NEVER let the toggles up if you flare high!!!! (pics)

[Spenck 0]

Thanks as im sure i ll think of that just before flaring in the future.

"-flaring as the ground approaches "

This instinct is what caused my 2 early flares, just learing to trust my TA, i think im there (esp after seeing those pics).

Kate

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"The day you were born you were born free, that is your privilege"

[artistcalledian 0]

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trying to "get your feet under you" in freefall

i've experienced that once, on about my 10th jump....just as i did a solo dive out of the plane, i had a little kick with my legs and immediatly thought i should arch...which i did and got stable in about 3 or 4 seconds.

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drive it like you stole it and f*ck the police

[Kimblair13 0]

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-trying to "get your feet under you" in freefall
-flaring as the ground approaches

I don't get what's wrong with those two. Wouldn't you want yer feet under you while ffing. I'm almost pretty sure I flare as I approach the ground instead of when I hit it.

I must be missing something.

EDIT: OK, yeah I guess you prob wouldn't want yer feet under you if you were flying on yer belly, duh. Still don't get the flare thing though.

[mdrejhon 8]

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EDIT: OK, yeah I guess you prob wouldn't want yer feet under you if you were flying on yer belly, duh. Still don't get the flare thing though.

As a newbie here, let me remind you with my fresh memories as a student: The ground looks like it's approaching you, even while you're still 50 feet up!

As a deaf guy with NO radio as a student, I had to HAMMER it into my mind (about 100 times) about my flare timing. I had two tandems where I witnessed the start of a flare, and helped with the flare.

When I did my first solo... I went mentally like.
"dont flare...dont flare....dont flare....FLARE!!!!"

(Stood up my first landing. yay!)

[Bigwallmaster 0]

All of this is especially true when you throw in someone who already has some experience under his belt, has gotten lucky using bad techniques, and then one day it all comes full circle to bite you in the ass. . . .literally.

Case in point, I recently flared a little too high over the grass landing area at Perris on a hot day, canopy lost pressurization and I broke mah tailbone!! Granted things were made worse by the hot weather, however, if I had PLF'd perhaps the outcome would have been more favorable.

Billvon is right. . . . .break those bad habits once and for all from the get go.

[billvon 2,989]

>Still don't get the flare thing though.

Many students exit the plane knowing a few things about their canopy:

-Landing downwind is bad because you're going really fast; going really fast can lead to injury
-You flare to slow down the canopy before landing.

So they exit, deploy, and look down. And from 5000 feet the ground looks very far away, and very stationary. They release their brakes, do their checks, fly around and whatnot.

Then at about 200 feet they start to notice the ground's actually moving beneath them. At about 100 feet they notice it's starting to move - well - sorta _fast_. (Their speed hasn't changed, of course, but they are lower so they see it more clearly.) So they, almost unconsciously, do the one thing they know how to do to slow down - they start to flare. And unless someone stops them (like the guy on the radio) they will tend to flare a bit more, and a bit more, until they've used up most of their flare.

Listen to an instructor talking a student down, and almost invariably you'll hear "hands all the way up! Get those hands up! Three, two, one, flare!" That's because their hands started to creep down. It's unnatural to dive at something full speed and only try to stop at the last moment, but that actually works better for parachutes.

[Kimblair13 0]

Ok I knew you meant something other than what I was thinking when I read it.

[Jackpunx 0]

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>my natural insticnt is to bend mylegs and land on em.

Most natural instincts in skydiving are wrong. Until you get 'new' instincts, those old ones can really mess you up. Guard against them! Some that come to mind are:

-reaching out to 'break your fall'
-trying to "get your feet under you" in freefall
-reaching for grips
-reaching for the ground
-flaring as the ground approaches

All perfectly natural and understandable - but all wrong.

LMAO.. all those are absolutely right.. I have found myself in the "reaching for grips", and "break your fall" mode..
It was because of this board that I remember not to reach to break my fall.. It was on the slippery grass, first thing in the morning first jump.. I slid it in with both hands up.. Not sure how I rememberd it.. must have read it hear a bunch of times..
and the reaching for grips..
now that I have my license.. I have been jumping with LO's and other's .. the last time out.. I finally started to let my legs do more of the work...
cant wait to try it again..
even though I did it in AFF .. its different now .. its like learning it over again..

[lilchief 1]

During my SL training we were instructed to start the flare at rooftop altitude. The time we were supposed to use from starting to flare to be at the "sweetspot"(if it exist on a PD NAV 260/240/220) is the same amount of time it takes to say "FLARE". It helped me a lot.

But since I'm an norwegian, I'm hoping someone could enlighten me with the meaning of PLF?

"Once you have tasted flight, you will forever walk the earth with your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been and there you long to return." - Da Vinci
www.lilchief.no

[bob.dino 1]

PLF = Parachute Landing Fall.
Also known as PLR = Parachute Landing Roll.

How to land hard without hurting yourself. Similar to a judo roll.

[Andy9o8 2]

Aw, you ruined the joke.
I was gonna tell him it means "pretty little fjord."

[AFFI 0]

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Also known as PLR = Parachute Landing Roll.

I like that!

[Spenck 0]

BIllvon, i think you have it right on the mark. Like i said before, i did the early flare because i thought i was approaching the ground at a good speed and like you and others have said, first instinct (normally) is to slow down when you approach something with speed - so trust those who know what they're talking about, and if you hurt yourself, at least it was their fault hahaha jk

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"The day you were born you were born free, that is your privilege"

[Viking 0]

ok just got a call from Scott. He now has a grand total of (drumb roll) 9 screws, a Plate, and a rod. 7 screws and a plate in the fibula(small bone) and 2 screws and a rod in the tibia(big bone or shin bone)

I swear you must have footprints on the back of your helmet - chicagoskydiver
My God has a bigger dick than your god -George Carlin

[lilchief 1]

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Aw, you ruined the joke.
I was gonna tell him it means "pretty little fjord."

haha

Hope scott brings some papers to the airport security checkpoint, otherwise he might be there for a while

Hope you recover fast and continue jumping after recovery

"Once you have tasted flight, you will forever walk the earth with your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been and there you long to return." - Da Vinci
www.lilchief.no

[phoenixlpr 0]

I had somwthing similar: 4(5) screws and a plate in my fibula, 1 screw was removed along with the plaster.

[jurgencamps 0]

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PLF = Parachute Landing Fall.
Also known as PLR = Parachute Landing Roll.

PLF: Parachute Lands First?

[brianfry713 0]

http://www.uspa.org/publications/SIM/2006SIM/Section4CatA.htm#1e

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1. Parachutists absorb the shock of a hard landing with a parachute landing fall (PLF). (Click here for illustration.) http://www.uspa.org/publications/SIM/2006SIM/images/PLF2.pdf

a. To prepare for the landing, press your feet and knees together with your knees slightly bent and flexed to absorb the initial shock of the landing.

b. Flare the canopy with both hands together and close to the front of your body to help prevent wrist and hand injuries.

c. Chin to the chest to help prevent neck injuries.

d. Upon contact:

(1) Maintain the preparation position as much as possible throughout the ensuing landing roll.

(2) Lean into the direction of the landing to roll down one side of the body.

(3) Contact feet first, then--

(i) Lay over to the side of one calf.

(Ii) Continue to roll to the thigh on the same side.

(iii) Contact with that hip (side of the butt).

(iv) Roll diagonally across your back to the opposite shoulder.

(v) Throw your legs overhead, if necessary.

BASE 1224, Senior Parachute Rigger, CPL ASEL IA, AGI, IGI
USPA Coach & UPT Tandem Instructor, PRO, Altimaster Field Support Representative

[dharma1976 0]

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the very reason i posted up the pictures. I'm a visual learner and knew they would help some student out there.

Yeah, but it must be kinda cool to have your own x-ray collection Seeing them just makes me want to get my own. In the same way that a racing driver isn't a racing driver until hes rolled a car

Note: I am of course joking and do not want to injure myself or suggest anyone else does the same just to get a wicked x-ray collection

I have myself been thinking about putting the ones with the titanium in them onto a t shirt ;)

Yeah what he experienced is something that I call surge....

the canopy starts to slow down and if you let up on the toggles the g forces lessen and you basically have a bit of freefall going on...Brian German talked about this on skydive radio a bit ago, we swoopers do some degree use this principle when starting our turns...
but low to the ground, not so good.

here is a clicky to Brian's interview...buy his book too and start pulling high, it will teach you about your canopy....

http://www.skydiveradio.com/show_files/sr14_11_08_05.mp3

Good vibes and fast healing to your friend :)

Cheers

Dave

http://www.skyjunky.com

CSpenceFLY - I can't believe the number of people willing to bet their life on someone else doing the right thing.

[Casurf1978 0]

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-reaching out to 'break your fall'

On jump#51 that little reflex got me a broken right arm. Out for two months. I've never reached for the ground since and I'm ready to PLF every landing.


Hope your friend is doing ok Viking.

[sky-pimp 0]

This i've not heard of before , on coming in to land i began my flare but some how i had the cord from my colapsable slider in my hand with my toggle (still don't know how this happened)
as i flared my right hand would not come down i realized to late what had happened and took a tumble . felt a right tit . but its never happened since

YeHaaaaaaaaaaa

[dharma1976 0]

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PLF = Parachute Landing Fall.
Also known as PLR = Parachute Landing Roll.

How to land hard without hurting yourself. Similar to a judo roll.

and its much better thatn the alternative, the FPL

Face Plant Landing....

Dave

http://www.skyjunky.com

CSpenceFLY - I can't believe the number of people willing to bet their life on someone else doing the right thing.

[Viking 0]

holyshit dude that would be like dropping a toggle or the fingertrap coming undone in the middle of your flare!

I swear you must have footprints on the back of your helmet - chicagoskydiver
My God has a bigger dick than your god -George Carlin

[Viking 0]

ok i just uploaded the post-op xrays. You can see all the screws and stuff.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/redphoto/sets/1483170/

I swear you must have footprints on the back of your helmet - chicagoskydiver
My God has a bigger dick than your god -George Carlin

[Katzeye 0]

No photos of the landing?

I was taught that if I flared high it was ok to release to my HIPS, and reflare at the right time... But never, ever any higher. Did he totally release to above his shoulders?

Is a chicken omelette redundant?