do is dump their reserve and try to climb down on their own. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites The111 1 #22 March 17, 2006 Quote>got out of his harness, That's the part that's easier said than done. At least one person has strangled themselves trying to do that. I agree... I did not think that sounded so simple either. Not to mention climbing hand over hand down those tiny lines? I think I'd just slip and burn holes in my palms as I slid down...www.WingsuitPhotos.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites NWPoul 1 #23 March 17, 2006 Any thought how long One can be hanged in the harness before his leg would be serious damaged due to poor blood circulation?Why drink and drive, if you can smoke and fly? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. Paste as plain text instead Only 75 emoji are allowed. × Your link has been automatically embedded. Display as a link instead × Your previous content has been restored. Clear editor × You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL. Insert image from URL × Desktop Tablet Phone Submit Reply 0
NWFlyer 2 #3 March 13, 2006 QuoteSo, I was watching some survival show on the Discovery Channel.... The plot... The guy parachutes into the middle of nowhere, where he was "dropped off" by a pilot... He has 5 days to get out, with no map, no phones, no anything... Except the guys with cameras following him around, presumably. Interesting idea, but given that I expect my tree landings will likely be not too far from whatever DZ I was planning to land on, I'd probably stick with the old "wait for help" technique. Good to know there's another option just in case."There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,006 #4 March 13, 2006 >got out of his harness, That's the part that's easier said than done. At least one person has strangled themselves trying to do that. People jumping in such areas might want to consider bringing a rappel kit - 20-40 meters of 5-6mm cord, a sling or two and a few biners. It's fairly light, and comes in useful for rappeling and a host of other things. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Liemberg 0 #5 March 13, 2006 Quotedeployed his reserve, got out of his harness, and slipped down the reserve lines, then slipped down the canopy, and got 15 feet closer to the ground I saw one person do that and severly burn her hands; so when you are going to slide down along a bunch of nylon strings, be sure to wear gloves. I know of another person doing that and ending up INSIDE his round reserve.... I'd stick to "standard" for the time being. Then again, when it's a Ray Mears Bushcraft Survival kind of thing and you have to catch a rabit and roast it over a fire that you'll have to make without matches or lighters, then maybe it's a smart plan... "Whoever in discussion adduces authority uses not intellect but memory." - Leonardo da Vinci A thousand words... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tdog 0 #6 March 13, 2006 QuoteQuotedeployed his reserve, got out of his harness, and slipped down the reserve lines, then slipped down the canopy, and got 15 feet closer to the ground I saw one person do that and severly burn her hands; so when you are going to slide down along a bunch of nylon strings, be sure to wear gloves. I know of another person doing that and ending up INSIDE his round reserve.... I'd stick to "standard" for the time being. Then again, when it's a Ray Mears Bushcraft Survival kind of thing and you have to catch a rabit and roast it over a fire that you'll have to make without matches or lighters, then maybe it's a smart plan... Hey, this guy already has jumped a 25 foot cliff into a river with unknown depth, and ate a raw live fish, so this guy has done nothing "standard". This guy (Bear Grylls I think is his name) talks to the camera man about a parachuting accident that broke his back, and in freefall he actually flew mantis and free flew a bit, so I guess he is a skydiver in addition someone who likes cooked rattle snake for dinner... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
councilman24 37 #7 March 13, 2006 We used to put 50' of cord on the back of the student chest mount reserves. Not to rappel with but to lower so we could get the rescue rope to them. That was always the hardest part. There are now small self rescue kits sold for firefighters. IIRC New York is using them or soon to. Provides a line, lowering device (not traditional device) and anchor biner or clip. The good old days, when we all knew not to climb down inside the round reserve, when we all knew that chest straps could easily break a neck trying to drop a few feet, when we all knew to put you legs together and cover your arm pits with your hands. But, landing in the grass is always nice.I'm old for my age. Terry Urban D-8631 FAA DPRE Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
OSOK 0 #8 March 13, 2006 any idea the name of this show? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Candy 0 #9 March 13, 2006 Quoteany idea the name of this show? "Survivor Man" I think. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LouDiamond 1 #10 March 13, 2006 QuoteSo, he deployed his reserve, got out of his harness, and slipped down the reserve lines, then slipped down the canopy, Thats been a standard taught at most military jumps schools using rounds for several decades. It also helps to cross ones ankles and rotate ones forearms up and in front of your face. Branches have a way of finding all the soft spots on a person if you knwo what I mean."It's just skydiving..additional drama is not required" Some people dream about flying, I live my dream SKYMONKEY PUBLISHING Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
magnio 0 #11 March 13, 2006 I landed in a tree on my second jump, a few kilometres from the landing area (no, I didn't steer or look around to see where I was supposed to land...). I got stuck about 20-25ft above ground and never had the slightest idea about getting out of the harness - I was mortified and feared the canopy would rip apart and I would fall down and die. I had brought my mobile phone and after wapping around for the phone number of my jumpmaster I called in and told them I was ok, but stuck in a tree somewhere I had no idea where was. They searched for me for an hour and a half before finding me, then spent half an hour getting me down. This included cutting my main and praying that they were able to hold me and I was able to cling to the tree fast enough to not fall down. Later they told me they had been in serious doubt about doing this, as the possibility of me falling down was probably around 50/50. Quite scary to think about afterwards. For some reason this encouraged me to continue jumping :-) Pictures from the rescue operation: http://www.geekhouse.no/Gallery/dyva20050430 (No, I didn't open the RSL, as it was too far above/behind my head and sight, and I was too scared to touch anything on my equipment.) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Orange1 0 #12 March 13, 2006 Technically, this is not tree landing technique, but tree escape technique...Skydiving: wasting fossil fuels just for fun. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NWPoul 1 #13 March 13, 2006 Quote... He landed in a tree... And pulled out a bag of tricks that I had never thought of... He was hanging in his harness too high to jump, and no branches to grab to climb down... So, he deployed his reserve, got out of his harness, and slipped down the reserve lines, then slipped down the canopy, and got 15 feet closer to the ground, from which point he could jump... Now, with a hook knife, I suppose you could cut half your reserve lines and get even closer to the ground... Now, I know the "standard" tree landing is wait for help... But, I thought I would share this "alternate" method... H-mm, I thought this is a standard technique and learned at FJC in "landing on obstacles" section =/...Why drink and drive, if you can smoke and fly? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JohnRich 4 #14 March 13, 2006 QuoteQuotehe deployed his reserve, got out of his harness, and slipped down the reserve lines, then slipped down the canopy, and got 15 feet closer to the ground, from which point he could jump... H-mm, I thought this is a standard technique and learned at FJC in "landing on obstacles" section =/... Yes, I'm surprised that this doesn't seem to be common knowledge any more amongst the newer jumpers. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Chizazz 0 #15 March 14, 2006 QuoteQuoteany idea the name of this show? "Survivor Man" I think. Nah, that Survivor Man is something different. I watched this show too. It was "Ultimate Survival: The Rockies". Hey-o. http://dsc.discovery.com/fansites/upcomingshows/upcomingshows.html Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Scoop 0 #16 March 15, 2006 Slightly off topic: there was a similar program in the UK featuring either Chris Ryan or Andy McNab (one of the ex-SAS turned writers) except in this he was also being hunted down by a militia force and his 5 day journey was also an E&E exercise. He even managed to sort out some badass booby traps and nearly froze to death sleeping out in the open with just his camcorder recording his thoughts. If I remember he was actually recovered next day and given medical treatment and then continued although failing his exercise. Now he is hardcore! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tdog 0 #17 March 15, 2006 Quote Yes, I'm surprised that this doesn't seem to be common knowledge any more amongst the newer jumpers. My ears have been wide open, learning as much as I can... I don't think anyone has accused me of ignoring what people have been teaching (if you heard the skydivingradio.com interview of Bill Booth, about an hour of the Q&A questions were mine.) I guess some of the "seasoned jumpers" just did not care to share this one. I have audited or participated in FJC with 3 different instructors, and I have been part of 20 or so people's A licence progression. The only way "newer jumpers" get info is to learn it from those who know it or invent it - and in this case, it just never was taught to me by the seasoned jumpers... So, who is to blame? Just kidding, on the blame part! I don't want to start an arguement. Actually - it would be super cool if there was an online repository for skydiving knowledge that people could blog or post to... Not a forum like this where needles are stuck in haystacks, but some sort of organized database approved and organized by moderators.... Like a knowledge-base... Everything from 4way exits, to plan "C" and "D" emergency skills... A reference guide more complete than the SIM... Something that would trancend the geographic bubbles of knowledge that seem to have boarders (one DZ's instructors have different knowledge than another - combine both and you win) Maybe I will make one, if the "oldtimers" would be interested in posting to it so the "newtimers" could learn. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JohnRich 4 #18 March 15, 2006 QuoteThe only way "newer jumpers" get info is to learn it from those who know it or invent it - and in this case, it just never was taught to me by the seasoned jumpers... So, who is to blame? Your first jump class instructor. If your first jump class was in Kansas, or some other place where there are no trees, then I'll forgive him. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
agent_lead 0 #19 March 15, 2006 survivorman is the shit! man that guy is amazing...-------------------------------------------- www.facebook.com/agentlead Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ZigZagMarquis 9 #20 March 15, 2006 ... hmmm... reminds me of a "no shit, there I was story" one of the old "grey hairs" at the DZ tells... it goes like this... he was on a night combat jump in Vietnam, wound up hung-up in a tree at night, didn't know exactly how high up he was... did the "deploy the reserve" and shimmy down the reserve lines as described above, but in the dark, wound-up on the inside of the reserve chute... now stuck in side his reserve at the "bottom", he's thinking "this is just great"... he's debating whether to cut himself out, but still isn't sure how high up he is OR wait for the VC to find him... anyway, one of his buddies comes along and cuts him out, seems he was like a foot off the ground at that point... don't know if it was a Bull Shit story or not, but funny. Anyway, TDOG, let us know when you're going for "intentional power line landing" training... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ZigZagMarquis 9 #21 March 16, 2006 QuoteQuoteQuotehe deployed his reserve, got out of his harness, and slipped down the reserve lines, then slipped down the canopy, and got 15 feet closer to the ground, from which point he could jump... H-mm, I thought this is a standard technique and learned at FJC in "landing on obstacles" section =/... Yes, I'm surprised that this doesn't seem to be common knowledge any more amongst the newer jumpers. JR... its been awhile since I went through or taught a FJC, but what I recall being taught... and teaching... were ... PLAN A... techniques on how to avoid landing on obstacles... PLAN B... what to do if it was absolutely unavoidable... and... PLAN C... if you do get hung-up on an obstacle, STAY - PUT and wait for help to arrive. Its not like we drop student skydivers into the Amazon Jungle or behind the beaches of Normandy at night. My point is... while it may make an iteresting story to know this tid-bit of 411... how to get yourself out of a tree by deploying your reserve and using it to climb down. Chances are no student skydiver is going to have to rescue one-self like that, so, I really don't think teaching them in FJC that if they're hung up in a tree or power line or light pole, that the first thing they should think to do is dump their reserve and try to climb down on their own. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The111 1 #22 March 17, 2006 Quote>got out of his harness, That's the part that's easier said than done. At least one person has strangled themselves trying to do that. I agree... I did not think that sounded so simple either. Not to mention climbing hand over hand down those tiny lines? I think I'd just slip and burn holes in my palms as I slid down...www.WingsuitPhotos.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NWPoul 1 #23 March 17, 2006 Any thought how long One can be hanged in the harness before his leg would be serious damaged due to poor blood circulation?Why drink and drive, if you can smoke and fly? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
