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Di0***
Nonsense.
To the OP - sounds like you're on the right track to me.
Definitely stick with 280 or larger for both the main and reserve. At your size you need to factor in at least 30lbs for the weight of your gear, putting you a touch over 1:1.
another canopy option might be the Icarus Eqinox.
That was my experience, it doesn't have to make sense.
Anyway, beside that, the point was: as long as you stay between 0.8 and 1, you should be fine. Of course you don't want to go above 1 for obvious reasons, but I was also saying that going too low might also have some adverse effects, for what I experienced. It has to be "right".
You don’t have any experience. And until you get some you should STFU..
Sparky
My idea of a fair fight is clubbing baby seals
justme12001It's actually 1.05, but that said you should be fine at that wingloading.
Us bigger guys tend to be a little better at being at a slightly higher wingloading than the little skinny folks that break easy :) that is assuming you are an in shape 265 and not a tubby 265.......just my $.02
My only question is, is your rig TSO'd for your weight?
I don't know what TSO'd means but I went to Mirage in Deland FL, and had them personally measure & weigh me and build this rig custom for me. They are amazing people so I have to assume its (TSO) for me.... So since it was all custom I had them make the colors to match my jumpsuit/helmet I use in the tunnel. (Which has nothing to do with canopies or landing but damn if I'm spending $3,000 on a backpack I want it to look good haha)
Di0 2
likestojump
I have a dozen jumps on NAV300's and 280's all loaded well below .8 and I second the notion that you are not making sense.
I am betting you are relating your student/low time lack of experience to the canopies performance. In other words your are saying that your guitar is shitty, as opposed to admitting that you are a crappy musician.
Absolutely. That is true.
But, you also have to admit, since the OP has comparable experience (or lack thereof) the choice should be what is EASIER AND SAFER to fly. I know that an experienced jumper and good canopy pilot like I will hopefully be in a few years, will handle a wide range of high and low wingloads, but you also have to admit that a person with my jumpnumbers (and the OP jumpnumbers) is likely, well, not so good so it makes sense to point at that WL that is best compromise of all characteristics. We are not trying to prove that point that you can fly a canopy loaded at 0.5 and, if you're good, you won't have problem, we are trying to find those canopies and settings that will give the OP the least amount of problems to start with. Maybe I was misinterpreted, but as you say: if you have to be a good pilot to get the best out of a certain setup (either because too loaded or not loaded enough) then maybe you want to look into something better for you and less dependent on how good you are, because when you start... you're not good as you think you are.
The OP says his wing load will be a hair above 1:1, that is about right so I think it's what's recommended for beginners on the PD loading chart. I was just relaying my experience and since you can see my jump number and I never lied about it, you can get an idea of why I'm saying certain things. I wasn't going around saying that "oh my good, you jump a big canopy, you're gonna die!", if it looked like that, well, it was poor communication from my side.
mjosparky
You don’t have any experience. And until you get some you should STFU..
Sparky
Sorry, I must have missed the part where only people with over 1000 jumps are allowed to express their opinions.
I'm standing on the edge
With a vision in my head
My body screams release me
My dreams they must be fed... You're in flight.
With a vision in my head
My body screams release me
My dreams they must be fed... You're in flight.
As far as buying new gear, to each their own dude. People will give you a TON of shit for any decision that you make as far as what you buy. Sounds like you are making appropriate choices for canopies/windloading, other than that don't let anyone tell you whether it was "right" or "wrong" to buy new or used.
I was given the opportunity right off student status to buy new and for my circumstances, mentality, ect. it made sense for me. I took a ton of shit and was told I wouldn't last one full year before I sold it and downsized out of it. Guess what? 3 years and 300 jumps later, I'm still jumping it and I still have room to downsize another sized main if I want. Not planning on downsizing for at least another year, so I am easily going to get 5-7 years worth of jumping out of my first brand new rig everyone told me not to buy. It is great to get opinions, and I know that my case isn't the typical, but sometimes you do know what is best for you and don't let others make you second guess that. I'm not saying that every noob needs to run out and buy new gear, but never feel like you have to defend that decision to others! It is your money, spend it how you see fit.
I was given the opportunity right off student status to buy new and for my circumstances, mentality, ect. it made sense for me. I took a ton of shit and was told I wouldn't last one full year before I sold it and downsized out of it. Guess what? 3 years and 300 jumps later, I'm still jumping it and I still have room to downsize another sized main if I want. Not planning on downsizing for at least another year, so I am easily going to get 5-7 years worth of jumping out of my first brand new rig everyone told me not to buy. It is great to get opinions, and I know that my case isn't the typical, but sometimes you do know what is best for you and don't let others make you second guess that. I'm not saying that every noob needs to run out and buy new gear, but never feel like you have to defend that decision to others! It is your money, spend it how you see fit.
JerryBaumchen 1,426
Hi 12001,
Mirage's are certificated under TSO C23b Low Speed Category.
They are limited to an aircraft of no more than 150 MPH.
The TSO says nothing about the airspeed of the jumper.
So that would make it whatever 'limitations' that Mirage Systems might want to try establish.
JerryBaumchen
Quoteis your rig TSO'd for your weight?
Mirage's are certificated under TSO C23b Low Speed Category.
They are limited to an aircraft of no more than 150 MPH.
The TSO says nothing about the airspeed of the jumper.
So that would make it whatever 'limitations' that Mirage Systems might want to try establish.
JerryBaumchen
lyosha 50
Grain of salt warning: I'm a recent A License recipient and this post reflects my at this point limited experiences. While you do have 50 pounds on me, I do have 50 pounds on your garden variety skydiving student.
Try it before you buy it. Your local DZ likely has multiple sizes of Navigators. The first dozen jumps I made were on a NAV 280, and it felt like I was driving a school bus. I was technically safe, but turns were a pain and flaring didn't do much of anything. Then I started working my way through my DZ's stock of student gear. 260's felt a little better. But it wasn't until I jumped a 240 and then a 220 that I felt like I was flying a parachute. When I pulled toggles, it felt responsive. And landings actually felt like landings and started being run/slide-out and stand-up landings because suddenly flare became more effective. The lack of control in the larger Navigators actually made working with it more difficult and landings worse, albeit safer for the first X jumps (needless to say on my first AFF jump I didn't exactly bury the toggles on the flare and got some nice PLF practice out of it... lesson learned...).
Now, I'm not saying grab the Nav-200 from the shelf yell "Jeronimo" and jump out of the plane. But I am saying is if you're gonna commit $7000+ to a brand new rig that will likely lose $2000 in value the moment you touch it, wouldn't you want to know if it was the right rig to buy?
Also, once you get your A license, go to your local rigger and rent a Sabre2 or Spectre at some obscenely large size. Try and fly it for a day. See if you like it better. It'll have more control than a Nav. And who knows, maybe it'll change your mind about what kind of rig you want to buy. Or even better demo the Nav and sabre/spectre from PD. You'll have a side-by-side comparison.
Try it before you buy it. Your local DZ likely has multiple sizes of Navigators. The first dozen jumps I made were on a NAV 280, and it felt like I was driving a school bus. I was technically safe, but turns were a pain and flaring didn't do much of anything. Then I started working my way through my DZ's stock of student gear. 260's felt a little better. But it wasn't until I jumped a 240 and then a 220 that I felt like I was flying a parachute. When I pulled toggles, it felt responsive. And landings actually felt like landings and started being run/slide-out and stand-up landings because suddenly flare became more effective. The lack of control in the larger Navigators actually made working with it more difficult and landings worse, albeit safer for the first X jumps (needless to say on my first AFF jump I didn't exactly bury the toggles on the flare and got some nice PLF practice out of it... lesson learned...).
Now, I'm not saying grab the Nav-200 from the shelf yell "Jeronimo" and jump out of the plane. But I am saying is if you're gonna commit $7000+ to a brand new rig that will likely lose $2000 in value the moment you touch it, wouldn't you want to know if it was the right rig to buy?
Also, once you get your A license, go to your local rigger and rent a Sabre2 or Spectre at some obscenely large size. Try and fly it for a day. See if you like it better. It'll have more control than a Nav. And who knows, maybe it'll change your mind about what kind of rig you want to buy. Or even better demo the Nav and sabre/spectre from PD. You'll have a side-by-side comparison.
lyoshaGrain of salt warning:
Also, once you get your A license, go to your local rigger and rent a Sabre2 or Spectre at some obscenely large size. Try and fly it for a day. See if you like it better. It'll have more control than a Nav. And who knows, maybe it'll change your mind about what kind of rig you want to buy. Or even better demo the Nav and sabre/spectre from PD. You'll have a side-by-side comparison.
I was thinking I would order the PD 281 reserve and the cypres now and have them installed (figured big reserve for a big guy incase the shit hits the fan) and then maybe Demo a couple different canopies that will fit in my container to see what I like best. The NAV 300 is great! "But you don't know, what you don't know" I think it feels great but who knows It might be like flying a bus and I wouldn't know because it's all I have flown. With that being said what suggestions would you have for a 290 exit weight with 25 jumps?? (won't buy the main until I'm licensed)
Also to answer the question of why I bought my own rig is simple, I travel all over the country for my job and the world for fun, If there is an awesome location I happen to be traveling thru and want to jump and they don't have gear to fit me?? Well then that would suck and since I'm way above average weight for a skydiver I figure buying my own would be best.
justinbaker27I ordered my Mirage G4 container (M8 model) about 5 weeks ago and it was shipped to me yesterday. Now I need advice on how to fill it
What's done is done but this is really the bassackward way to go about it.
"What if there were no hypothetical questions?"
Southern_Man***I ordered my Mirage G4 container (M8 model) about 5 weeks ago and it was shipped to me yesterday. Now I need advice on how to fill it
What's done is done but this is really the bassackward way to go about it.
Well it might be backwards and I appreciate everyone's advise however I did take a couple thing into consideration before purchasing a custom made container for myself.
1. The container will fit a 260-300 sq ft canopy. If I'm almost at a 1:1 now jumping a 300 I "could" go down to a 260 with this container which I don't "think" I should do after only 25 jumps with an exit weight if 290 pounds.... But I don't know?
2. "If" the worst case scenario is I'm loaded 1:1 but flying safe however I can't have as much fun under canopy I'm totally ok with that. I want to work on my fundamentals of freefall & landing for awhile before I start taking canopy courses to do crazy stuff.
3. Because I'm a big guy and student rigs/rental rigs in my size aren't exactly comfortable... the $8,000 plus this will cost me is worth the comfort alone even if it only last me 6months to a Year.
But I can see your logic of thinking it's backwards.
lyosha 50
Yeah wow I just tried finding a non-nav in 280 sq. ft and the smallest other parachutes go is 260 :X
DrDom 0
I'm a little shocked that people are saying a NAV doesnt flare well. I've done all my jumps on a NAV 260 (with my exit weight being 210) and can say it turns well and flares fine for the novice jumper. I've high flared it (from over 20') and landed relatively softly with a PLF, and I only 1/2 flared on a no-wind day (was a stupid mistake) and still a gentle PLF.
It turns slow, but at this stage I don't mind, and I'm looking at a NAV 230 for my next canopy since I am with the OP that sometimes its enjoyable to be safe, slow, and enjoy the view :) Mind you a 230 still gets me less than 1:1... and I'm OK with that.
If you like how that NAV flies... then you just get out there and enjoy it. That is what really matters.
It turns slow, but at this stage I don't mind, and I'm looking at a NAV 230 for my next canopy since I am with the OP that sometimes its enjoyable to be safe, slow, and enjoy the view :) Mind you a 230 still gets me less than 1:1... and I'm OK with that.
If you like how that NAV flies... then you just get out there and enjoy it. That is what really matters.
You are not the contents of your wallet.
BigMark 1
lyoshaYeah wow I just tried finding a non-nav in 280 sq. ft and the smallest other parachutes go is 260 :X
Jumpshack makes the Firebolt in 272.
Us bigger guys tend to be a little better at being at a slightly higher wingloading than the little skinny folks that break easy :) that is assuming you are an in shape 265 and not a tubby 265.......just my $.02
My only question is, is your rig TSO'd for your weight?
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