EVs, Aspirations vs Reality

[kallend 2,027]

59 minutes ago, wolfriverjoe said:

My house was built in the 1950s, but the electrical service (along with plumbing) was updated nicely before I bought it.

Not perfect, but the setup is adequate for my needs, even with the new EV.

My house was built in 1932 and the electrical system has been upgraded (at least) once since then, but we are getting a further upgrade later this month.  Costly.

[normiss 800]

24 minutes ago, kallend said:

My house was built in 1932 and the electrical system has been upgraded (at least) once since then, but we are getting a further upgrade later this month.  Costly.

I pulled an owner permit and did mine myself. Saved a LOT of money.

[kallend 2,027]

5 hours ago, normiss said:

I pulled an owner permit and did mine myself. Saved a LOT of money.

We need higher capacity wires run from the pole transformer and a new breaker box Connected to the meter in heavy duty conduit.  No way I can do that myself.

[tkhayes 348]

2 hours ago, kallend said:

We need higher capacity wires run from the pole transformer and a new breaker box Connected to the meter in heavy duty conduit.  No way I can do that myself.

nope and depending on your market a new service can cost a lot.  I had one done on a flip house 4 years ago, only cost $2500 or so, everything.  The other day I was quoted $7000, but I am pretty sure that guy was a fuckwit and ripping me off.  still shopping.

[tkhayes 348]

12 hours ago, brenthutch said:

If you were paying attention, you would know that much of the “refueling savings” is gobbled up by the increase in depreciation.  $10,000 dollars buys a lot of gas. I don’t know why you have to resort to name calling, I’m just sharing the realities of the market place.

BTW that big bad government driving up costs prices folks on the margin out of the market. 

if YOU were paying attention, depreciation is an order of magnitude from your original post in this forum.... as are electrical installations.  It would appear that you are and continue to grasp and whatever 'squirrel!' jumps in front of you today and running with it.

For starters, your claims of installation costs of electric are wildly exaggerated, and now you are hanging onto depreciation as the cause of all the EV woes.  You claims of EV market slowing down are completely out of context and simply cherry picking to make a point that you cannot seem to define, despite my pointing that out.  Take an argument and stick with it.

Oh wait, you did earlier and were debunked in most of your claims.  installation costs also debunked.

what's next?  Poor children in Africa and the societal cost of that as part of the EV equation?

SQUIRREL!

[brenthutch 444]

1 hour ago, tkhayes said:

if YOU were paying attention, depreciation is an order of magnitude from your original post in this forum.... as are electrical installations.  It would appear that you are and continue to grasp and whatever 'squirrel!' jumps in front of you today and running with it.

For starters, your claims of installation costs of electric are wildly exaggerated, and now you are hanging onto depreciation as the cause of all the EV woes.  You claims of EV market slowing down are completely out of context and simply cherry picking to make a point that you cannot seem to define, despite my pointing that out.  Take an argument and stick with it.

Oh wait, you did earlier and were debunked in most of your claims.  installation costs also debunked.

what's next?  Poor children in Africa and the societal cost of that as part of the EV equation?

SQUIRREL!

The $10,000 was from the difference in depreciation from a normal car and the greater cost of an EV.  I made no mention of installation costs. I was actually being quite conservative. I just went on CARFAX and saw a 2nd generation 2022 Nissan leaf with 8000 miles for $14,000. Sticker on a 2024 is $28,000. That is for an entry level car, the difference because greater as you move up the food chain 

Edited January 2, 2024 by brenthutch

[gowlerk 2,192]

3 hours ago, kallend said:

We need higher capacity wires run from the pole transformer and a new breaker box Connected to the meter in heavy duty conduit.  No way I can do that myself.

How old is your house?

[wolfriverjoe 1,523]

46 minutes ago, gowlerk said:

How old is your house?

Post #201. Built in 1932. 

[olofscience 480]

Anyway, in other news, EVs now make up more than 80% of new car sales in Norway.

[JoeWeber 2,720]

58 minutes ago, wolfriverjoe said:

Post #201. Built in 1932. 

Yes, and he built it himself.

Edited January 2, 2024 by JoeWeber

[tkhayes 348]

2 hours ago, brenthutch said:

The $10,000 was from the difference in depreciation from a normal car and the greater cost of an EV.  I made no mention of installation costs. I was actually being quite conservative. I just went on CARFAX and saw a 2nd generation 2022 Nissan leaf with 8000 miles for $14,000. Sticker on a 2024 is $28,000. That is for an entry level car, the difference because greater as you move up the food chain 

again, and with emphasis...... so what?  you are still an order of magnitude from the topic of your original post, have yet to acknowledge that most of your claims were insignificant and demonstrated no point.  you have yet to state what you point is, and you jump from squirrel to squirrel is search of a problem with EVs.

Edited January 2, 2024 by tkhayes

[gowlerk 2,192]

4 minutes ago, tkhayes said:

and you jump from squirrel to squirrel is search of a problem with EVs.

I found a new problem. Snow tires are 3K CAD with rims for a model #. Plus taxes.

[JoeWeber 2,720]

2 minutes ago, tkhayes said:

you are still an order of magnitude from the topic of your original post,

Oh, I don't know. With any significant purchase I factor in what I can get on a cold rainy day at an auction and depreciation is a large component of that reality. You're certainly right that he'll not quit his search for a fatal defect in the idea of progress until he hits a winner. Maybe EV drivers are getting laid less often or lower property values in the neighborhoods they buy houses, maybe their Moms love them less or something. Got me, but if there is a scintilla of evidence we'll be first to read it here.

[olofscience 480]

2 hours ago, brenthutch said:

I just went on CARFAX and saw a 2nd generation 2022 Nissan leaf with 8000 miles for $14,000. Sticker on a 2024 is $28,000. That is for an entry level car, the difference because greater as you move up the food chain 

No, Nissan Leafs have high depreciation because its lack of a battery thermal management system (air-cooled) means that the battery degrades quickly.

Pretty much every other EV has liquid cooling for the battery.

[lippy 918]

8 minutes ago, JoeWeber said:

if there is a scintilla of evidence we'll be first to read it here.

***evidence may be in the form of an opinion piece from a climate denier website.

[billvon 2,991]

6 hours ago, kallend said:

We need higher capacity wires run from the pole transformer and a new breaker box Connected to the meter in heavy duty conduit.  No way I can do that myself.

Eh, lots of ways around that.

[SkyDekker 1,465]

On 12/31/2023 at 10:49 AM, brenthutch said:

Assuming a Tesla 3 and available superchargers at every stop you would have spent at least two hours charging, as BillV put so eloquently, “my time is more valuable than that”

1400 miles. Most people in ICE cars spend at least that amount of time stretching legs, eating etc on a 1,400 mile road trip.

[wmw999 2,447]

20 minutes ago, billvon said:

Eh, lots of ways around that.

Ya know, sometimes I'm fine with saying "I'd rather pay someone else to do that."

Wendy P.

[billvon 2,991]

2 minutes ago, wmw999 said:

Ya know, sometimes I'm fine with saying "I'd rather pay someone else to do that."

Yes, people have told me that my insistence on doing almost everything myself is somewhat unreasonable.

[wmw999 2,447]

43 minutes ago, billvon said:

Yes, people have told me that my insistence on doing almost everything myself is somewhat unreasonable.

Any more, there has to be some element of challenge or fun in it. Changing my own oil holds zero interest, but I did just make windows for my garage and install them.

Wendy P.

[brenthutch 444]

54 minutes ago, SkyDekker said:

1400 miles. Most people in ICE cars spend at least that amount of time stretching legs, eating etc on a 1,400 mile road trip.

With a level 2 charger that goes from two to 12++ hours assuming there is no line.

Edited January 2, 2024 by brenthutch

[brenthutch 444]

2 hours ago, olofscience said:

No, Nissan Leafs have high depreciation because its lack of a battery thermal management system (air-cooled) means that the battery degrades quickly.

Pretty much every other EV has liquid cooling for the battery.

Then explain this 

Ranking of EVs by 5-Year Depreciation – iSeeCars Study
Rank	Model	Average 5-Year Depreciation
1	Tesla Model 3	42.9%
EV Average		49.1%
2	Tesla Model X	49.9%
3	Nissan LEAF	50.8%
4	Chevrolet Bolt EV	51.1%
5	Tesla Model S	55.5%

[olofscience 480]

2 minutes ago, brenthutch said:

Then explain this 

Be more specific. In any case, you've already made up your mind so this is more dishonest arguing from you.

[JoeWeber 2,720]

59 minutes ago, billvon said:

Yes, people have told me that my insistence on doing almost everything myself is somewhat unreasonable.

Worse, it makes the rest of us look bad. 

[kallend 2,027]

1 hour ago, billvon said:

Eh, lots of ways around that.

Cook County building codes. . . . .