Goodbye Enola Gay

[jakee 1,553]

16 hours ago, dogyks said:

Okay, who am I to dispute your victimhood?  Since it appears to be pivotal to your identity, it's all yours.

Your entire worldview is based on the fact that an ethnic minority was once hired ahead of you and you assumed that the only possible reason for it was that you were being victimised by affirmative action.

[normiss 835]

On 3/8/2025 at 2:17 PM, jakee said:

It’s just what anyone else does when faced with irrational directives from a capricious, volatile, tiny brained and tinier dicked boss - go into full on CYA mode.

CMA, the hell with yours!  

[billvon 3,050]

13 hours ago, jakee said:

Your entire worldview is based on the fact that an ethnic minority was once hired ahead of you and you assumed that the only possible reason for it was that you were being victimised by affirmative action.

But that's the GOOD kind of victimhood, not the DEI kind.

[base698 20]

On 3/9/2025 at 3:23 PM, billvon said:

OK.  So you have a daughter.  Usual girl parts.  She's on a swim team.  At age 14 you discover she is XY.  What sex is she?  What gender is she?

Should be a simple question.

Welcome to the wonderful world of DEI!

https://x.com/xDaily_Know/status/1899455815628538006

 

[billvon 3,050]

10 minutes ago, base698 said:

https://x.com/xDaily_Know/status/1899455815628538006

That makes six conservatives who can't define what a woman is.

[BIGUN 1,371]

1 hour ago, billvon said:

That makes six conservatives who can't define what a woman is.

Do you think he realizes that post makes your argument, not his. 

[base698 20]

12 hours ago, BIGUN said:

Do you think he realizes that post makes your argument, not his. 

I was adding humor.  I'm aware of all the 1 in 30,000 edge cases. 

Conflating a real thing like androgen insensitivity with a 13 year old girl who wants to be different or a 50 year old man who wants to go in women's spaces as all one homogeneous group is silly.  Both sides do it.

[billvon 3,050]

5 hours ago, base698 said:

Conflating a real thing like androgen insensitivity with a 13 year old girl who wants to be different 

Except, of course, in the cases where the 13 year old who wants to be different has AIS.  Which has happened, fairly often.

 

[dogyks 9]

5 hours ago, base698 said:

I was adding humor.  I'm aware of all the 1 in 30,000 edge cases. 

Conflating a real thing like androgen insensitivity with a 13 year old girl who wants to be different or a 50 year old man who wants to go in women's spaces as all one homogeneous group is silly.  Both sides do it.

I'm on neither side.

There are people with all sorts of genetic anomalies (I have the Birt Hogg Dube mutation) and it is what it is.

An acquaintance is quite gay and married.  When asked about his wife, who stuck by him when he came out, he pointed out that nobody wants to be a paraiah and he got married to prove to himself that he was normal.  He later asked 'who am I kidding,' his wife said basically 'what else is new?' and they sorted out the relationship.

Another friend is female but presents as masculine.  Her preference for women is related to her only hetero experience being, let us say 'suboptimal,' and I get it.  She is annoyed when people call her 'sir,' but that's about it.

Some people appear to feel stigmatized by being homosexual and rationalize this concluding that they are in the wrong body.  That they choose to function as the other sex is their business, and it has provided a rather good living for a surgeon of my acquaintence who performs the various procedures involved.

Of course, if one is going to spend a decade or so in lockup, identifying as a lesbian in a man's body is one way to wind up with women instead of men.  I get it.

Divine made a living as a zaftig tranvestite, appearing as a man in one of John Waters' movies (Hairspray?), and I don't know much of anyone who raised an eyebrow.  I thought "Lust in the Dust" was a scream.

Anyhow, drawing the line at people giving puberty blockers to and performing surgery on children is not, in and of itself, a rejection of people who wish to live as the other sex.  There's a difference.

 

[JoeWeber 2,790]

37 minutes ago, dogyks said:

Anyhow, drawing the line at people giving puberty blockers to and performing surgery on children is not, in and of itself, a rejection of people who wish to live as the other sex.  There's a difference.

No argument from me there. But to be clear if it's one of those confused biological situations where parents and medical doctors are trying their best to make an early on decision for a child that avoids a psychological disaster later, and there are never guarantees, you are good with the efforts?

[dogyks 9]

21 minutes ago, JoeWeber said:

No argument from me there. But to be clear if it's one of those confused biological situations where parents and medical doctors are trying their best to make an early on decision for a child that avoids a psychological disaster later, and there are never guarantees, you are good with the efforts?

Having been an adolescent, taught adolescents, parented adolescents and been a Scout Leader, I question the sanity of anyone who views the position of a child in transition as binding.  To use puberty blockers (Turing committed suicide when his use of these drugs was mandated) or, even worse, to perform surgery to "correct" the issue is criminal.

Trying to 'fix' a child going through this phase is a fool's errand.  Most well adjusted adults bear precious little resemblance to the person they were in Middle and/or High School, and to make life altering changes based on the way things look at this age is a Very Bad Idea.

If there is a real medical issue and surgery is indicated?  Go for it.

If the child is unhappy with the transition to whatever kind of adult they will be?  Medical intervention is generally an act of idiocy.

[JoeWeber 2,790]

16 minutes ago, dogyks said:

Having been an adolescent, taught adolescents, parented adolescents and been a Scout Leader, I question the sanity of anyone who views the position of a child in transition as binding. 

Absolutely: there's a real reason we don't see a lot of Goth dressing adults these days. I'm not sure there is so much daylight between opinions here as the forcefulness of the dialogue seems to indicate. I simply cannot recall any posters thinking that kids should be allowed to transition based on their feels, their parents simplemindedness, or a psychologists delusions. I think the consensus is that true medical conditions that are fixable are reasonable upon serious consideration. In my view, men who want to serve their times in a women's prison, while an attractive proposition at first blush, shouldn't be facilitated with medical procedures nor should known biological men be allowed to compete against biological women in school sports. That said, after the fact XY chromosome surprises, that would likely be a devastating discovery for the individual, should never be an opportunity to practice ones asshole skills or craft preventive social policies beforehand.

[normiss 835]

26 minutes ago, dogyks said:

Having been an adolescent, taught adolescents, parented adolescents and been a Scout Leader, I question the sanity of anyone who views the position of a child in transition as binding.  To use puberty blockers (Turing committed suicide when his use of these drugs was mandated) or, even worse, to perform surgery to "correct" the issue is criminal.

Trying to 'fix' a child going through this phase is a fool's errand.  Most well adjusted adults bear precious little resemblance to the person they were in Middle and/or High School, and to make life altering changes based on the way things look at this age is a Very Bad Idea.

If there is a real medical issue and surgery is indicated?  Go for it.

If the child is unhappy with the transition to whatever kind of adult they will be?  Medical intervention is generally an act of idiocy.

Why is it called a "phase" when people are born the way they are? This "transition phase" appears to happen just around the times we understand we become sexual beings, and who you are is already there. I think a lot of people misunderstand sexual identities and think it's a choice. 

Besides that, it's THEIR life. Which makes it none of my business. I seriously do not care what the vast majority of humans prefer to do with their clothes off. Nunya and nunmy bidness. 

[dogyks 9]

1 minute ago, normiss said:

Why is it called a "phase" when people are born the way they are? This "transition phase" appears to happen just around the times we understand we become sexual beings, and who you are is already there. I think a lot of people misunderstand sexual identities and think it's a choice. 

Besides that, it's THEIR life. Which makes it none of my business. I seriously do not care what the vast majority of humans prefer to do with their clothes off. Nunya and nunmy bidness. 

Some of the people studied by Margared Mead, when later interviewed, said that they had fun goofing on the naive and credulous creature that asked all the questions.  Regarding the particulars she reported, they chuckled and said 'nah, that was bullshit' (or words to that effect.

I agree that what people do behind closed doors is generally Too Much Information if they wanted to discuss it.  I've suspected that some of the stuff guys claimed when I was in the Army was like what the islanders told Margaret Mead, where they were playing on perceived gullibility or testing the ick factor as the case may be, but it was impolitic to say 'spare me.'

In any event, I have lived in societies where sex was viewed as being as natural as breathing, those that see it as an evil that is tolerated only as necessary to procreate, and variations in between.

In the movie Little Big Man, the character Little Horse was 'two-spirit' and nobody really gave it a second thought.  Then you have people from Bible Thumping backgrounds, for whom it's all 'sinful,' and they're strung out about it coming and going.

If you have someone going through puberty in an environment where the approach to sex is pathological, how things settle out is unlikely to be well adjusted.

Thus, you can have youngsters who REALLY want to get laid and hate themselves for it, so the role into which they settle may reflect this self loathing in one way or another.

Calling it a 'choice' doesn't really do it justice.

[wmw999 2,507]

I'm wondering when we'll start hearing about the "decision to become gay."

Wendy P.

[gowlerk 2,238]

1 hour ago, dogyks said:

Having been an adolescent, taught adolescents, parented adolescents and been a Scout Leader, I question the sanity of anyone who views the position of a child in transition as binding.  To use puberty blockers (Turing committed suicide when his use of these drugs was mandated) or, even worse, to perform surgery to "correct" the issue is criminal.

Trying to 'fix' a child going through this phase is a fool's errand.  Most well adjusted adults bear precious little resemblance to the person they were in Middle and/or High School, and to make life altering changes based on the way things look at this age is a Very Bad Idea.

The few cases I have heard of using puberty blockers on young people have involved children who presented as being a different gender than at birth long before the confusion that can result from puberty. These are not confused adolescents.

[dogyks 9]

21 minutes ago, gowlerk said:

The few cases I have heard of using puberty blockers on young people have involved children who presented as being a different gender than at birth long before the confusion that can result from puberty. These are not confused adolescents.

Perhaps, but I've known kids that I would have guessed were destined to change teams but turned out entirely straight.  It can wait until they can vote.

[gowlerk 2,238]

5 minutes ago, dogyks said:

Perhaps, but I've known kids that I would have guessed were destined to change teams but turned out entirely straight.  It can wait until they can vote.

There is a big difference between you guessing they may switch teams and them deciding going through puberty will be harmful to them. 

[billvon 3,050]

1 hour ago, dogyks said:

If you have someone going through puberty in an environment where the approach to sex is pathological, how things settle out is unlikely to be well adjusted.

Thus, you can have youngsters who REALLY want to get laid and hate themselves for it, so the role into which they settle may reflect this self loathing in one way or another.

Calling it a 'choice' doesn't really do it justice.

"And these children that you spit on
As they try to change their worlds
Are immune to your consultations
They're quite aware of what they're going through"

-D Bowie

[normiss 835]

6 hours ago, dogyks said:

Perhaps, but I've known kids that I would have guessed were destined to change teams but turned out entirely straight.  It can wait until they can vote.

So you get to decide who is LGBTQ.

Maybe like some of us, you'll have a close personal interaction with humans not like you. They are out there. 

[dogyks 9]

12 hours ago, normiss said:

So you get to decide who is LGBTQ.

Maybe like some of us, you'll have a close personal interaction with humans not like you. They are out there. 

I can't tell if you're projecting or feigning ignorance.

[normiss 835]

1 hour ago, dogyks said:

I can't tell if you're projecting or feigning ignorance.

Honest answer and perspective. Why the hate? Why do you care? Leave people be with their own life and stop hating people for being born. It's insane.

[dogyks 9]

3 minutes ago, normiss said:

Honest answer and perspective. Why the hate? Why do you care? Leave people be with their own life and stop hating people for being born. It's insane.

WTF?

[normiss 835]

1 minute ago, dogyks said:

WTF?

Exactly. In regards to everything you've said for that matter.

 

[dogyks 9]

1 hour ago, normiss said:

Exactly. In regards to everything you've said for that matter.

 

Okay, incoherence is the best you can do.

If you dispute anything I said, get specific.

If you wish to make claims of "hate," back them up.

Otherwise back off.