Looking at alti to much ???

[lisamariewillbe 1]

Thank you Lisa, I have not commented on what you have been saying because although I do not mind flames, I do not like that people think I am just searching for others to agree with my methods.

Although I do think my mindset of how far I track may change sooner then later, I just was not aware that after AFF and A lisence that most track until pull alti, and thought the 5 seconds was standard when not making a specfic dive. For this reason I am planning to learn more on my tracking and my fall rate and forward distence and how they correlate to my personal break offs and pull stage.

Sudsy Fist: i don't think i'd ever say this
Sudsy Fist: but you're looking damn sudsydoable in this

[catfishhunter 2]

You are asbsolutly right Lisa..except the thread title is

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Looking at alti to much ???

I think people missed what this was about completly and went off on their own little tangents. It wasn't about tracking or break off alti etc.... I would hope that everyone already knows what you stated. Plan the Dive and Dive the plan. and you should always break 1000-1500 feet above the highest puller so if she pulls at 3.5-4 5000 feet is where they should be breaking. That should be UNDERSTOOD..

See my other post for the rest.

MAKE EVERY DAY COUNT
Life is Short and we never know how long we are going to have. We must live life to the fullest EVERY DAY. Everything we do should have a greater purpose.

[lisamariewillbe 1]

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I think people missed what this was about completly and went off on their own little tangents

Yes you are right, however people have approved and disapproved of everything I described that I do, so some subjects have needed to break into others. I asked about lock on and pull, and viewing the altimiter every 3 to 5 seconds but many felt that other aspects were more important to evaluate like my "stowed brakes" and my idea of "track for 5 secs then stop" because although I had a different question they were concerned about other aspects of my post. I feel this has been educational overall for many at my jump numbers which is evident from the pms I have recieved.

I also have people willing to buy me a bowling ball now lol

Sudsy Fist: i don't think i'd ever say this
Sudsy Fist: but you're looking damn sudsydoable in this

[mdrejhon 8]

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A break-off at 4 grand is perfectly reasonable for small groups of experienced RW jumpers.

Experienced is right for a 4K breakoff and 3K pull. For someone like me, having only 1000 feet difference between breakoff and pull is tricky at first, I went into my first spinning linetwists when breakoff and pull altitudes were only 1000 feet different. I was less than 100 jumps at the time... I still stick to a 1500 feet difference in altitude for now. I think I can easily do a 1000 feet difference now, but at the moment I'd rather not if possible. (Much like I've pulled at 2500 before a couple of times for the valid reason of clearing my airspace in a 20-way, but I'd rather not)

[Remster 30]

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Experienced is right for a 4K breakoff and 3K pull. For someone like me, having only 1000 feet difference between breakoff and pull is tricky at first, I went into my first spinning linetwists when breakoff and pull altitudes were only 1000 feet different. I was less than 100 jumps at the time... I still stick to a 1500 feet difference in altitude for now.

I dont see how having a longer tracking (1500 ft vs 1000) time will help with with linetwists....

Remster

[lisamariewillbe 1]

I had a similar experience when I dumped before slowing down and getting stable. It also resulted in a hard opening that hurt and had my feeling more odd then normal. Hence the importance for me to stop the track, slow down, and pull stable.

Sudsy Fist: i don't think i'd ever say this
Sudsy Fist: but you're looking damn sudsydoable in this

[Icon134 0]

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A break-off at 4 grand is perfectly reasonable for small groups of experienced RW jumpers.

1000 feet gives you plenty of time to track away and get clear airspace. If you need more than 1000 feet to get away from a small (say 10 or under) group of people, you need to work on your tracking skills.

This may be true and I usually only use/need 1000 ft to get proper seperation during RW with booties and good form... but the SIM suggests 1500 ft for groups up to 5 and 2000 ft for groups larger then 5... suggesting something otherwise to a biginner is a bad idea IMHO...

Livin' on the Edge... sleeping with my rigger's wife...

[mdrejhon 8]

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I dont see how having a longer tracking (1500 ft vs 1000) time will help with with linetwists....

This obviously needs clarification. It only provides slightly longer tracking time (i.e. 1.5 seconds or so), but provides an extra second to do a proper non-rushed stable waveoff and pull, and to avoid having to pull while still in a track. The rushing was what put me into linetwists. (500 feet equalling approximately 2.5 seconds)

That was jump 60. Now I'm at 140, so I'm ready to try again -- however, everybody around here have standardized on a 1500 feet difference, so I haven't been asked to do a 1000 feet difference again...yet.

[HeatherB 0]

I said "experienced RW jumpers" for a reason.

I can completely understand someone with 50 or 100 jumps not wanting to break-off at 4 grand. New jumpers aren't expected to have nice tracks and I can understand wanting the extra altitude.

Yes, the SIM says 1500 for groups of 5 or fewer, or 2000 for 6+, I've just never seen that done when all the jumpers on the load are experienced. Thankfully, it's not a BSR so we aren't gonna go to USPA jail.

I've never seen a group of 6 EXPERIENCED jumpers say "we have to break at 5 grand, b/c we're pulling at 3 grand." Of course, this is all just in my experience...your mileage may vary!

--Heather

[lisamariewillbe 1]

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Yes, the SIM says 1500 for groups of 5 or fewer, or 2000 for 6+, I've just never seen that done when all the jumpers on the load are experienced. Thankfully, it's not a BSR so we aren't gonna go to USPA jail.

I think that part was being brought up because one of the "editors" of the SIM was stating that I should be BO 1000 ft before pull time.

Sudsy Fist: i don't think i'd ever say this
Sudsy Fist: but you're looking damn sudsydoable in this

[billvon 3,006]

>In addition once I track for 5 secs from the formation I stare at my alti till my exact pull time.

I recommend you break this habit. Around pull time it is pretty important to be looking around to see other traffic, high canopies etc. Your altimeter will not move any faster or slower while you are looking at it; if you see 5000 feet, 4000 feet will still come 5-6 seconds later. Use that 5-6 seconds (assuming you are pulling at 4000) to look around and become more aware of your surroundings. And if you look away for 7 seconds instead? That's still fine. Altimeters aren't accurate enough to tell you when you are at exactly 4000 feet anyway, only that you are within a few hundred feet of that altitude.

[riggerrob 643]

Agreed!
Your eyes should be "outside the cockpit" while tracking.

I rarely look at my altimeter between break-off and canopy check.
Frankly, I usually look at my canopy, grab the rear risers, look around for canopy traffic, THEN glance at my altimeter.
Mind you, I have had 5,000 jumps to fine-tune my Mark One Eyeball altimeter to the point that I have an instantaneous understanding of whether I am at 3,000' or 2,000.

Call me old school, but I never agreed with the current fashion - at some AFF schools - to teach students to lock-on to their altimeters when they approach pull altitude.

I prefer the old "short-circles" method of glancing at your altimeter, glancing at the the horizon, glancing at your altimeter, etc. until it is time to wave off and pull. That gets your eyes "outside the cockpit.
In the short run, "eyes outside the cockpit" reduces line twists. In the long run "eyes outside the cockpit" reduces the number of collisions with other canopies.

[MakeItHappen 15]

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I think that part was being brought up because one of the "editors" of the SIM was stating that I should be BO 1000 ft before pull time.

LM I think you should aware that most people that read this forum have a reading comprehension that is a bit better than yours. There is no place that I say a new jumper should BO 1000 ft before pull time. Perhaps you should reread the thread?

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.
Make It Happen
Parachute History
DiveMaker

[lisamariewillbe 1]

perhaps you should also. You state many of times what someone at my level should be able to do, but you cant tell the difference between should and want...I dont want to, and I have had per this thread and people from my DZ agree that my levels to BO and to pull are not excessive. Im not going to argue with you, its not worth my time, I thanked those who agree to error on the side of caution, and I thanked those who gave me the advice that I feel was above my level. This is the internet, I dont plan to listen to you all. Then again the person who laughed at me about my lovk on and pull also wanted me to downsize and switch deployment methods with no AAD or RSL, and just as I am a big girl to not listen to that I am a big girl not to take to heart the comments made in this thread.


Oh and another cheap shot as far as my comprehension, Im so glad it is people like you who represent people like me in the USPA. Ive had plenty of pms from others at my level taking what you said the same way I did, just because you have more jumps, doesnt make you an end all be all, bad advice comes from all degrees of experience and I will not let people in this sport online or in real life try to convince me that I should take more chances. Oh hell what do I know, with 58 jumps I am more then ready to drop 25 sq ft, go to a pud without a AAD or RSL and BO at 3500 and pull at 2500 though, at least I wouldnt get laughed at right? Anyways this thread has served it purpose and I have learned from people I trust and have learned from people I dont trust. Thank you Jan for your time.

Sudsy Fist: i don't think i'd ever say this
Sudsy Fist: but you're looking damn sudsydoable in this

[kelpdiver 2]

So who wins Miss Congeneality?

everyone, take a deep breathe and back away...it's the weekend! (well, it's a lousy forecast here, but still)

[chachi 0]

you should be either tracking or barrel rolling to see if anyone is above you between 4 and 5000' not staring at your dial. another good thing is to have an audible with multiple alarms keeping your focus again on what's around you.

[billvon 3,006]

>Oh hell what do I know, with 58 jumps I am more then ready to drop 25 sq ft . . .

This forum can be a great place to ask questions and learn from, but sometimes you will get answers you do not agree with, or do not want to hear. It is generally better to just read them and then discount them if you choose than to try to 'defend' yourself against answers you do not like. That runs counter to the purpose of the forum.