JENNR8R 0 #1 January 4, 2006 I've recently taken up wingsuit flying. Since the arms are busy flying, one must wave off with their legs....clicking their heels three times like Dorothy in the Wizard of Oz. Pulling the pilot chute is accomplished by bringing both arms in symmetrically and throwing both arms back out ....even though the left hand is not holding anything. This is a lot of fun. Is there any safety reason why I shouldn't pull my pilot chute this way when I'm not flying a wingsuit?What do you call a beautiful, sunny day that comes after two cloudy, rainy ones? -- Monday. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,006 #2 January 4, 2006 >Is there any safety reason why I shouldn't pull my pilot chute this >way when I'm not flying a wingsuit? Because you will go head down, resulting in a more violent rotation during opening. (Not a big issue in wingsuit flight since you are going slower to begin with.) I have opened as you described a few times during normal RW when I was jumping a different rig and had trouble finding an unusually-high BOC handle. I pushed the rig over and down with my left hand and found the pud with my right hand. Opening was more dramatic than usual, but since I was jumping a Pilot at the time there wasn't too much drama. I wouldn't want to try that with a more aggressive canopy. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dragon2 2 #3 January 4, 2006 I tried it with my camera suit, since the wings are such I can't fully wave off. Went head down a bit on opening like Billvon said, and had a much-harder-than-usual opening, luckily on my spectre). If you compensate for the headdown you can pull like this, we even have prospective birdmen pull like this from a delta, without a ws. But i didn't like the headdown opening at all esp with my cameras ciel bleu, Saskia Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CrazyL 0 #4 January 4, 2006 Like the other fellas said. can put you in headown more exciting opening. I don't know if i'm doing it right either. Here's my favorite way now: Having the idea of the rig being parallel to the earth during deployment sequence. Here's how: Begin in full birdman flight.Wave off by collapsing/opening all wings simultaneously 3 times (causing decrease of forward speed/increasing descent rate and letting others know it's pull time). Collapse all wings grabbing main p/c at the same time bringing knees toward my chest(leg wing collapsed/feet knees together increasing descent rate possibly decreasing burble) throw out p/c maintaining body position. Grab harness near 3 ring, be ready for anything. Now, once I throw out p/c if nothing happens in a timely manner, I spread wings making a mad dash for forward speed, be ready for anything. Best advice i could give is to continue to pull above 4,000 ft till you really get the pull sequence down. However you do it. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
FrogNog 1 #5 January 4, 2006 I pull that way on hop-and-pops sometimes, where going head-low doesn't happen as quick or matter as much. It is a lot of fun. -=-=-=-=- Pull. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JohnRich 4 #6 January 5, 2006 QuoteIs there any safety reason why I shouldn't pull my pilot chute this way when I'm not flying a wingsuit? Well, if you're in a big RW dive, some old fart like me might not recognize what those heel-taps mean..."Why is that guy tapping his heels while tracking off? ... Oh shit!" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JENNR8R 0 #7 January 5, 2006 QuoteQuoteIs there any safety reason why I shouldn't pull my pilot chute this way when I'm not flying a wingsuit? Well, if you're in a big RW dive, some old fart like me might not recognize what those heel-taps mean..."Why is that guy tapping his heels while tracking off? ... Oh shit!" Sorry if my question wasn't clear. I was only talking about pulling the pilot chute by bringing both arms in symmetrically....not waving off with my legs. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JENNR8R 0 #8 January 5, 2006 Thanks for the replies. I knew I should ask before trying it....and that someone here would have experience in this area. If I want to pull my pilot chute by bringing both arms in, I'll put a wingsuit on first. All the more reason to wear one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites CrazyL 0 #9 January 5, 2006 Quote I was only talking about pulling the pilot chute by bringing both arms in symmetrically....not waving off with my legs. Sorry. What billvon said about going head low is more correct. I'm sure you can and this may be a silly question, can you visualize the angle your parachute deploys in relation to your body/container during the pull time you described?and i described? and Do you spread your arms and continue full birdman flight after you throw the pilotchute? Do you know at what angles if any are more hazardous? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites ScottyInAus 0 #10 January 5, 2006 I don't KNOW this as a FACT, but just thinking about it for a sec. When you bring your arms back to grab PC, if you close your legs and try to stick your heals in your @ss would it counter the tendancy to go head low? Just a thought. I don't know Cheers, Jason. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites billvon 3,006 #11 January 5, 2006 >if you close your legs and try to stick your heals in your @ss would it >counter the tendancy to go head low? It would to some degree. But it also makes you less stable and increases your fall rate - both of which, again, can lead to hard openings. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites moonglo 0 #12 January 5, 2006 I've had days where I'm flying wingsuit all day then disconnect for some freefall jumps at the end of the day. On those days I almost always end up pulling as if I were still flying a wingsuit, just as you ask. The reason I can get away with doing this without hurting myself (as others have suggested) is I'm tall and skinny and tend to track at about 80 to 90 mph without a wingsuit, and I have a soft opening forgiving canopy (Sabre2 loaded at 1.2-ish) that I pack to open extra slow when not wingsuiting. It's all in the arch at pull time- if you can slow yourself down then keep yourself head high and pull fairly quickly the openings are no different than pulling with the left hand in front of you. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites CrazyL 0 #13 January 5, 2006 What do you do to disconnect and go into freefall again? What suit? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites FrogNog 1 #14 January 5, 2006 I believe he means he "unsews" his container/harness from his wingsuit so he can do some non-wingsuit jumps. -=-=-=-=- Pull. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites moonglo 0 #15 January 5, 2006 Hehehe I do it on the ground, then put on an RW or FF suit! FrogNog got it right, well except for the"he" part Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites monkycndo 0 #16 January 6, 2006 I did a bunch of practice jumps doing exits and deployments prior to putting on a wingsuit. I actually deployed a couple of times using the ws style. My openings were a bit more "brisk" with more pendulum swing. It didn't hurt, but I'll stick to the regular method to deploy when not in a ws.50 donations so far. Give it a try. You know you want to spank it Jump an Infinity Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites CrazyL 0 #17 January 6, 2006 Ahhhh! Got it. 2 totally different jumps. Have fun! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites twibbles 0 #18 January 6, 2006 QuoteI don't KNOW this as a FACT, but just thinking about it for a sec. When you bring your arms back to grab PC, if you close your legs and try to stick your heals in your @ss would it counter the tendancy to go head low? Just a thought. I don't know Just my two cents here.. One thing i did in the wind tunnel was to fly with both arms back like i waas trying to reach pilot chutes at both sides of the container. You really have to bring your heels in to stay stop yourself smacking into the wall of the tunel, but i can do turns and slideslips just fine. still able to control my fall rate, but that's in the tunnel, ended doing a 360 turn in the bottom, foreward left of the tunnel then moving in a straight line to the top, rear right for another turn. Just in case i break both arms on exit my instructor said, i'll be able to fly with only my legs :) Eugene... "In the beginning the Universe was created. This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move." 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CrazyL 0 #9 January 5, 2006 Quote I was only talking about pulling the pilot chute by bringing both arms in symmetrically....not waving off with my legs. Sorry. What billvon said about going head low is more correct. I'm sure you can and this may be a silly question, can you visualize the angle your parachute deploys in relation to your body/container during the pull time you described?and i described? and Do you spread your arms and continue full birdman flight after you throw the pilotchute? Do you know at what angles if any are more hazardous? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ScottyInAus 0 #10 January 5, 2006 I don't KNOW this as a FACT, but just thinking about it for a sec. When you bring your arms back to grab PC, if you close your legs and try to stick your heals in your @ss would it counter the tendancy to go head low? Just a thought. I don't know Cheers, Jason. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,006 #11 January 5, 2006 >if you close your legs and try to stick your heals in your @ss would it >counter the tendancy to go head low? It would to some degree. But it also makes you less stable and increases your fall rate - both of which, again, can lead to hard openings. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
moonglo 0 #12 January 5, 2006 I've had days where I'm flying wingsuit all day then disconnect for some freefall jumps at the end of the day. On those days I almost always end up pulling as if I were still flying a wingsuit, just as you ask. The reason I can get away with doing this without hurting myself (as others have suggested) is I'm tall and skinny and tend to track at about 80 to 90 mph without a wingsuit, and I have a soft opening forgiving canopy (Sabre2 loaded at 1.2-ish) that I pack to open extra slow when not wingsuiting. It's all in the arch at pull time- if you can slow yourself down then keep yourself head high and pull fairly quickly the openings are no different than pulling with the left hand in front of you. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CrazyL 0 #13 January 5, 2006 What do you do to disconnect and go into freefall again? What suit? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
FrogNog 1 #14 January 5, 2006 I believe he means he "unsews" his container/harness from his wingsuit so he can do some non-wingsuit jumps. -=-=-=-=- Pull. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
moonglo 0 #15 January 5, 2006 Hehehe I do it on the ground, then put on an RW or FF suit! FrogNog got it right, well except for the"he" part Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
monkycndo 0 #16 January 6, 2006 I did a bunch of practice jumps doing exits and deployments prior to putting on a wingsuit. I actually deployed a couple of times using the ws style. My openings were a bit more "brisk" with more pendulum swing. It didn't hurt, but I'll stick to the regular method to deploy when not in a ws.50 donations so far. Give it a try. You know you want to spank it Jump an Infinity Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CrazyL 0 #17 January 6, 2006 Ahhhh! Got it. 2 totally different jumps. Have fun! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
twibbles 0 #18 January 6, 2006 QuoteI don't KNOW this as a FACT, but just thinking about it for a sec. When you bring your arms back to grab PC, if you close your legs and try to stick your heals in your @ss would it counter the tendancy to go head low? Just a thought. I don't know Just my two cents here.. One thing i did in the wind tunnel was to fly with both arms back like i waas trying to reach pilot chutes at both sides of the container. You really have to bring your heels in to stay stop yourself smacking into the wall of the tunel, but i can do turns and slideslips just fine. still able to control my fall rate, but that's in the tunnel, ended doing a 360 turn in the bottom, foreward left of the tunnel then moving in a straight line to the top, rear right for another turn. Just in case i break both arms on exit my instructor said, i'll be able to fly with only my legs :) Eugene... "In the beginning the Universe was created. This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
