Trump vs Hitler

[SkyDekker 1,465]

  On 5/27/2024 at 2:33 PM, Hissone said:

Just curious do you agree with the president that 13 dead servicemen and over 150 dead civilians from a suicide bomber at Kabul airport is a success? Also the retaliation for the bombing led to a drone strike approved by the president that also killed a family of 10. 7 whom were children that had nothing to do with the bombing. Is that all a success and Trumps fault also? 

D Day was a success. About 4,400 allied soldiers were killed about 2,500 of them were American.

[SkyDekker 1,465]

Just as a public service announcement:

Palestinians are also Semites. Hence protesting on behalf of Palestinians cannot be anti-Semitic.

[billvon 3,070]

In 1931, American journalist Dorothy Thompson interviewed Hitler.  She thought little of him; a not very intelligent man with an obviously evil plan.  The German people would not be fooled, she decided.  “Imagine a would-be dictator setting out to persuade a sovereign people to vote away their rights!” she wrote, bemused by his foolishness.

She was expelled by 1935, “in light of your numerous anti-German publications."  She had become the enemy; the press.

In 1937, she wrote about her experiences in Germany: “No people ever recognize their dictator in advance…. He always represents himself as the instrument for expressing the Incorporated National Will. When Americans think of dictators they always think of some foreign model. If anyone turned up here in a fur hat, boots and a grim look he would be recognized and shunned…. But when our dictator turns up, you can depend on it that he will be one of the boys, and he will stand for everything traditionally American.” 

In 1941 it became clear that the US would have to enter the war at some point - and the Nazis were the people we would be fighting.  But how could the sensible, rational Germans she knew from her time in Berlin turn into Nazis?  Who does that?  “It is an interesting and somewhat macabre parlor game to play at a large gathering of one’s acquaintances: to speculate who in a showdown would go Nazi,” she wrote. “By now, I think I know. I have gone through the experience many times—in Germany, in Austria, and in France. I have come to know the types: the born Nazis, the Nazis whom democracy itself has created, the certain-to-be fellow-travelers. And I also know those who never, under any conceivable circumstances, would become Nazis . . . . .Kind, good, happy, gentlemanly, secure people never go Nazi.  But the frustrated and humiliated intellectual, the rich and scared speculator, the spoiled son, the labor tyrant, the fellow who has achieved success by smelling the winds of success—they would all go Nazi in a crisis.  Those who haven’t anything in them to tell them what they like and what they don’t—whether it is breeding, or happiness, or wisdom, or a code, however old-fashioned or however modern - go Nazi.”

Later that year she observed that the man Hitler no longer really mattered; it was what he represented, the chance to save Germans and make Germany great again. “Chancellor Hitler is no longer a man, he is a religion.  My offense was to think that Hitler is just an ordinary man, after all. That is a crime against the reigning cult in Germany, which says Mr. Hitler is a Messiah sent by God to save the German people…. To question this mystic mission is so heinous that, if you are a German, you can be sent to jail. I, fortunately, am an American, so I merely was sent to Paris. Worse things can happen….”

(parts taken from Heather Richardson Cox's latest column)

[JoeWeber 2,823]

  On 10/22/2024 at 5:03 AM, billvon said:

In 1931, American journalist Dorothy Thompson interviewed Hitler.  She thought little of him; a not very intelligent man with an obviously evil plan.  The German people would not be fooled, she decided.  “Imagine a would-be dictator setting out to persuade a sovereign people to vote away their rights!” she wrote, bemused by his foolishness.

She was expelled by 1935, “in light of your numerous anti-German publications."  She had become the enemy; the press.

In 1937, she wrote about her experiences in Germany: “No people ever recognize their dictator in advance…. He always represents himself as the instrument for expressing the Incorporated National Will. When Americans think of dictators they always think of some foreign model. If anyone turned up here in a fur hat, boots and a grim look he would be recognized and shunned…. But when our dictator turns up, you can depend on it that he will be one of the boys, and he will stand for everything traditionally American.” 

In 1941 it became clear that the US would have to enter the war at some point - and the Nazis were the people we would be fighting.  But how could the sensible, rational Germans she knew from her time in Berlin turn into Nazis?  Who does that?  “It is an interesting and somewhat macabre parlor game to play at a large gathering of one’s acquaintances: to speculate who in a showdown would go Nazi,” she wrote. “By now, I think I know. I have gone through the experience many times—in Germany, in Austria, and in France. I have come to know the types: the born Nazis, the Nazis whom democracy itself has created, the certain-to-be fellow-travelers. And I also know those who never, under any conceivable circumstances, would become Nazis . . . . .Kind, good, happy, gentlemanly, secure people never go Nazi.  But the frustrated and humiliated intellectual, the rich and scared speculator, the spoiled son, the labor tyrant, the fellow who has achieved success by smelling the winds of success—they would all go Nazi in a crisis.  Those who haven’t anything in them to tell them what they like and what they don’t—whether it is breeding, or happiness, or wisdom, or a code, however old-fashioned or however modern - go Nazi.”

Later that year she observed that the man Hitler no longer really mattered; it was what he represented, the chance to save Germans and make Germany great again. “Chancellor Hitler is no longer a man, he is a religion.  My offense was to think that Hitler is just an ordinary man, after all. That is a crime against the reigning cult in Germany, which says Mr. Hitler is a Messiah sent by God to save the German people…. To question this mystic mission is so heinous that, if you are a German, you can be sent to jail. I, fortunately, am an American, so I merely was sent to Paris. Worse things can happen….”

(parts taken from Heather Richardson Cox's latest column)

Bill, thanks as always for your efforts. But the sad truth is that those of us here who are vehement anti Trumpers have long been too aware of how autocrats are made and wouldn’t trade our freedom or anyone else’s for a few more coins in the purse. The rest of us here either don’t care or don’t have the capacity to understand what the new reality would be living under Trump ver.2. Sadder is that all we can do now is hope.

[Phil1111 1,149]

  On 10/22/2024 at 5:03 AM, billvon said:

In 1931, American journalist Dorothy Thompson interviewed Hitler. ...

(parts taken from Heather Richardson Cox's latest column)

Yes

  On 10/22/2024 at 9:11 AM, JoeWeber said:

Bill, thanks as always for your efforts. But the sad truth is that those of us here who are vehement anti Trumpers have long been too aware of how autocrats are made and wouldn’t trade our freedom or anyone else’s for a few more coins in the purse. The rest of us here either don’t care or don’t have the capacity to understand what the new reality would be living under Trump ver.2. Sadder is that all we can do now is hope.

and yes. When you go to a website frequented by a majority of trump supporters. There is an endless parroting of trump lies and policy. Tariffs are good and a source of free cash. Nobody recognizes them as a tax and a source of inflation. The courts don't work and poor Donald is a victim of the weaponization of the DOJ. On and on.

There are exceptions to the trump cult and Liz Cheney comes to mind. But for every Cheney there is a Elon Musk. Which goes to show that eternal vigilance for the perversion of a good government is necessary. The need for a free press and free vote.

[jakee 1,563]

  On 10/22/2024 at 12:48 PM, Phil1111 said:

There are exceptions to the trump cult and Liz Cheney comes to mind. But for every Cheney there is a Elon Musk. 

One good thing here is that they may have accidentally sabotaged their own get out the vote campaign. Because Trump fetishises wealth over principles, his GOP have diverted all their grassroots campaign funding that normally would have gone to local branches to coordinate their activists, to Musk’s PAC to run the entire national campaign. So instead of Republicans who believe in the cause going door to door, they’re paying (presumably) minimum wage temps to do it instead. And what do people left to their own devices at a temp job they don’t give a shit about do? They cheat!
 

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2024/oct/22/trump-ground-game-door-knock-hack-gps

 

Donald Trump’s ground game in Arizona and Nevada may be undercut by canvassers working for America Pac using GPS spoofing to pretend they have knocked on doors when they haven’t, according to multiple people familiar with the practice and a leaked how-to-fake-location video.

The ramifications for Trump may be far reaching, given America Pac has taken on the bulk of the Trump campaign’s ground game in the battleground states, and the election increasingly appears set to be decided by turnout.

[normiss 851]

  On 10/22/2024 at 9:11 AM, JoeWeber said:

Bill, thanks as always for your efforts. But the sad truth is that those of us here who are vehement anti Trumpers have long been too aware of how autocrats are made and wouldn’t trade our freedom or anyone else’s for a few more coins in the purse. The rest of us here either don’t care or don’t have the capacity to understand what the new reality would be living under Trump ver.2. Sadder is that all we can do now is hope.

We recently watched the Netflix series How to Become a Tyrant.

Seen with today's environment, is terrifying. 

[JerryBaumchen 1,436]

  On 10/22/2024 at 5:03 AM, billvon said:

In 1931, American journalist Dorothy Thompson interviewed Hitler.  She thought little of him; a not very intelligent man with an obviously evil plan.  The German people would not be fooled, she decided.  “Imagine a would-be dictator setting out to persuade a sovereign people to vote away their rights!” she wrote, bemused by his foolishness.

She was expelled by 1935, “in light of your numerous anti-German publications."  She had become the enemy; the press.

In 1937, she wrote about her experiences in Germany: “No people ever recognize their dictator in advance…. He always represents himself as the instrument for expressing the Incorporated National Will. When Americans think of dictators they always think of some foreign model. If anyone turned up here in a fur hat, boots and a grim look he would be recognized and shunned…. But when our dictator turns up, you can depend on it that he will be one of the boys, and he will stand for everything traditionally American.” 

In 1941 it became clear that the US would have to enter the war at some point - and the Nazis were the people we would be fighting.  But how could the sensible, rational Germans she knew from her time in Berlin turn into Nazis?  Who does that?  “It is an interesting and somewhat macabre parlor game to play at a large gathering of one’s acquaintances: to speculate who in a showdown would go Nazi,” she wrote. “By now, I think I know. I have gone through the experience many times—in Germany, in Austria, and in France. I have come to know the types: the born Nazis, the Nazis whom democracy itself has created, the certain-to-be fellow-travelers. And I also know those who never, under any conceivable circumstances, would become Nazis . . . . .Kind, good, happy, gentlemanly, secure people never go Nazi.  But the frustrated and humiliated intellectual, the rich and scared speculator, the spoiled son, the labor tyrant, the fellow who has achieved success by smelling the winds of success—they would all go Nazi in a crisis.  Those who haven’t anything in them to tell them what they like and what they don’t—whether it is breeding, or happiness, or wisdom, or a code, however old-fashioned or however modern - go Nazi.”

Later that year she observed that the man Hitler no longer really mattered; it was what he represented, the chance to save Germans and make Germany great again. “Chancellor Hitler is no longer a man, he is a religion.  My offense was to think that Hitler is just an ordinary man, after all. That is a crime against the reigning cult in Germany, which says Mr. Hitler is a Messiah sent by God to save the German people…. To question this mystic mission is so heinous that, if you are a German, you can be sent to jail. I, fortunately, am an American, so I merely was sent to Paris. Worse things can happen….”

(parts taken from Heather Richardson Cox's latest column)

Hi Bill,

Then you might like this book:  The Divider: Trump in the White House, 2017-2021 by Peter Baker | Goodreads

From the book:  A book published in 2022 also reported Trump told his then-chief of staff, John Kelly, “Why can’t you be like the German generals?” 

And, the best part:  The Atlantic also reported Trump was furious when told how much the funeral for a fallen servicemember cost after he had volunteered to pay for it.

Jerry Baumchen

Trump: ‘I Need the Kind of Generals That Hitler Had’ - The Atlantic

[winsor 236]

One factor in the rise of Hitler, that I'm guessing is overlooked in this thread, is that of Marxists/Communists/Socialists/Anarchists.

There was a large cohort of Germans who found the thugs from Bavaria to be entirely loathsome - but still an improvement over the various Marxist types.  The same goes for Italians and Spanish, and the track record of Socialist Workers' Paradises rather vindicates that standpoint; Stalin and Mao make Hitler look amateurish when it comes to mindless killing.

There is similarly a fair number of voters who find Trump to be perfectly nauseating, but are willing to use him to keep the batshit crazy left in check.

Without Antifa, BLM, DEI and WOKE in general, Trump wouldn't have a chance.  As it is, enough people may be willing to bring a barf bag to the voting booth to keep Harris out of office.

This is one election where I don't think either side can fully claim "we suck less!"  The lot of them are perfectly revolting.

 

BSBD,

Winsor

Edited October 23, 2024 by winsor

[jakee 1,563]

  On 10/23/2024 at 8:23 AM, winsor said:

There was a large cohort of Germans who found the thugs from Bavaria to be entirely loathsome - but still an improvement over the various Marxist types. 

I’m not going to say I’m surprised that you are a literal Nazi apologist, but I didn’t expect you to let your facade slip far enough to actually say it out loud.

  On 10/23/2024 at 8:23 AM, winsor said:

Without Antifa, BLM, DEI and WOKE in general, Trump wouldn't have a chance.  As it is, enough people may be willing to bring a barf bag to the voting booth to keep Harris out of office.

See that is actually a great point seeing as Harris is a paid up member of Antifa and BLM. Wait, she actually has nothing to do with them and you’re talking utter shite as usual? Go figure.

[tkhayes 348]

  On 10/23/2024 at 8:23 AM, winsor said:

Without Antifa, BLM, DEI and WOKE in general, Trump wouldn't have a chance.  As it is, enough people may be willing to bring a barf bag to the voting booth to keep Harris out of office.

BSBD,

Winsor

Incorrect.  If none of those things existed, they would just make up some other boogieman to hate on.... kinda like you do.

You cannot have fear and hatred without creating something to fear and hate

[JoeWeber 2,823]

  On 10/23/2024 at 8:23 AM, winsor said:

One factor in the rise of Hitler, that I'm guessing is overlooked in this thread, is that of Marxists/Communists/Socialists/Anarchists.

There was a large cohort of Germans who found the thugs from Bavaria to be entirely loathsome - but still an improvement over the various Marxist types.  The same goes for Italians and Spanish, and the track record of Socialist Workers' Paradises rather vindicates that standpoint; Stalin and Mao make Hitler look amateurish when it comes to mindless killing.

There is similarly a fair number of voters who find Trump to be perfectly nauseating, but are willing to use him to keep the batshit crazy left in check.

Without Antifa, BLM, DEI and WOKE in general, Trump wouldn't have a chance.  As it is, enough people may be willing to bring a barf bag to the voting booth to keep Harris out of office.

This is one election where I don't think either side can fully claim "we suck less!"  The lot of them are perfectly revolting.

 

BSBD,

Winsor

That a clever fellow and student of history such as yourself can pretzel twist his logic until purges, mass starvations, genocides, the brutal and wholesale slaughter of untold millions of innocents and much more until it equates with being concerned with the safe futures and welfare of the weakest members of society is truly concerning. The simple fact that only Trump wants to suspend our democracy in favor of his own autocratic ambitions absolutely means that Harris whose desires are better lives for Americans sucks less. Whether or not her intentions are misguided is irrelevant by comparison.

[winsor 236]

Gee, I just thrive on PAs!  Thank goodness you're immune from timeouts.

I was in Spain under Franco, and knew rather a few people who recounted the actions of the Marxists and actively decided Franco's approach was an improvement.

I wouldn't have survived The Third Reich but spent a few years in the Bundesrepublik and visited the DDR, and knew people of various stances.  Some told me that things didn't work out as advertised, but, all things considered, it was better than the East, which is what the Marxists were trying to achieve in the '20s.  Weirdly enough, the greatest source of neo Nazis was Ostdeutschland.

In any event, the political stance on the Left in this country is straight out of Lewis Carroll, or that river in Egypt as the case may be.

All things considered, I preferred Franco's Spain to Brezhnev's Soviet Union.  YMMV.

[gowlerk 2,249]

  On 10/23/2024 at 8:23 AM, winsor said:

Without Antifa, BLM, DEI and WOKE in general, Trump wouldn't have a chance.  As it is, enough people may be willing to bring a barf bag to the voting booth to keep Harris out of office.

Yes, clearly there are many Americans who would prefer a right wing dictator over social change that involves treating people of all kinds with respect and dignity. Hitler also was able to tap into people's innate tribalism and distrust of others. You have shown that you understand Trump's appeal and that of the MAGA fear mongers. What side are you going to choose? And please stop with the communist/socialist boogeyman drivel. In the current two party system in the US there is no socialist option. Just two different choices each dominated by capitalist ideology and each supported by various billionaires trying to become trillionaires.

[Phil1111 1,149]

  On 10/23/2024 at 2:09 PM, winsor said:

...I was in Spain under Franco, and knew rather a few people who recounted the actions of the Marxists and actively decided Franco's approach was an improvement.

I wouldn't have survived The Third Reich but spent a few years in the Bundesrepublik and visited the DDR, and knew people of various stances.  Some told me that things didn't work out as advertised, but, all things considered, it was better than the East, which is what the Marxists were trying to achieve in the '20s.  Weirdly enough, the greatest source of neo Nazis was Ostdeutschland.

In any event, the political stance on the Left in this country is straight out of Lewis Carroll, or that river in Egypt as the case may be.

All things considered, I preferred Franco's Spain to Brezhnev's Soviet Union.  YMMV.

Of course you do. You've been cornered by the communists ruling the entirety of the EU, Canada and the western world. Cornered in America all while fighting off the communist hordes led by Harris. To keep things simple John Kelly, the Trump White House’s longest-serving chief of staff, said that he believed that Donald Trump met the definition of a fascist.  So you don't even have to reflect on what might happen should trump win.

  On 10/23/2024 at 2:55 PM, gowlerk said:

Yes, clearly there are many Americans who would prefer a right wing dictator over social change that involves treating people of all kinds with respect and dignity. Hitler also was able to tap into people's innate tribalism and distrust of others. You have shown that you understand Trump's appeal and that of the MAGA fear mongers.

Yes that sounds like Winsor.

  On 10/23/2024 at 2:55 PM, gowlerk said:

 What side are you going to choose? And please stop with the communist/socialist boogeyman drivel. In the current two party system in the US there is no socialist option. Just two different choices each dominated by capitalist ideology and each supported by various billionaires trying to become trillionaires.

Oh stop with the rhetorical questions. Everyone here knows that Winsor would toast a trump victory and the fascist ideology that accompanies it. Would relish the state jackboot with the toe of the boot on the constitution and the heel on welfare recipients and "illegals".

[SkyDekker 1,465]

  On 10/23/2024 at 2:09 PM, winsor said:

Gee, I just thrive on PAs!  Thank goodness you're immune from timeouts.

I was in Spain under Franco, and knew rather a few people who recounted the actions of the Marxists and actively decided Franco's approach was an improvement.

I wouldn't have survived The Third Reich but spent a few years in the Bundesrepublik and visited the DDR, and knew people of various stances.  Some told me that things didn't work out as advertised, but, all things considered, it was better than the East, which is what the Marxists were trying to achieve in the '20s.  Weirdly enough, the greatest source of neo Nazis was Ostdeutschland.

In any event, the political stance on the Left in this country is straight out of Lewis Carroll, or that river in Egypt as the case may be.

All things considered, I preferred Franco's Spain to Brezhnev's Soviet Union.  YMMV.

So what exact positions of the Democrat party align with the various Marxist types in Germany around the 30s?

[billvon 3,070]

  On 10/23/2024 at 8:23 AM, winsor said:

There was a large cohort of Germans who found the thugs from Bavaria to be entirely loathsome - but still an improvement over the various Marxist types. 

Yes, that's how Hitler worked it.  "You are victims of the immigrants/liberals/woke people/Marxists who are stealing your jobs and killing you!"  Never mind that Germans were killing THEM - indeed, one of the planks Hitler campaigned on was that he would not seek the death penalty for Germans who murdered immigrants.

Trump is following the same path.

  Quote

This is one election where I don't think either side can fully claim "we suck less!"

Oh, Harris absolutely can.  She is not a rapist or a felon.  No one in her administration is now in jail for crimes against the United States.  That is objectively "sucking less."

Of course, that is only true in reality.  In the MAGAverse where immigrants are eating all the cats and dogs, thousands of children are being forcibly converted to the opposite sex every day and Mexicans (not Trump) are raping American women - it all makes perfect sense.  

But how to mislead the people on that scale?  Both Hitler and Trump have what Hitler called "the Big Lie."  Hitler postulated that ordinary people wouldn't believe that he "could have the impudence to distort the truth so infamously."  And indeed many did not; many Germans honestly believed that Jews were poisoning the blood of Germany, and would lead to its collapse.  Trump has his "they are eating the dogs!  They are eating the cats!" - and indeed, his followers regularly state things like "come on!  He wouldn't lie about something like THAT."

Goebbels put it this way: "If you tell a lie big enough and keep repeating it, people will eventually come to believe it. The lie can be maintained only for such time as the State can shield the people from the political, economic and/or military consequences of the lie. It thus becomes vitally important for the State to use all of its powers to repress dissent, for the truth is the mortal enemy of the lie, and thus by extension, the truth is the greatest enemy of the State."

But to get the Big Lie out there you need a media apparatus, to "shield the people from the political, economic and/or military consequences of the lie."  Hitler had Hugenberg, a media mogul who owned several newspapers and movie houses.  They published papers and made movies about Hitler, all glowing and positive.  Hitler playing with children.  Hitler hiking, enjoying the beauty of nature.  Hitler fighting for the common man.

Trump, of course, has Rupert Murdoch and his media empire, who does the same thing for Trump.  Trump working at a McDonald's just like ordinary Americans.  Trump protecting Americans from MS13.  Regular announcements how Trump won this debate or that poll.

Supporting Trump because he's doing as good a job as Hitler did is not, IMO, a wise course to take.  Even if he does promise to deal with the evil, scheming, criminal Jews immigrants.

[jakee 1,563]

  On 10/23/2024 at 2:09 PM, winsor said:

Gee, I just thrive on PAs! 

What PA do you imagine you've been the victim of?

  Quote

I was in Spain under Franco, and knew rather a few people who recounted the actions of the Marxists and actively decided Franco's approach was an improvement.

Did any of those actions happen before Franco and his pals started a war?

Regardless, what the actual fuck does it have to do with Kamal Harris, outside of right wing media convincing gullible idiots that she's a Marxist?

  On 10/23/2024 at 2:09 PM, winsor said:

I wouldn't have survived The Third Reich but spent a few years in the Bundesrepublik and visited the DDR, and knew people of various stances.  Some told me that things didn't work out as advertised, but, all things considered, it was better than the East, which is what the Marxists were trying to achieve in the '20s.  Weirdly enough, the greatest source of neo Nazis was Ostdeutschland.

So... post war West Germany was better than East Germany which means people were right to vote for Hitler and that's why Kamala Harris is bad?

  On 10/23/2024 at 2:09 PM, winsor said:

In any event, the political stance on the Left in this country is straight out of Lewis Carroll, or that river in Egypt as the case may be.

Word salad. You are the best I've ever seen at saying absolutely nothing at all.

[gowlerk 2,249]

  On 10/23/2024 at 5:27 PM, jakee said:

Word salad. You are the best I've ever seen at saying absolutely nothing at all.

It's the same bullshit as RonD's. Facts are nothing, it's all about the feels.

[SkyDekker 1,465]

  On 10/23/2024 at 5:37 PM, gowlerk said:

It's the same bullshit as RonD's. Facts are nothing, it's all about the feels.

Not the same. Ron doesn't also think he is the smartest guy in the room and knows everything. Ron is just a true believer and will say so himself.

Winsor thinks his positions are justified because he is very smart and therefor cannot be wrong compared to inferior people.

[gowlerk 2,249]

  On 10/23/2024 at 5:47 PM, SkyDekker said:

Not the same. Ron doesn't also think he is the smartest guy in the room and knows everything. Ron is just a true believer and will say so himself.

No, they aren't exactly the same. But even so it comes down to emotions overcoming logic. Mostly fear, anger, and hate. 

[billvon 3,070]

Recently, in an interview with John Kelly (Trump's longest serving chief of staff) Kelly explained how much Trump admired Hitler and his total command of the military:

Trump: "I need the kind of generals that Hitler had.  People who were totally loyal to him, that follow orders.”
Kelly: "Do you mean Bismarck’s generals?  Do you mean the kaiser’s generals? Surely you can’t mean Hitler’s generals."
Trump: "Yeah, yeah, Hitler’s generals."

In another conversation, Kelly mentioned that Trump admired what Hitler accomplished.

Trump: “Hitler did some good things.” 
Kelly: "Sir, you can never say anything good about the guy. Nothing."

This follows denials from Trump supporters that he ever said this.

Also, like clockwork, FOX News jumped in to defend him:

Kilmeade: "I could absolutely see [Trump] go, ‘Now you know what, it would be great to have German generals that actually do what we ask them to do’—knowing that's a third—maybe not fully being cognizant of the third rail of German generals who were Nazis and whatever."

So we have the first two out of the way:

1) He never said that!
2) OK he said that but what he REALLY meant was other generals, not Hitler's generals.
3) Harris said it first.

[jakee 1,563]

  On 10/23/2024 at 6:08 PM, billvon said:

Kilmeade: "I could absolutely see [Trump] go, ‘Now you know what, it would be great to have German generals that actually do what we ask them to do’—knowing that's a third—maybe not fully being cognizant of the third rail of German generals who were Nazis and whatever."

Oh sure, because y'know, absent the Nazi angle it's a totally normal and politically acceptable Republican thing to complain about how shit the US military is against the obviously far superior European armed forces.

[JerryBaumchen 1,436]

  On 10/23/2024 at 6:08 PM, billvon said:

Recently, in an interview with John Kelly (Trump's longest serving chief of staff) Kelly explained how much Trump admired Hitler and his total command of the military:

Trump: "I need the kind of generals that Hitler had.  People who were totally loyal to him, that follow orders.”
Kelly: "Do you mean Bismarck’s generals?  Do you mean the kaiser’s generals? Surely you can’t mean Hitler’s generals."
Trump: "Yeah, yeah, Hitler’s generals."

In another conversation, Kelly mentioned that Trump admired what Hitler accomplished.

Trump: “Hitler did some good things.” 
Kelly: "Sir, you can never say anything good about the guy. Nothing."

This follows denials from Trump supporters that he ever said this.

Also, like clockwork, FOX News jumped in to defend him:

Kilmeade: "I could absolutely see [Trump] go, ‘Now you know what, it would be great to have German generals that actually do what we ask them to do’—knowing that's a third—maybe not fully being cognizant of the third rail of German generals who were Nazis and whatever."

So we have the first two out of the way:

1) He never said that!
2) OK he said that but what he REALLY meant was other generals, not Hitler's generals.
3) Harris said it first.

Hi Bill,

As you were saying:  Trump has pledged to toss reporters in jail and strip major television networks of their broadcast licenses as retribution for coverage he didn't like.

Trump threatens media with darker days if he wins the election : NPR

Jerry Baumchen

PS)  It would be interesting to see how many people in the news business support Trump.

[tkhayes 348]

  On 10/23/2024 at 2:09 PM, winsor said:

Gee, I just thrive on PAs!  Thank goodness you're immune from timeouts.

I was in Spain under Franco, and knew rather a few people who recounted the actions of the Marxists and actively decided Franco's approach was an improvement.

I wouldn't have survived The Third Reich but spent a few years in the Bundesrepublik and visited the DDR, and knew people of various stances.  Some told me that things didn't work out as advertised, but, all things considered, it was better than the East, which is what the Marxists were trying to achieve in the '20s.  Weirdly enough, the greatest source of neo Nazis was Ostdeutschland.

In any event, the political stance on the Left in this country is straight out of Lewis Carroll, or that river in Egypt as the case may be.

All things considered, I preferred Franco's Spain to Brezhnev's Soviet Union.  YMMV.

So just to confirm, you are OK with authoritarianism as long as it is right wing authoritarianism 

 

got it