Balloon Jumps

[blackout 0]

So I did some searching and could not find much information on balloon jumps. I was just wondering what prep work if any and what requirements I needed to do a balloon jump in a non-DZ area. Thanks for your help as I have found a pilot willing to take me up on a regular basis.

[LongWayToFall 0]

The SIM is a good reference for info, especially the recommended jump numbers for different activities. You are going to need permission from the land owner of the area you intend to land. Be sure the balloon pilot knows what kind of altitude you need, they normally don't go very high. There are some FAA regs regarding notification prior to parachute jumps, depending on the airspace class, be sure you and the pilot are aware of these.

Have fun!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[tdog 0]

Besides for the FAA rules, I have learned this over the years of doing a lot of jumps:

1) The balloon pilot MUST understand the risks associated with losing the ballast of your weight. The balloon should be either holding altitude or descending rather quickly when you leave. If you leave in a twoway - it is especially important for the balloon to be aggressively descending. This is normally done by pulling a rope and the pilot approving your jump the moment he detects the decent he approves of.

If the balloon "shoots up" when you leave, due to not being in a decent and losing your weight suddenly, the air pressure hitting the top of the balloon skin will pancake it and push the hot air out of the bottom of the balloon, causing freefall of all involved. I was told it caused a fatality once, but I don't have the specific reports. Either way, a balloon pilot should understand the risks of dumping ballast. Even with this warning I have had novice balloon pilots complain they did not appreciate how fast they had to descend. Pretty much descend as quickly as they can safely and the second you leave either they will stop descending or perhaps climb again.

2) ALWAYS carry your cell phone and have the number of the balloon pilot, the balloon chase crew, and every other skydiver on the load. It is possible the balloon will be covering a lot of ground and you won't land near the other skydivers, and it is almost a promise you won't land near the balloon.

3) Landing areas - the balloon pilot will know where is legal, and where is "acceptable" for the balloon to land in their normal flying areas. Land there. Not on crops, not on government controlled open spaces, etc... Back roads, county roads, or even paths between crops are often great areas. I have met many landowners/residents and all have been nice when I thanked them and they saw I did not land on their crops.

[erdnarob 1]

A balloon jump is an interesting adventure. But because it's done at low altitude (3000 to 5000 ft) and because there is no relative wind, normally I would recommend a jumper to have 100 jumps and a B license. You may be OK at 80 but get the green light from an instructor or a person who is knowledgeable with balloon jump. I would say so for an helicopter jump.
Since there is no relative wind at exit, that could be quite disturbing since there is no air to grab on and get stable for 3-5 seconds. IMO this why the style set is important for a jumper, you can recover fast from any position.
If you do a ballon jump remember to exit head up because you will not be able to get flat for few seconds if you dive.

Learn from others mistakes, you will never live long enough to make them all.

[Sangi 0]

Balloon jumps are awesome!

I did only one, but it was fuckin intense.. So much better than the normal terminal exit from an aircraft.. Now I know how dead air exits feel and they are honestly the best shit ever.

I exited on my back, fell for about 3-4 seconds, flipped on my belly, tracked a bit and pulled (jump was from 1500m, pulled at ~1000m). Landing in somekind of farming field in between some electricity wires, but there was plenty enough space, got picked up by the balloon crew with a car almost instantly no probs.

Have fun, I know you will!

"Dream as you'll live forever, live as you'll die today." James Dean

[bluetwo 0]

Nice shot Sangi, it was worth it to read the whole thread just to get to that!!

Actually it was good to read all the other info too. I'm so ready to try a balloon jump first chance I get (ensuring I meet the requirements too).

_______________________________________

[likestojump 3]

They are lots of fun.

[apogee77 0]

I agree with tdog. Also, for average size balloons (4-6 passengers), our local pilots usually decend at 200 ft/min per jumper getting out.

Have fun!

[BigMark 1]

Balloons jumps rock, my first one was out of a two man balloon, me being 260 with gear. We went into terminal fall rate of the balloon and when I got out he went up like a champagne cork in a spiral, his ride was way more exciting than mine.

As close to a base jump as you can get, actually feeling yourself going from dead air to free fall speed is SUCH a rush!

The only danger is you normally don't know where you will land because you never know where you will be when the balloon gets to altitude, no wind socks, no power line knowledge, take the power poles and connect the dots before final...

[AHoyThere 0]

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They are lots of fun.

Those straps look scary if someones foot slipped down into one.

You can see in one of these pics (1205), a set of steps that we built. We've made a better set (version 2) since then. Upper step for the jumper(s), bottom step for the cameraman.

Our balloon pilots always file a NOTAM for jumping. Usually they will give a 5 or 10 mile radius from our launch point. Sometimes they will carry a hand held aviation radio and communicate with the approach controller of the nearby Class C airspace. One time we launched and flew right over the top of it. That was kind of cool.

All the balloon jumps that I've made have been either as cameraman or taking a tandem. I think there has only been one that was just for fun. (Okay, they're all fun.)

Camera jumps are freaky because you're focused on the subject. And you can't see the ground. And when you leave with no-wind, the wind noise slowly gets louder, and Louder, and LOUDER, and you know the ground is behind you. And you know that you exited from a lower than normal altitude.

And even though you know your buddy isn't going to take you too low and you know you've got an audible, it is still just about the most exciting (unnerving) jump a person can make knowing that ground is down there when focusing on the subject and listening to the speed increase.

God I love balloon jumps!

[danchapman 0]

I did several balloon drops with a hang glider tied below a balloon, back in the early 70's. We established a descent first, so the glider had some lift, and did not have any problems- except the Cessna circling with a camera man hanging out.

[377 22]

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They are lots of fun.

They sure are. Did mine at WFFC in Quincy. A fleet of balloons launched in the early evening and we started the adventure in almost no wind.

The exit is unlike anything else (except perhaps BASE which I've never done), even different from a hovering helo. You will feel like you are in an elevator that just had the cable break. One memorable thing that happened on that balloon jump was that we got buzzed by some freefalling jumpers at about 4000 ft. You could hear the LOUD roar of their approach. They went past us not very far away and one was screaming something. You could hear the Doppler shift in the voice!

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[JamMasterJay 0]

Quote

So I did some searching and could not find much information on balloon jumps. I was just wondering what prep work if any and what requirements I needed to do a balloon jump in a non-DZ area. Thanks for your help as I have found a pilot willing to take me up on a regular basis.

Balloon jumps suck...you wouldn't like them!

Truth is the distilled meaning of facts, for any truth refuted by a fact becomes a fallacy.

[sinjin 0]

hey man, u still in arkansas ? glad yur still alive

dont let life pass you by

[virgin-burner 1]

just wait until you get the chance to be the only jumper on a load of whuffos, with not sooo many jumps; that's where the REAL fun begins!

“Some may never live, but the crazy never die.”
-Hunter S. Thompson
"No. Try not. Do... or do not. There is no try."
-Yoda

[JamMasterJay 0]

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hey man, u still in arkansas ? glad yur still alive

what's up dude? yep, still in arkansas and still alive. i'm trying to leave here but having a hard time getting out. i'll keep you posted but may end up just a few hours from your stomping grounds!

Truth is the distilled meaning of facts, for any truth refuted by a fact becomes a fallacy.

[SRI85 0]

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Besides for the FAA rules, I have learned this over the years of doing a lot of jumps:

1) The balloon pilot MUST understand the risks associated with losing the ballast of your weight. The balloon should be either holding altitude or descending rather quickly when you leave. If you leave in a twoway - it is especially important for the balloon to be aggressively descending. This is normally done by pulling a rope and the pilot approving your jump the moment he detects the decent he approves of.

If the balloon "shoots up" when you leave, due to not being in a decent and losing your weight suddenly, the air pressure hitting the top of the balloon skin will pancake it and push the hot air out of the bottom of the balloon, causing freefall of all involved. I was told it caused a fatality once, but I don't have the specific reports. Either way, a balloon pilot should understand the risks of dumping ballast. Even with this warning I have had novice balloon pilots complain they did not appreciate how fast they had to descend. Pretty much descend as quickly as they can safely and the second you leave either they will stop descending or perhaps climb again.

2) ALWAYS carry your cell phone and have the number of the balloon pilot, the balloon chase crew, and every other skydiver on the load. It is possible the balloon will be covering a lot of ground and you won't land near the other skydivers, and it is almost a promise you won't land near the balloon.

3) Landing areas - the balloon pilot will know where is legal, and where is "acceptable" for the balloon to land in their normal flying areas. Land there. Not on crops, not on government controlled open spaces, etc... Back roads, county roads, or even paths between crops are often great areas. I have met many landowners/residents and all have been nice when I thanked them and they saw I did not land on their crops.

Balloon i jumped out of today was @ 4000 when the first 3 way when out, 5000, when i exited shortly after....so what your saying has me confused.

[crotalus01 0]

The balloon has to be descending to compensate for the loss of ballast (the jumpers). If the balloon is not descending when the jumpers leave it will shoot up so fast that it can force all of the hot air out of the balloon and cause it to crash.

As for me and my house, we will serve the LORD...

[Sangi 0]

I dunno, when I jumped the pilot just waited for the balloon air to cool off so it would stop gaining altitude and stay in one place (not descend) and then he would allow us to jump..

"Dream as you'll live forever, live as you'll die today." James Dean

[tdog 0]

So you said your balloon was at 4,000 feet when a three way left, and shortly (I interpret that to be 45 seconds) after the balloon was at 5,000 feet.

You had thus 1333 feet per minute (or more) of climb.

I don't know anything about the balloon you jumped out of, and I honestly know little about balloons in general, but I know that is a extremely high rate of climb for a balloon. That is over 15 MPH.

The balloon envelope was shooting up at 15 MPH. Assuming the air around you was not rising or falling due to weather, 15 MPH of air resistance was pushing against the top of the balloon as the balloon moved thru the air around it.

The balloon has a hole on the bottom of the balloon for the burner. So the only thing that keeps the balloon inflated is the hot air rising inside the balloon and the resistance of pushing a lot of air out of the relatively small hole on the bottom.

There is a point where a balloon will be flattened like a pancake when the air pressure pushing against the top of the envelope from the outside is greater than the pressure inside created from the warm air wanting to rise.

I could not find "maximum rate of climb" on any of the manufacturer's websites, but I found that your balloon came real close to some award winning rates of climbs in competitions for competition balloons... If the "short time after" was 30 seconds, you broke those records. if the short time after was a minute or more than you were far from those records... It all depends on what "short time after" was.

I have to assume (and hope) your balloon pilot was an expert and flew his balloon within the limits. He should have rate of climb instrumentation to know this...

I do know this - The 5 person balloons I have jumped out of, the pilots sometimes don't let more than one person jump at a time, often two are allowed, but they don't want 3 ways... That is 3/5ths of their weight suddenly leaving, something that takes skill to fly and is risky to the balloon as if the balloon was in equilibrium before the group left, it suddenly has way too much lift energy for the new mass it has to lift. The larger balloons pilots, flying the 10+ capacity balloons, they don't seem to care at all about group sizes of 3 because 3/10ths of their weight leaving is much different than 3/5ths.

So I ask this, did the pilot have the balloon in a very fast decent before the 3 way left? Was he actively flying the balloon and giving commands? If not, perhaps you want to talk to him about the limitations of his balloon to see if you need to adjust your plans for the next jump?

[SRI85 0]

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So you said your balloon was at 4,000 feet when a three way left, and shortly (I interpret that to be 45 seconds) after the balloon was at 5,000 feet.

You had thus 1333 feet per minute (or more) of climb.

I don't know anything about the balloon you jumped out of, and I honestly know little about balloons in general, but I know that is a extremely high rate of climb for a balloon. That is over 15 MPH.

The balloon envelope was shooting up at 15 MPH. Assuming the air around you was not rising or falling due to weather, 15 MPH of air resistance was pushing against the top of the balloon as the balloon moved thru the air around it.

The balloon has a hole on the bottom of the balloon for the burner. So the only thing that keeps the balloon inflated is the hot air rising inside the balloon and the resistance of pushing a lot of air out of the relatively small hole on the bottom.

There is a point where a balloon will be flattened like a pancake when the air pressure pushing against the top of the envelope from the outside is greater than the pressure inside created from the warm air wanting to rise.

I could not find "maximum rate of climb" on any of the manufacturer's websites, but I found that your balloon came real close to some award winning rates of climbs in competitions for competition balloons... If the "short time after" was 30 seconds, you broke those records. if the short time after was a minute or more than you were far from those records... It all depends on what "short time after" was.

I have to assume (and hope) your balloon pilot was an expert and flew his balloon within the limits. He should have rate of climb instrumentation to know this...

I do know this - The 5 person balloons I have jumped out of, the pilots sometimes don't let more than one person jump at a time, often two are allowed, but they don't want 3 ways... That is 3/5ths of their weight suddenly leaving, something that takes skill to fly and is risky to the balloon as if the balloon was in equilibrium before the group left, it suddenly has way too much lift energy for the new mass it has to lift. The larger balloons pilots, flying the 10+ capacity balloons, they don't seem to care at all about group sizes of 3 because 3/10ths of their weight leaving is much different than 3/5ths.

So I ask this, did the pilot have the balloon in a very fast decent before the 3 way left? Was he actively flying the balloon and giving commands? If not, perhaps you want to talk to him about the limitations of his balloon to see if you need to adjust your plans for the next jump?

we were not decsending when the 3 way left. if anything we were ascending. there was a total of 10 people on board, very tight fit( 6 jumpers). the balloon stayed very steady after the 3 way left. The pilot has been putting jumpers out for a while now.

the balloon climbed pretty quick, we were at 4000 ft in less then 4 minutes.

[SRI85 0]

also where did you get your info on this pancaking deal? is it regards to a type of balloon?

[turtlespeed 220]

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I could not find "maximum rate of climb" on any of the manufacturer's websites, but I found that your balloon came real close to some award winning rates of climbs in competitions for competition balloons... ?

I found that 9.6M/Sec was the best

that equals out to about 1825 Ft/Min

1333 is not unreasonable.

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[tdog 0]

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also where did you get your info on this pancaking deal? is it regards to a type of balloon?

Gas vs hot air balloon? Shape? Design?

I downloaded the FAA approved flight manuals for a few different manufactures of hot air balloons, and 500-1000 feet per minute are common limits published by the manufactures in the flight manual the FAA certified pilots must adhere to... Here is one snippet:

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The maximum rate of climb and descent for all natural shaped envelopes is 5 m/s (1000 ft/min), with
the exception of envelopes larger than 12,000 m³ (424,000 cu.ft.) when the maximum climb and
descent rate is limited to 4 m/s (800 ft/min).

The FAA written test for pilots identifies the risk of climbing too quickly is the deflation vents on the top of the balloon being pushed open and venting the balloon.

[SRI85 0]

Quote

Quote

also where did you get your info on this pancaking deal? is it regards to a type of balloon?

Gas vs hot air balloon? Shape? Design?

I downloaded the FAA approved flight manuals for a few different manufactures of hot air balloons, and 500-1000 feet per minute are common limits published by the manufactures in the flight manual the FAA certified pilots must adhere to... Here is one snippet:

Quote

The maximum rate of climb and descent for all natural shaped envelopes is 5 m/s (1000 ft/min), with
the exception of envelopes larger than 12,000 m³ (424,000 cu.ft.) when the maximum climb and
descent rate is limited to 4 m/s (800 ft/min).

The FAA written test for pilots identifies the risk of climbing too quickly is the deflation vents on the top of the balloon being pushed open and venting the balloon.

would temperature have any effect on this, for example jumping on a 30 degree day vs a 80 degree day.