wingloading choice

[Quagmirian 40]

Zlew

He is building his own canopies, and maybe that comment is based on that.

unless there is a physical or medical issue, I would be a little concerned if someone really didn't feel safe at a .7 loading. there may be a few exceptions to that, but that is usually in the mid to low range for students. maybe they just like bigger wings, but if they feel they need to go to a lower loading for safety....i'd love to hear the story/reasoning.

Just so we can get this out of the way, ground launching small canopies is far easier than jumping them. You're constantly close to the ground so flare timing is easier, you don't have to worry about canopy traffic malfunctions etc, and if you bury a toggle to avoid something, there's nowhere near enough altitude for the canopy to kill you. I would think very little of ground launching a Stiletto loaded at 1.4.

I'll take you through my reasoning for wanting to upsize to a 'massive' canopy. Firstly, I am very uncurrent. I haven't jumped for almost a year now. Something a bit bigger over my head won't hurt.

Secondly, I had a minor incident out in Elsinore last year that made me think. I was jumping a Spectre 210 and considering demoing a 190 rig. I jumped on a bumpy day with dust devils around, and as I turned onto final, the wind was not going the way I thought it was. I landed with a tailwind and made the classic mistake of flaring the canopy too high and too hard. I landed in the shrubbery and rolled around a bit, but I was wearing my FS suit so I didn't get hurt.

It made me change my mind about downsizing. I, the master of my 210 with 50 jumps, could not even land downwind properly! What's more, I turned 45 degrees during the flare. I can't even hold a heading on a landing, how am I ready to downsize?

[Zlew 0]

Thanks for the info!

It sounds like your biggest issue is just getting current.

If you don't own gear and are renting...and are trying to get current again I think your choice is a good one. Get current on an appropriately loaded wing and get confident in your skills before downsizing.

If you are a year out of currency, you probably won't have much choice in what you fly when you get back in.

I bet you will find once you get current and jump more regularly that getting past a student wing loading might no tbe a big deal. Until then, stay safe and trust your instinct.

[DcloudZ 0]

Quagmirian

I jump rental equipment in the 0.76 range, and I've recently realised that that is too high a wing loading for me.

Dude if you want to fly backwards just hook up your canopy backwards...

"Better to have a short life that is full of what you like doing than a long life spent in a miserable way." -Alan Watts

[uberchris 0]

i dont know how accurate that is, i have a handful of friends that have gotten in serious accidents flying highly loaded speedwings close to the ground..........id be careful flying highly loaded canopies as well wether youre close to the ground or not.

and if you want to fly backwards, but not hook your canopy up backwards, kick into a half line twist
=)

gravity brings me down.........

[-ftp- 0]

GooniesKid

No offense, but you are kidding right? .76 WL and you think it's too high a WL? Are you trolling?

Only reason why is because my WL is also around .7 and i dont think it's too high for me..in fact, if i got say a 170 i'd still be under 1.0.

So whats good for you must be good for everyone else? Who's "trolling" here? Stop giving out advice that you know nothing about.

[GooniesKid 0]

-ftp-

***

No offense, but you are kidding right? .76 WL and you think it's too high a WL? Are you trolling?

Only reason why is because my WL is also around .7 and i dont think it's too high for me..in fact, if i got say a 170 i'd still be under 1.0.

So whats good for you must be good for everyone else? Who's "trolling" here? Stop giving out advice that you know nothing about.

Good sir, which part of my reply insinuates advice of any sort? Perhaps a class in critical thinking and/or a bootcamp course in Logical Fallacies might serve you well before you start claiming I gave any advice.

[crotalus01 0]

It was the "you must be kidding" comment, not any advice you gave. It's comments like that that push some people to jump canopies they are not ready for.
Perhaps a class in STFU would serve YOU well.....

As for me and my house, we will serve the LORD...

[-ftp- 0]

GooniesKid

******

No offense, but you are kidding right? .76 WL and you think it's too high a WL? Are you trolling?

Only reason why is because my WL is also around .7 and i dont think it's too high for me..in fact, if i got say a 170 i'd still be under 1.0.

So whats good for you must be good for everyone else? Who's "trolling" here? Stop giving out advice that you know nothing about.

Good sir, which part of my reply insinuates advice of any sort? Perhaps a class in critical thinking and/or a bootcamp course in Logical Fallacies might serve you well before you start claiming I gave any advice.

I put it in bold for you princess, people like you bring this sport down, know when to shut your mouth or better yet don't open it at all. Judging by your arrogant tone that comes across, chances are the world would be a better place if you did.

Maybe you have little man's syndrome, based on your WL of under 1:1 on a 170??

[popsjumper 2]

..another thread trashed by dick swinging...

My reality and yours are quite different.
I think we're all Bozos on this bus.
Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239

[Rick 67]

devildog

***I'm loaded 1.3+ and can penetrate in as high of winds as I want to jump in. If I'm backing up, I'm sitting out the next one.

Pretty much this. Loaded at a 1.3 here and have no intentions of going past that.


same here loaded 1.3 on my 170's with no intention of downsizing. sporty enough for me. penetrates any winds I would intentionally jump in

and I feel really comfortable jumping at this wing loading with the amount of jumps I do per year

You can't be drunk all day if you don't start early!

[TEB6363 0]

I'm in about the same boat Rick...

I bought my canopy at about 1.1 wing loading... Through the years I seem to have had a "natural" progression to a higher wing loading on the same canopy...

Once the plane takes off, you're gonna have to land - Might as well jump out!!

[wildcard451 0]

I'm 2.7 and it's because I wanted to go faster.

[nigel99 489]

It's interesting that most jumpers who've responded are sitting around the 1.3 mark.

My intuition tells me this is on the slightly conservative side, as most jumpers around me seem to be on 120-135 canopies.

Experienced jumper - someone who has made mistakes more often than I have and lived.

[JohnMitchell 16]

nigel99

It's interesting that most jumpers who've responded are sitting around the 1.3 mark.

My intuition tells me this is on the slightly conservative side, as most jumpers around me seem to be on 120-135 canopies.

1.3 wing loading is about as fast as I can possibly run on no-wind days.

[popsjumper 2]

JohnMitchell

1.3 wing loading is about as fast as I can possibly run on no-wind days.

Man, that makes me feel better.
I didn't want to admit it but since you brought it up...that's exactly why 1.1 is my limit.

My reality and yours are quite different.
I think we're all Bozos on this bus.
Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239

[devildog 0]

nigel99

It's interesting that most jumpers who've responded are sitting around the 1.3 mark.

My intuition tells me this is on the slightly conservative side, as most jumpers around me seem to be on 120-135 canopies.

At my little DZ, at least, students aside, you'd be correct.

You stop breathing for a few minutes and everyone jumps to conclusions.

[mrubin 0]

I'm at about 1.3 and plan to stay here for a long time. I get enough drive in the winds that I'm willing to jump and I'm not coming in faster than I can run on no wind days.

"I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things." - Antoine de Saint-Exupery

[Rick 67]

popsjumper

***1.3 wing loading is about as fast as I can possibly run on no-wind days.

Man, that makes me feel better.
I didn't want to admit it but since you brought it up...that's exactly why 1.1 is my limit.


....and that

You can't be drunk all day if you don't start early!

[Rick 67]

nigel99

It's interesting that most jumpers who've responded are sitting around the 1.3 mark.

My intuition tells me this is on the slightly conservative side, as most jumpers around me seem to be on 120-135 canopies.

yeah I believe it is on the conservative side

I guess when it comes to safety issues that is the side i want to be on

You can't be drunk all day if you don't start early!

[ridebmxbikes 0]

nigel99

It's interesting that most jumpers who've responded are sitting around the 1.3 mark.

My intuition tells me this is on the slightly conservative side, as most jumpers around me seem to be on 120-135 canopies.

I'm on a 120 @ 1.26... Just wanted to make you sound contradicting.

[Ron 10]

IMO, 1.3 -1.4 is about the best WL for a traditional canopy. Fast, but still loaded softly enough to allow for normal landings without added speed.

I'll give an example, I am 1.6 and just for fun I decided to do a traditional accuracy approach last weekend. I turned to final and went to half brakes. I used my brakes to fly the wire to the pea pit. I have maybe a thousand of these approaches on demo canopy's. When I got about 75 feet I went to full flight to have speed for a flare. I would not have needed to do this on a 1.3 loaded canopy, but at 1.6 the landing would have been 'firm'.

IMO, a 1.3-1.4 is about the highest WL you really want to use for a traditional canopy... Yeah, I am at 1.6. I have to make sure I have enough speed to get enough flare.

"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

[AdD 1]

Quote

Just so we can get this out of the way, ground launching small canopies is far easier than jumping them. You're constantly close to the ground so flare timing is easier, you don't have to worry about canopy traffic malfunctions etc, and if you bury a toggle to avoid something, there's nowhere near enough altitude for the canopy to kill you. I would think very little of ground launching a Stiletto loaded at 1.4.

Tell that to Dave Ogison (who died in San Diego doing exactly this).

You don't know shit about ground launching bud, it's more dangerous than skydiving by far.

Life is ez
On the dz
Every jumper's dream
3 rigs and an airstream

[Snowcrash 0]

I jump a 190 loaded just under 1:1, which is the smallest canopy I'm allowed to jump at my weight and jump number by our Swedish regulations. It was also the largest I could find used. I'd probably not want anything smaller at this point even if there was no restriction though.

[bigbearfng 18]

Same here-just under 1.3 on a 170.
I was going to downsize a while ago-however one day with a lot of canopy traffic and shifting winds(and yes better planning would have helped!) I found myself stuck with a downwinder.
I rolled my ass off and walked away just covered in dust-and decided right then I'm never going below a 170!
So think about those less than ideal landings when you want to downsize.....

[dot_txt 0]

I'm loaded between 1.2 and 1.25 on a Sabre-1 150 depending on what I'm wearing, and time of year. Its still a bit small for my experience level, but I feel safer with the heightened responsiveness in the toggles compared to a 170 or 190, even with the increased speed.