Jackpunx 0 #1 December 9, 2005 Im on a 1:1 now .. how much difference is that to a 1.1: 1 if Im not typing it right.. a 190 to a 170? is it a huge difference? I felt a difference from 210 to 190 but not alot. I want to start a canopy class but wanted to get on a canopy that would be closer to what I'll stay on for a while. right now Im standing every landing Cross wind/no wind.. I can make flat turns and have been able to land pretty much where I want to except for a windy day.. I undershot a little.. My landings are all pattern landings.. nothing aggressive.. I know.. (talk to my instructor) just want to know your experience.. so far the place that I rent gear from and all the instructors have been paying pretty close attention and have had no problems droping my canopy size. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,991 #2 December 9, 2005 >if Im not typing it right. >a 190 to a 170? >is it a huge difference? It's a little different. Optimistically, at those loadings, it's the difference between a momentary planeout and a 5 foot planeout. Pessimistically it's the difference between a very hard landing and a broken pelvis. >My landings are all pattern landings.. nothing aggressive.. That's the statement that worries me! Be aggressive under the 190; really learn how to fly it - because you'll be scared of the 170 for a while and won't want to learn such things. Try a downwind landing (in light winds!) turns in the flare, double front approaches, turn-to-land approaches and rear riser landings. If you can pull all of those off, _and_ you're conservative on the 170 for a while, the odds of you doing well under the canopy are excellent. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
FFAddict 0 #3 December 9, 2005 I am certainly not an expert as you can see from my jump numbers so dont take my advice as gold, talk to your instructors... I also went down from a 210 to a 190 at about your level and although i noticed a big differnce in performance (mainly due to the type of canopy) i didnt feel it was any more difficult to fly safely. I have done a few jumps on a 170 (the same canopy as my 190) and it was a much bigger jump than from 210 to 190. There was a much more noticable differnce in the speed on landing and as such the potential risk, so i have decided that im not ready for it yet. Keep in mind that if you make a 20sqf downsize on a large canopy it will only be a small downsize percentage wise. But on a smaller canopy that 20sqft downsize will account for a much larger percentage of the canopy and as such will make a bigger differnce. With all that said i am loading my canopy much higher than you are (about 1.3) and have been since about jump 35. If you have reasonable canopy skills like i did at your level then having a loading of 1.1 or slightly higher is not a problem. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jackpunx 0 #4 December 9, 2005 Quote>if Im not typing it right. >a 190 to a 170? >is it a huge difference? It's a little different. Optimistically, at those loadings, it's the difference between a momentary planeout and a 5 foot planeout. Pessimistically it's the difference between a very hard landing and a broken pelvis. >My landings are all pattern landings.. nothing aggressive.. That's the statement that worries me! Be aggressive under the 190; really learn how to fly it - because you'll be scared of the 170 for a while and won't want to learn such things. Try a downwind landing (in light winds!) turns in the flare, double front approaches, turn-to-land approaches and rear riser landings. If you can pull all of those off, _and_ you're conservative on the 170 for a while, the odds of you doing well under the canopy are excellent. Im glad you replied.. this is the answer I was looking for.. what I want to learn is to be a little more aggresive.. when landing with more advanced flyers .. I dont want to congest the landing area.. but I have not been taught how to turn and land yet.. Dont want to sacrifice my legs trying to figure it out on my own.. Im not in a hurry and am really cool with the 190.. I was just putting it out there.. I have been jumping the pilot 188 and its a really poplular size and canopy.. I dont like the sabre 2 .. the motivation to my question was.. if the 188's were gone.. could I go to the smaller pilot. I would jump a 7 cell spectre before I jumped the sabre2 again.. it might be the way this one is set up..but i prefer the pilot Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dharma1976 0 #5 December 9, 2005 I will add my $0.02 do high pulls with a friend and fly around agressively from 13500 or if thats too much for you make it 9K or something :-) I found that nothing helped my canopy flying more that pulling high with my buddy matt and chassing each other around the sky... if you are uncomfortable ding it with one of your buddies, find a coach or someone at your dz and ask him if he would be interested in doing it... Cheers, fly aggressively safe and read brian germains book (god if I keep saying that people are going to start acusing me of being Brian Germain in sheeps clothing or something like they did for that matter guy ;)) Davehttp://www.skyjunky.com CSpenceFLY - I can't believe the number of people willing to bet their life on someone else doing the right thing. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skybytch 273 #6 December 9, 2005 Quotethe motivation to my question was.. if the 188's were gone.. could I go to the smaller pilot. What do the folks at Sq1 think about that? Have you done a canopy control course yet? If not, why not? I'd suggest doing that on a 190 (okay, 188) before considering going to a 170. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lisamariewillbe 1 #7 December 9, 2005 Ive got a few more then you and Im still loaded at a .725 because according to the downsize check list that was written I do not meet every qualification yet... I think Billvon wrote it... its very helpful maybe you should look at it and see if you can do all it says you should be able to do before you go putting your life on the line by downsizing again... theres a reason this website exsists first and foremost safety and there are alot of great articles for newbies like us...utilize themSudsy Fist: i don't think i'd ever say this Sudsy Fist: but you're looking damn sudsydoable in this Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jackpunx 0 #8 December 9, 2005 QuoteIve got a few more then you and Im still loaded at a .725 because according to the downsize check list that was written I do not meet every qualification yet... I think Billvon wrote it... its very helpful maybe you should look at it and see if you can do all it says you should be able to do before you go putting your life on the line by downsizing again... theres a reason this website exsists first and foremost safety and there are alot of great articles for newbies like us...utilize them Ive been able to do everything but the HP double riser landings and landing on a hill(we dont have any) I have not got any instruction on how to make those low maneuvers yet.. so I was not going to experiment them on my own.. Im enrolling in the canopy class out in Perris.. Im not in a rush at all to downsize as Im having a blast on the 188 now.. I was just curious about some of the differences. I have not felt the twitchy feelings that people have talked about as Im pretty comfortable on this canopy... the post was for information .. not permission to downsize..lol Im cool with the 188 and taking the classes before I go down anymore.. Thanks to all who replied Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
davelepka 4 #9 December 9, 2005 QuoteIm standing every landing Cross wind/no wind.. I can make flat turns and have been able to land pretty much where I want to except for a windy day.. I undershot a little.. This is all very good, but keep in mind your limited overall experience. Pay attention to any of the competition swoopers at Perris. When they train, they'll do 15 jumps per day (at least), thats half of your total experience. Don't get me wrong, it's great that your record looks good, and you're making solid progress, but keep in mind the low overall jump numbers when you look to your record for an idea of your skill level. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jackpunx 0 #10 December 9, 2005 QuoteQuoteIm standing every landing Cross wind/no wind.. I can make flat turns and have been able to land pretty much where I want to except for a windy day.. I undershot a little.. This is all very good, but keep in mind your limited overall experience. Pay attention to any of the competition swoopers at Perris. When they train, they'll do 15 jumps per day (at least), thats half of your total experience. Don't get me wrong, it's great that your record looks good, and you're making solid progress, but keep in mind the low overall jump numbers when you look to your record for an idea of your skill level. your absolutely right.. I know its 99% .. and its the 1% that I have to watch out for.. Im not going to get above my head.. Which means I'll stay on the 188 for now. Like I said .. Im having a blast and I like the way my legs work right now Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
