Christians don’t believe in Democracy

[jaybird18c 24]

3 minutes ago, JerryBaumchen said:

Hi 18,

Then why has everything that you have posted here been an attempt to convince us?

Jerry Baumchen

 

I'm just presenting gospel truth. Take it or leave it.

[JoeWeber 2,722]

17 minutes ago, jaybird18c said:

I am just convinced of a truth

No matter how deeply felt the conviction if it cannot be proven it is not a truth, it is simply a belief. 

[jakee 1,498]

1 hour ago, jaybird18c said:

No. I meant what I said.

And what you said meant no.

[jakee 1,498]

24 minutes ago, jaybird18c said:

That's because I once also did not believe, nor did I want anything to do with this. It interfered with my lifestyle. 

This is again where you have no basis of reference for a conversation. It's like when Coreece used to say he was an atheist when he was angry at god. Well if he was angry at god he was never an atheist, they're two completely different things. And if you wanted to ignore your belief in god because you'd have to change the way you lived that's very different to genuinely not thinking there is a god.

Further to that - you might have been a bad person doing bad things before you found god, but I don't think I am. I don't think I'd have to change anything in my life if I suddenly thought god was real. It's just that he's so obviously not.

29 minutes ago, jaybird18c said:

No amount of evidence will every be good enough for you. 

Now that's condescension. But ok, what evidence? You've never provided any whatsoever.

Quote

Nothing apart from a supernatural act of God can ever change your mind in this regard. 

Well yeah, that would be some evidence. There certainly isn't anything else lying around. BTW, don't you think it's odd that according to your book the people who actually knew Jesus needed supernatural acts of god to prove that Jesus was supernatural? 

[jakee 1,498]

17 minutes ago, jaybird18c said:

I'm just presenting gospel truth. 

But you're not, you're presenting your truth.

[RonD1120 62]

Have you ever experienced the supernatural? If no, then the supernatural has no meaning. If yes, then you have some understanding and accpeptance.

Oswald Chambers stated, "If Christianity is not supernatural then it is a sham." 

For me and those like me, it is not a sham. 

[jaybird18c 24]

41 minutes ago, JoeWeber said:

No matter how deeply felt the conviction if it cannot be proven it is not a truth, it is simply a belief. 

A relationship isn't proven by scientific methodology. It's proven by developing trust in a  person. You look for evidence of trustworthiness. The fact that you can't prove one's existence or actions in the same way you might prove the effectiveness of an antibiotic on a bacterium isn't good reason for unbelief. 

[jaybird18c 24]

34 minutes ago, jakee said:

But you're not, you're presenting your truth.

Well...I'm not the founder of christianity. It's not "my" truth. I just happen to agree with it. 

[jakee 1,498]

16 minutes ago, RonD1120 said:

Have you ever experienced the supernatural? If no, then the supernatural has no meaning. If yes, then you have some understanding and accpeptance.

Jay: Nothing but the supernatural would be good enough for you!

Ron: Only the supernatural is good enough!

I mean... you're kinda saying the same thing, but why do I get the feeling you're disagreeing on what it means?

[jakee 1,498]

4 minutes ago, jaybird18c said:

A relationship isn't proven by scientific methodology. It's proven by developing trust in a  person. You look for evidence of trustworthiness. 

Err, you don;t need evidence you need trust, but you find trust through evidence?

5 minutes ago, jaybird18c said:

The fact that you can't prove one's existence or actions 

We can most certainly prove that you or I exist and do things - because we exist and do things.

6 minutes ago, jaybird18c said:

isn't good reason for unbelief. 

What woud be?

[jakee 1,498]

4 minutes ago, jaybird18c said:

Well...I'm not the founder of christianity. It's not "my" truth. I just happen to agree with it. 

When millions upon millions upon millions of people disagree with you about what the founder of christianity's truth was, it's only safe to say that we're talking about your truth now.

[jaybird18c 24]

3 minutes ago, jakee said:

Jay: Nothing but the supernatural would be good enough for you!

Ron: Only the supernatural is good enough!

I mean... you're kinda saying the same thing, but why do I get the feeling you're disagreeing on what it means?

I don't think we disagree on what matters.

[jaybird18c 24]

Just now, jakee said:

When millions upon millions upon millions of people disagree with you about what the founder of christianity's truth was, it's only safe to say that we're talking about your truth now.

Yeah buddy... I stand alone. (sarcasm) Ha!

[jakee 1,498]

Just now, jaybird18c said:

I don't think we disagree on what matters.

Whether people should believe in god unless god literally talks to them?

[jaybird18c 24]

3 minutes ago, jakee said:

Err, you don;t need evidence you need trust, but you find trust through evidence?

We can most certainly prove that you or I exist and do things - because we exist and do things.

What woud be?

Reason for unbelief? Well...strong evidence for unbelief would be if any of the eye-witnesses/martyrs had recorded evidence of untrustworthiness. 

[wmw999 2,452]

And, again, what does it mean about God’s stated love if no supernatural manifestation ever happens? That’s why I reject the personal salvation piece of Christianity. It’s too specific, and leaves out entire classes of people. Not to mention that people in one “saved”‘church can definitely reject people in another as not being saved in exactly the right way.

Nite that I’m not arguing for the non-existence of God; any supreme being whom I can comprehend or wrap my head around probably isn’t very supernatural

Wendy P. 

[jakee 1,498]

1 minute ago, jaybird18c said:

Reason for unbelief? Well...strong evidence for unbelief would be if any of the eye-witnesses/martyrs had recorded evidence of untrustworthiness. 

Like Judas?

Edited August 28, 2023 by jakee

[jaybird18c 24]

9 minutes ago, jakee said:

Like Judas?

Did Judas discount the trustworthiness of the other eye-witnesses? Besides, I think he committed suicide for his mistake. And he wasn't around for the crucifixion and resurrection. Judas was looking to Jesus as the prophesied Messiah who would come as a conquerer and lead the liberation of the Jews out from under Roman occupation and persecution.

Edited August 28, 2023 by jaybird18c

[jakee 1,498]

5 minutes ago, jaybird18c said:

Did Judas discount the trustworthiness of the other eye-witnesses? 

He discounts that it was obvious that Jesus was supernatural, so yeah.

Edited August 28, 2023 by jakee

[gowlerk 2,200]

1 hour ago, jaybird18c said:

gospel truth

Oxymoron. Like military intelligence.

[gowlerk 2,200]

38 minutes ago, jaybird18c said:

It's proven by developing trust in a  person.

Trust is an emotion or a feeling. It is real but it is not and can never be a proof. Which is the source of your (and Ron's) confusion. You have developed your feelings to the point where you believe they are facts. So to you they are, but that is meaningless to the rest of us. I claim no answers and I know I will never have any. A fact that I can live with but some people can not.

[JoeWeber 2,722]

56 minutes ago, jaybird18c said:

Reason for unbelief? Well...strong evidence for unbelief would be if any of the eye-witnesses/martyrs had recorded evidence of untrustworthiness. 

If your kid won’t go to bed because of monsters in the closet and you check but there aren’t any monsters in the closet. And this goes on night after night and the kid won’t go to bed but keeps telling you they are there but you can’t see them, would you just accept that if the kid believes they’re there it must be true?

[jaybird18c 24]

45 minutes ago, jakee said:

He discounts that it was obvious that Jesus was supernatural, so yeah.

No it doesn't. Peter lied when he was asked if he knew Jesus to save his own skin. Then what happened. He and the other disciples were witness to the crucifixion and resurrection. Jesus even said that Peter would be responsible for founding his church. Then most of them were martyred because they would not deny what they knew to be true. That demonstrates trustworthiness! 

[jaybird18c 24]

40 minutes ago, gowlerk said:

Oxymoron. Like military intelligence.

Ha! Ha! Good one. You so clever! How long did it take you to come up with that one?

[gowlerk 2,200]

1 hour ago, jaybird18c said:

strong evidence for unbelief

WTF does this even mean? Think about it.