Is belly flying still viable?

[NWFlyer 2]

Quote

B license

Is that a requirement in Canada? Not so in the U.S. - you can do RW before you even have your A license as long as you're doing it with coaches/D license holders.

"There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke

[pchapman 279]

Quote

Quote

B license

Is that a requirement in Canada? Not so in the U.S. -

(Yeah, that is a big US / Canada difference. With an 'A' up here, it isn't anything goes for RW. If not with instructors or coaches, formation jumping is limited to one other person only, who has a B, 100+ jumps, and approval from a Coach 2. Now of course in practice it doesn't always work that way, but basically it means you don't get newbies getting together for a 4 way or joining on a 10 way.)

[AliMac 0]

I jump at The Ranch pretty regularly and I only fly on my belly, ask manifest to point me (Ali) out to you and I'll belly fly with you! I only have 80 jumps but I'll jump with anyone who wants to have some fun. I tried free flying for a few jumps and decided I wasn't ready and that I quite enjoy belly flying. I'd be happy to fly with you.

[jsaxton 0]

Quote

Geez, you could throw a rock and hit a belly flyer at my dz (DeLand). Throw 2 rocks and you'll hit a POPS member.

In a couple of weeks you'll hit 130 of them

[erdnarob 1]

In Canada if you follow the CSPA basic safety regulations and recommendations, you need to have a B license to do FS. When having an A license you can do two way FS with at least a B license holder having 100 jumps or more with the permission of the DZO.

Learn from others mistakes, you will never live long enough to make them all.

[Sangi 0]

Belly is lame

"Dream as you'll live forever, live as you'll die today." James Dean

[Airviking 0]

Quote

I jump at The Ranch pretty regularly and I only fly on my belly, ask manifest to point me (Ali) out to you and I'll belly fly with you! I only have 80 jumps but I'll jump with anyone who wants to have some fun. I tried free flying for a few jumps and decided I wasn't ready and that I quite enjoy belly flying. I'd be happy to fly with you.

Awesome! Bet on it.

BTW, I've been trying to get on The Ranch bulletin board. I've been bugging the admin for a month for posting rights, but to no avail.

I believe you have my stapler.

[mjosparky 4]

Quote

Those big ways look scary to me !

They are scary, why else would you do them?

Sparky

http://i397.photobucket.com/albums/pp55/mjosparky/Skydiving/POPs110way.jpg

My idea of a fair fight is clubbing baby seals

[jonstark 8]

Quote

Any thoughts?

There are a few things woefully missing nowadays...

Laying on your back with a group of friends looking up to spot the jump-run and watch the progress of another group of friends on their dive.

Packing parachutes out on the grass en masse.

Regrouping for a good debrief.

jon

[wmw999 2,460]

The first is at least partly because of the lack of the second. If you're indoors in the airconditioned packing you're not out looking at the next load.

While that was fun, in Houston, airconditioned packing is da bomb

Wendy P.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[Andy9o8 2]

Quote

There are a few things woefully missing nowadays...

Laying on your back with a group of friends looking up to spot the jump-run and watch the progress of another group of friends on their dive.

Packing parachutes out on the grass en masse.

Regrouping for a good debrief.

The chick in cut-off shorts and a tube top holding tension while you pack.

[wmw999 2,460]

That was me, holding tension for myself . I got really good at it.

Wendy P.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[hookitt 1]

Quote

I am C-16486 and I am still here

It is still RW in my book, I use my whole body not just my "Belly"

"Belly" is meant to be an insult by asshat punks

Fuck you asshat punks!

Seriously If my belly flying friends thought that way, I'd be ribbing them pretty hard just to get a rise out of them.

There are plenty of belly flyers at the dropzone I jump at the most. There are plenty of vertical flyers as well. The Vertical flyers do both vertical and belly flying. We often incorporate belly points into vertical sequentials.

I fly mostly vertical, but then again, I'm an asshat punk just trying to figure out how to fly.

My grammar sometimes resembles that of magnetic refrigerator poetry... Ghetto

[pinkfairy 0]

Quote

Perris Valley which probably is one of the more active DZs in the US has a huge RW scene. Those big ways look scary to me !

No, no, they are PERFECTLY safe.

No, seriously, they are a lot of fun, and the visuals of a big dive is pretty amazing. You don't really get the real picture of what they look like if you've only see them on video, they are way cooler in 3D.

And they aren't that scary really: There is a plan, and if everyone follows it and keep heads up and attentive, it is pretty safe. Good bigway breakoffs and canopy traffic is as beautiful as the completion, IMHO.

But Perris is a great place to do RW. Both in big and small groups. There's organizing, and both local and visiting jumpers to jump with. I go there and don't even take out my freefly suit.

Relax, you can die if you mess up, but it will probably not be by bullet.

I'm a BIG, TOUGH BIGWAY FORMATION SKYDIVER! What are you?

[Airviking 0]

Quote

Quote

Perris Valley which probably is one of the more active DZs in the US has a huge RW scene. Those big ways look scary to me !

No, no, they are PERFECTLY safe.

No, seriously, they are a lot of fun, and the visuals of a big dive is pretty amazing. You don't really get the real picture of what they look like if you've only see them on video, they are way cooler in 3D.

And they aren't that scary really: There is a plan, and if everyone follows it and keep heads up and attentive, it is pretty safe. Good bigway breakoffs and canopy traffic is as beautiful as the completion, IMHO.

But Perris is a great place to do RW. Both in big and small groups. There's organizing, and both local and visiting jumpers to jump with. I go there and don't even take out my freefly suit.

Yeah, the "bigway meet" thing has evolved during my layoff. When I got out, I think the record was 100 or 120. Also, to get an invitation, you had to have logged a huge amount of jumps, which I don't have. But my favorite memories were from 16+ formation dives, so maybe I should set as a goal to complete some bigway dives.

What does it take nowadays to participate in bigways?

I believe you have my stapler.

[skyrider 0]

Quote

Quote

Quote

Perris Valley which probably is one of the more active DZs in the US has a huge RW scene. Those big ways look scary to me !

No, no, they are PERFECTLY safe.

No, seriously, they are a lot of fun, and the visuals of a big dive is pretty amazing. You don't really get the real picture of what they look like if you've only see them on video, they are way cooler in 3D.

And they aren't that scary really: There is a plan, and if everyone follows it and keep heads up and attentive, it is pretty safe. Good bigway breakoffs and canopy traffic is as beautiful as the completion, IMHO.

But Perris is a great place to do RW. Both in big and small groups. There's organizing, and both local and visiting jumpers to jump with. I go there and don't even take out my freefly suit.

Yeah, the "bigway meet" thing has evolved during my layoff. When I got out, I think the record was 100 or 120. Also, to get an invitation, you had to have logged a huge amount of jumps, which I don't have. But my favorite memories were from 16+ formation dives, so maybe I should set as a goal to complete some bigway dives.

What does it take nowadays to participate in bigways?

Practice Practice Practice, and attend one of the many biigway camps held at Perris, Eloy, or Deland, usually run by Kate Cooper , Dan BC, Tony Deminico, and a few others, (contact square one, or Dan BC at Perris for dates and locations, would be my best suggestion) I think The Ranch holds a few camps also!

But get out , get known,and prove yourself safe, the invites will come...

[skyrider 0]

Also, (I forgot) Perris holds "Biggishway" camps about every other week, (if not more) Organised by a couple of locals that are some of the nicest low presure jumpers you'll ever meet...(Mark and Daryl)

Also look for anyone wearing an "Airtrash" hat!

[davelepka 4]

Quote

What does it take nowadays to participate in bigways?

About 290 jumps, you're almost there.

No, really though, you're not too far off. If you put in 50 jumps to get current and back in the swing of things, and attended a big way camp at Perris, you could find yourself on a 100 way pretty easily.

There are different types of big way camps, some are just big way meets, but others are actual training camps for doing big ways where you learn the specific skills needed for bigger ways, and practice them on 'smaller' jumps like 20 or 40 ways.

In tersm of belly flying being 'dead' it's not now, and never going to be, at least as long as belly is the 'deployment' position. For that reason, every jumper starts off belly flying, and every instructor needs to be a top notch belly flyer.

Freeflying is cool for sure, but also not for everyone. For starters, it takes more time or more money to learn over belly flying. You come out of AFF with the skills to do a 4-way RW jump, and if you do about 10 of them you can start adding jumpers to that number. By the time you have 50 jumps, you could expect to turn several points on a 4, 5, or 6 way, no problem. There's alot of satisfaction in planning a jump, and executing the plan.

Freeflying, on the other hand, is a little different. You come out of AFF with little no experience in freeflying. Due to the higher airspeeds, and related higher speeds of impact with another jumper, you need to be 'in control' before jumping with others, meaning that you can hold a sit fly or head down for the entire jump, and maintain a steady speed and heading. This can take anywhere from 5 to 25 solos to accomplish. Less if you pay extra for a coach to jump with you, more if you go at it solo. Beyond that, even when you are 'safe' to jump with others, you're still a ways off from taking docks, and being able to 'plan the dive and dive the plan'.

There will always be belyl flyers to jump with. Sometimes it might be a fresh A licesne graduate, and you have to limit it to a simple 2 or 3 way, but those jumps can sometimes be the most challenging and rewarding. You have to work hard to stay with the new guy, and they have to work hard not to shit their pants (not literally, but you get the idea).

[wmw999 2,460]

Quote

Sometimes it might be a fresh A licesne graduate, and you have to limit it to a simple 2 or 3 way, but those jumps can sometimes be the most challenging and rewarding

I love those jumps. When the newbie can end the jump with awareness of what they did, what they learned, and the jump accomplished a couple of realistic goals: now that's a great jump.

Wendy P.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[Andrewwhyte 1]

It sounds to me you need to jump with those juniors who only know how to jump on their belly and teach them how cool belly really is. Who knows some of them may turn into senior belly flyers.

[Airviking 0]

Thank God, nobody has yet figured out how to stuff a 30-way into a friggin wind tunnel...

I believe you have my stapler.

[mjosparky 4]

Quote

What does it take nowadays to participate in bigways?

Money, lots of money! The upcoming Texas state record, 160, will cost $53 a jump. And if I remember right the recent 200 ways at Eloy were about $70+ per jump. Of course that includes a plane ride with each jump.

Sparky

My idea of a fair fight is clubbing baby seals

[pinkfairy 0]

Quote

What does it take nowadays to participate in bigways?

These people put the 100-way in your logbook:

http://www.p3skydiving.com/info_BWC.php

But to get started with jumping first: get warmed up in smaller jumps before you go do bigways. Just so you know you can consistently get out of a plane stable, track properly and control your canopy.

I really, really recommend going to the tunnel to learn true no momentum docks, efficient, in place slowfall, and turns that doesn't make you sink through.

Tracking is really, really important too, and this can only be practiced in the air. See what your track looks like compared to others: do you outtrack everyone, or do you go straight down? If your tracking is no good I recommend having someone coach you, this could be done on the ground, there are often just small adjustments that are required to turn a lousy track into a good one. Often you just need some tips on how to do it, and you'll work it out. A lot of people can get into a 100-way, but they can't get out safely, so they won't get invited.

As someone mentioned here: Bigways costs money. They also costs commitment and time. There is a thread in the RW forum about how the P3 makes bigway too expensive, that the price per jump on the TSR is too high, but what I mentioned above is not controlled by that: Tunnel, 50 jumps so you get current again and coaching is going to be expensive no matter what, and is something you'd want to do if you wanted to get serious and competitive in any discipline.

It really takes a lot to get cut from P3s 100-ways, but I have seen it happen, and the only reason was lack of currency.

I have 44 100+ ways this year, with one completion. It gets expensive with all the travelling and all my vacation days are used on this, but it's so worth it. I can't imagine why anyone would use their time and money on anything else.

Maybe I'll see you, then, Lars, on a big jump.

If you live in Europe, check out bigways.eu. Great annual event that includes 100-ways, and intermediate and beginner's camps.

Relax, you can die if you mess up, but it will probably not be by bullet.

I'm a BIG, TOUGH BIGWAY FORMATION SKYDIVER! What are you?

[david3 0]

Quote

Yeah, the "bigway meet" thing has evolved during my layoff. When I got out, I think the record was 100 or 120. Also, to get an invitation, you had to have logged a huge amount of jumps, which I don't have. But my favorite memories were from 16+ formation dives, so maybe I should set as a goal to complete some bigway dives.

What does it take nowadays to participate in bigways?

I believe Guy Wright runs bigway camps still.

http://guywright.com/guywright/Home.html


Shawanga
Fly baby Fly

[jakee 1,500]

Quote

I can't imagine why anyone would use their time and money on anything else.

Yeah, it's just so action packed!

You go to one place, you stay in one place, you go back out again...

Do you want to have an ideagasm?