Failing a level sucks

[Monkeyb 0]

Does anyone else feel like a pathetic loser after not passing? I failed my level 2 today because I didn't extend my legs far enough. The exit went fine, I was stable the entire time, my test pulls went fine my 90 degree turns went fine, and my landing went fine... but my form wasn't there since I didn't extend my legs enough. The log entries show I did everything very well, so besides my leg problem I think I'm fine. It's my fourth jump and I'm still on level 2 :(

They recommended I do a wind tunnel before I jump again, but now I have another problem. As a student, I am limitted on money. The reception desk lady told me she'd let me retake the jump for $100 if I promise 100% to come in this week, but the offer is only good for 7 days. I don't have enough money to do a wind tunnel and the retake in one week, but if I fail again I'll feel like a complete idiot.

My question: Do I pass up the $100 retake deal and pay the full $180 when I have enough for the wind tunnel and the jump, or chance it with the $100 deal and hope I pass?

This is like a mixed venting/advice post, so any responses would be appreciated.

[small_Fry 0]

Don't ever feel like an idiot, I have almost 50 jumps and I can't land my canopy for nothing! I failed a jump once because I had come down on the plane, when I went up to do the actual jump later that day I was just so happy to be out of the plane I didn't do anything my instructor told me I just fell and enjoyed it. I can relate to the money part, I don't understand your leg problem? Where you trying to get to the jm and your legs weren't out enough? Remeber it's 99 percent mental, practice a lot on the ground get a feel for what your legs need to do and get up there and do it, if you don't pass again, then do the wind tunnel. Was this the first jump of the day? Never give up and never feel like an idiot, if anything I'm the queen of idiots then! Hang in there and good luck!!!

[MarkM 0]

I failed a crap load of my practice ripcord pulls when I did static line progression before making ever making freefall. So I know what it's like to fail a lot. When I started AFF I already had something like 17 jumps under my belt, and I have NO idea how anyone passes those early AFF levels without any prior jumping. There's just so much going on, lot's to process and deal with.

But I also did some wind tunnel training before doing AFF and it did really help me. A lot. I guess it comes down to how much wind tunnel training you're talking about. A decent amount will probably help you pass your later levels as well.

[Jib 0]

I failed level 3 twice, went to the tunnel, made a huge improvement and then went back to my old ways to fail level 4 once. (I had this habit of trying to do freestyle at pull time.) There's no shame in failing a level or 7. You're learning survival skills and no one expects you to be perfect out of the box.

Go to tunnel!!!!

--------------------------------------------------
the depth of his depravity sickens me.
-- Jerry Falwell, People v. Larry Flynt

[MarkM 0]

Quote

Remeber it's 99 percent mental, practice a lot on the ground get a feel for what your legs need to do and get up there and do it, if you don't pass again, then do the wind tunnel.

When I was blowing my practice ripcord pulls the only way I finally passed was by hitting a swimming pool and do 100 perfect practice pulls in the pool. That trained my body so even while stressed during the jump when I thought "pull" it just knew what to do without me going through the steps mentally.

[Amanda965 0]

Dont feel bad for not passing a level- you are experiencing something that is completely new to you, of course it isnt going to be perfect for everyone on the first try. Even the smallest things that are so easy to do on the ground are obvoiusly much more difficult in the air.

At my dz, we have 20 AFF levels, so basically you can have your A-license when you are done with the program. I failed "up and down" (hug the ball) twice! It was a relief to finally get done with that, but I was happy to have people that were encouraging and willing to teach me what they could so I could master the level.

Just be patient and perhaps look into using a credit card

Good Luck!!!

Blue skies and SAFE landings!
~Amanda~

[ripcords 0]

I would do the wind tunnel time. It will not only help you with this level, but also future levels. Especially if you can learn to totally control turns, which often leads to students failing AFF levels.

If your legs are bent too much you are going to backslide. In the tunnel you will become aware of that immediately (when you run into the wall).

I definitely think that you will get your biggest bang for your buck with some tunnel time.

P.S. - you are not a pathetic loser - you are a skydiver. Your perseverence will pay off. Don't get discouraged!

[dustin19d 0]

Where your JM's giving u the hand signal to extend your legs. I they where, did u ingore it. If they didnt but then failed you because your legs where to short then that would be there fault.

[dustin19d 0]

But dont get down. I failed the level where you do your first 90 deg turns(I was bending lateraly at the waist. I didnt mind much I just saw it as an opurtinity for another jump.

[ZoneRat 0]

When you say "they" recommended tunnel time... who is "they"? Your JM's?

Talk to them about it. Express your concerns. Make sure they understand the whole picture. It may have been a light recommendation. An idle thought. They may amend it if they have the whole picture.

I failed my check-out dive, btw... Hardly ANYONE fails their check out dive... I felt like a pathetic loser too... But I wasn't. And you're not either.
_______

Something to try:

Do you have a full length mirror at the house of some kind? If so. Practice your arch position in front of it. Do it several times an evening thru the week.

When you're watching TV, at a commercial or something, go lay down, arch, correct your self in the mirror. Hold it for several seconds. Relax, repeat.

When it seems like you've got it, try assuming the proper position with your eyes closed. Then open them and check your position out.

Don't lose faith. You'll get it.

Congrats on your stand up landings, btw! Pretty cool, that!

“There are more things in Heaven and Earth, Horatio, than are dreamt of in your philosophies.”

[PlayDough 0]

Don't sweat it at all dude... I failed lvl 3 b/c I mixed up my directions when they asked me to turn. I'd be prompted to turn right... i'd turn left. ect. ect.

On my first release dive... I was doing good until I started making knee turns un intentionally. I failed 2 lvl's... but I'm here still loving EVERY day I fly.

[Cajones 0]

Don't forget you failed to pull...

In order to pass level 2, you must have a "solo, unassisted deployment."

We can't let you go on to level 3, until you demonstrate the ability to save your own life.

Your body position is not an unusual situation. We cannot see our legs very well in freefall. "Legs out" is one of the most used signals on low-level AFF students.

Your awareness and response grew by leaps-and-bounds from level 1 to level 2. Don't be discouraged now... You have so much learning and fun stuff coming over the horizon.

- Cajones

The laws of physics are strictly enforced.

[hipgnosis 0]

Don't sweat it, I think I can safely say that *everyone* has had a problem with some aspect of skydiving at one point or another.

Others, like me, can confidentally say that they've had a problem with several aspects of skydiving at many points

You mention a wind tunnel. Can I assume that you are jumping out at Perris?


Hipgnosis

[skylord 1]

Quote

Don't forget you failed to pull...

In order to pass level 2, you must have a "solo, unassisted deployment."

We can't let you go on to level 3, until you demonstrate the ability to save your own life.

Your body position is not an unusual situation. We cannot see our legs very well in freefall. "Legs out" is one of the most used signals on low-level AFF students.

Your awareness and response grew by leaps-and-bounds from level 1 to level 2. Don't be discouraged now... You have so much learning and fun stuff coming over the horizon.

- Cajones

The Ed meister is correct. I repeated level two, and I am in the process of repeating level six. It is not a "failure", it is an opportunity to get comfortable in free fall. Relax, have fun, and always remember skydiving is not a money issue. Your instructors will not let you move up unless they are comfortable.

From my perspective, I feel AFF is a touch over aggresive in moving people on. I'm older than most student skydivers, but I think repeating levels is very, very healthy. My point of view.

You'll do great, skydiving is a blast, and all my best to you. "Legs Out" was the one sign I have gotten over and over again.

All my best to you, hang in there, and I'll jump someday with you!!

Bob

Bob Marks

"-when you leave the airplane its all wrong til it goes right, its a whole different mindset, this is why you have system redundancy." Mattaman

[Unstable 9]

Around here, those who don't fail at least one jump are pretty hard to come by --- I fail 2, one PRCP and one 30 second delay.....

=========Shaun ==========

[bluegremlin 0]

Id say dont worry about it 2 much, and youv got the chance of having $80 taken off your next jump. Just remember to have FUN. Iv had a few failurs where i knew that id failed before i got down but i always have fun.

[Pendragon 1]

Well, I must've had a record at my DZ in number of repeated levels - cannot remember off hand, but it was somthing like 6 attempts at level 4 and 4 attempts at level 5...

Just remember, everyone is different - I zipped through the subsequent levels after I'd got over my hurdle, only meeting another (little) one when trying to build my first 4-way.

Try to relax - and don't go into panic if something doesn't go right first time; keep to the plan and give it another go. I'd mentally walk through it before you go up - don't underestimate how important your state of mind is! Definitely don't fear failure: there is no such thing as a wasted jump, only more experience!

--
BASE #1182
Muff #3573
PFI #52; UK WSI #13

[kryos 0]

Quote

I failed level 3 twice, went to the tunnel, made a huge improvement and then went back to my old ways to fail level 4 once. (I had this habit of trying to do freestyle at pull time.) There's no shame in failing a level or 7. You're learning survival skills and no one expects you to be perfect out of the box.

Go to tunnel!!!!

Need I discuss how many levels I failed? :)

Skydiving training is a progression. Never forget that. Not everyone is a natural. Some of us are unluckier than others. On every jump, pass or fail, you learn something and that is the important thing. So, take your progression as it comes and no, you aer certainly not an idiot.

As for the money thing, if you really are strapped, perhaps you should consider saving up the money for training first, and then buying a "package deal" which includes wind tunnel training. On the other hand, if you can pull the money together to train now, then I would suggest you not worry about getting a reduced rate by jumping next week without taking advantage of the tunnel time. Do things in a logical sequence and you'll probably have more success than if you go back out there next week ... just to save $80 ... and wind up failing the level again and thereby blowing $100 bucks.

Hope this helps.

By the way, it took me 46 jumps to finish student progression ... and I'm far from an idiot.

Blue skies ...

--rita

[Nightingale 0]

personally, I'd redo the jump instead of going to the tunnel.

the jump, even if you fail again, counts towards your A, gets you canopy experience, and hey, since you know you have to PULL and extend your legs, you might pass. I'd suggest paying for video, so you can see exactly what you're doing. it really helps.

if you fail it again, definitely hit the tunnel, and bring someone with a vid camera.

[lowie 0]

Quote

Id say dont worry about it 2 much, and youv got the chance of having $80 taken off your next jump. Just remember to have FUN. Iv had a few failurs where i knew that id failed before i got down but i always have fun.

I failed stage 5 once. In 20 jumps or so you'll be stable,sorted doing solos and either holding the A license or well on the way and this will just be in the dim distant past.

[Monkeyb 0]

Hey ed :)

Good to see you chief! Don't take this post offensively, as I'm not disagreeing with you, I completely understand where you and Taz are coming from. It just felt bad seeing my friend Travis pass. He's itching to go back next week, and I have (what seems like) an offer I can't refuse.

Right now I'm just trying to figure out whether I should try it again without the wind tunnel experience, or pass up the $80 discount and take my time with it. Since you were my JM, I would appreciate your take on it. I really want to jump again and save those $80, but I would feel like a dope if I fail because I was unprepared. What do you think I should do?

By the way thanks for all the responses everyone, they are highly appreciated!

[Cajones 0]

Ara,

I started a PM, but I'll post my words on the forum, as I think others can benefit from what I'm saying...

Skydiving instruction is a dynamic science. It has changed much in the 11 years or so I've been teaching. The Instructors I know with 15 and 20 years under their belt can talk about the incredible changes our sport has seen and specifically the way we teach students.

One thing that has not changed is every student is unique.

We see similar problems with many different students. The application of corrective procedures is often much like a doctor. We start with the simple, known cures for most things based on the students symptoms. If that doesn't work - we rely on our insightfulness gained from countless hours spent instructing in freefall, in the airplane, in debriefs on the ground, and even at the bonfire with a beer (nowadays, even here behind a keyboard). This insight isn't divine, and often comes from observing other students and Instructors. That failing, we find ourselves talking to other Instructors for their input.

As a student, your Instructors are constantly analyzing you. Your particular problem is what I call a "bandwidth" problem. Sensory overload. We are having difficulty tuning your body position; most likely because you are jacked up on that stuff we crave - adrenaline and endorphines. Adrenaline has a few side effects. Among them: It makes you very, very strong. It also makes you rather clumsy. Dopamine (our favorite endorphine) also has some interesting influences. Not only does it make us "high" it also throws in a nice dose of tunnel-vision for most of us. This tunnel vision is amplified by our sensory overload - so much to think about in so little time!

There are two common fixes for this rather common situation. Make your body position automatic - this is where the tunnel comes in - or do more skydives. By doing more skydives, your anxiety levels a reduced, opening your awareness so that we can fix your body position. For years, the second option was the only tool we (Instructors) had. Even when tunnels were first developed they were inadequate and skydivers did not take them seriously as a learning aid.

One of life's little hard knocks is - "Money could fix this." I lost nearly every piece of skydiving gear in a fire, recently (with no insurance to pay for any of it) - "Money could fix this." You are having difficulty becoming a licensed skydiver - "Money could fix this." I know plenty of people who want to become great skydivers - "Money could fix this." It's not easy to prioritize our lives sometimes - especially with money. Part of my job is to give you the best instruction I can, and try to make it cost effective.

You are one of two students I recommended the tunnel to this past weekend. The other has already gone for a 10-minute session. I'll see if I can get you two in touch. She might be able to tell you how much she benefitted from her investment.

I'm giving a bit of extra background for everyone - not just aiming this at you Ara.

I hope the feeling you get from this is:

Your Instructors fit your learning environment to your particular needs. Seeking advice from other doctors and patients is fine - just don't assume their medicine is right for treating your symptoms.

- Cajones

The laws of physics are strictly enforced.

[HRHSkyPrincess 0]

First of all, you're not a loser of any sort. So stop beating yourself up! Now check for a pm from me...

*****************
Attitude is everything!

[taz9420 0]

I did every level except the last on an average of two to three times. My AFF cost a fortune. Hang in there. If want it bad enough you'll get it. Remember: RELAX, RELAX, RELAX.

[flyangel2 2]

Wow, Ed said some great stuff in his post.

My suggestion, since you live so close to a tunnel, get in it, even if it's just a ten minute session. Find someone to split the time with. I think in the long run it will safe you some money.

As for being a loser, your not. When I was learning how to skydive years ago, we had to learn on a S/L, doing 5 PRCP while on the static line before we could go on to a hop n' pop. I hold the record for the most S/Ls done in the state before going on to freefall. Hang in there, and if this was easy, we'd all be skygods

May your trails be crooked, winding, lonesome, dangerous, leading to the most amazing view. May your mountains rise into and above the clouds. - Edward Abbey