Injured skydiver saved in mid-air by fellow jumper

[jman83 0]

http://msn.foxsports.com/other/story/Skydiver-saved-in-mid-air-by-fellow-jumper-042010

I would love to see more information on this incident. With only one arm broken, it would seem that the jumper would have been able to pull the reserve themselves. A lot of variables to consider if I would prefer someone pulling my main for me, or letting me go to the reserve.

[c10edges 0]

It clearly says "a" broken arm and doesnt mention the person being unconscious. Wonder what happened?

o... and "gust of wind" is my new favorite media term for skydiving.

[ants337 0]

"could not pull her parachute ripcord at 14,000" bit high for a hop'n'pop

[JohnRich 4]

She's got a thousand jumps and couldn't pull her reserve with her other hand?

[christelsabine 1]

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She's got a thousand jumps and couldn't pull her reserve with her other hand?

Not that quick, Mr. Rich. Closer details surely will follow.

As per local information, her shoulder was badly injured at exit and one arm broken. Who said it was same side?

dudeist skydiver # 3105

[virgin-burner 1]

dont you know he knows everything better? how stupid are you!?

“Some may never live, but the crazy never die.”
-Hunter S. Thompson
"No. Try not. Do... or do not. There is no try."
-Yoda

[JohnRich 4]

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Not that quick, Mr. Rich. Closer details surely will follow. As per local information, her shoulder was badly injured at exit and one arm broken. Who said it was same side?

From the news story:

"She hurt her shoulder so badly that she could not use her arm to pull the release cord on her parachute...

Wagner is now being treated in hospital for a broken arm and injuries to both legs.

It also doesn't say when the broken arm was received, whether on exit or on landing. So, I was simply asking the question to try and get clarification on the facts. If you know something more, fill us in.

[JohnRich 4]

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dont you know he knows everything better? how stupid are you!?

Thank you for that drive-by behind-the-back personal insult. That adds a lot to this discussion.

[happythoughts 0]

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The female skydiver who jumped simultaneously from the doorway saw what had happened and jumped after her

I am trying to figure out where the "sudden gust of wind" came from. On jump run?

When people are exiting two, or three, across in
the Otter door, I always mention that the people on
the front-side should dive straight out.

If they try to "cut the corner", the front people may
push the people on the tail-side into the door frame.
I have seen many shoulder injuries from this.

People in the front edge of the door get hit by the wind
first and it pushes them back into the others during exit.

[ibx 2]

This was an An-28 which has a tailgate.

[feuergnom 29]

copied from the german forum

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Kurzform:

- 4er Exit
- linken OArm gebrochen (wie genau ist unklar, gibt auch das Video nicht her)
- Formation wird aufgelöst
- links liegender Mitspringer erkennt das Problem und wechselt auf die Pullseite und öffnet den Hauptschirm
- Aufgrund der eingeschränkten Steuermöglichkeit landet sie 200 m neben dem Platz
- keine weiteren Verletzungen
- ihr geht es bestens, Arm ist bereits ,,repariert,,

soweit zum tatsächlichen Hergang
der schneller als der Rettungswagen anwesende Bildreporter (tja warum wohl?) war etwas ,,angepisst,, über die Stellungnahmen vor Ort und bastelte (wie erwartet) seine eigene Geschichte (nun ja jeder blamiert sich so gut er kann, aber bei Bild erwartet man eigentlich auch nichts anderes)

- nach unserer Meinung begann der Unsinn im Prinzip mit dem Anruf über die Notrufnummer, beim weitergeben der Zentralen Leitstelle an den Rettungswagen wird vermutlich eine Formulierung wie ,,Fallschirmspringer am Flugplatz abgestürzt o. ä. ,, verwendet worden sein, den Rest kann man sich dann selbst ausmalen

linked 4 way exit
how the jumper rboke her arm is still unclear - even with video-analysis
jumper on her left side realised what was wrong an pulled for her
as she was not able to controll the canopy fully jumper landes off dz like 200 meters without further injury
arm is in plaster and will heal well

as usual the papers made up a story of their own....

The universal aptitude for ineptitude makes any human accomplishment an incredible miracle

dudeist skydiver # 666

[timmyfitz 0]

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dont you know he knows everything better? how stupid are you!?

He knows a lot more than you know. How stupid are you!?

[riggerrob 643]

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dont you know he knows everything better? how stupid are you!?

He knows a lot more than you know. How stupid are you!?

.......................................................................

Please stop wasting bandwidth with this childish type of personal insults.

[Andy9o8 2]

Looking at the linked article, it seems like a classic Lamppost injury. Don't see many of those any more.

[captain1976 0]

Being a recipient of a useless limb (dislocated right shoulder upon hitting the tail of an Otter), I would have preferred the main if I could have reached the handle.

Worked out that I could only pull the reserve and I would rather have rode the main down since I was only able to do riser turns and flaring the canopy wasn't an option.

If someone did pull my main and it malfunctioned, I could always reach both the cutaway and silver.

You live more in the few minutes of skydiving than many people live in their lifetime

[Fallosophy 0]

lol @ "clever maneuvers," . That will be my flight plan every time

[ryoder 1,590]

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Worked out that I could only pull the reserve and I would rather have rode the main down since I was only able to do riser turns and flaring the canopy wasn't an option.

I was on an 8-way dive once where the four in the base did a linked exit, and I was fifth.
The woman in front of me on the exit got her right shoulder dislocated on the exit.
She managed to break the grips and dump her reserve before we even realized she was in trouble.
On landing, she was steering with just the left toggle.
She came in downwind, made a 90 turn to avoid overshooting the landing area, then landed crosswind w/o a flare, breaking her femur.

"There are only three things of value: younger women, faster airplanes, and bigger crocodiles" - Arthur Jones.

[happythoughts 0]

In the interests of prevention, Is there any more
information on how this happened to her arm?

Collision with the a/c ? Caught the floor edge or side on exit ? Piece-launch gone bad ?

Also, has anyone grabbed a toggle with their good arm,
then reached over for the other one and steered with two
toggles in one hand ?

What is a possible method for steering a canopy with one arm ?

(never seen an AN-28)
Does this a/c have a "lip" at the bottom of the side
like a CASA, or is it smooth all the way like a Skyvan?

[danielcroft 2]

I've steered my canopy with one hand before, it's not optimal by any means but doable. I would have thought that you could also try steering with harness. Obviously flaring with harness isn't really an option and harness may not be much of an option at all depending on loading, canopy, etc. but should at least be considered.

[ryoder 1,590]

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In the interests of prevention, Is there any more
information on how this happened to her arm?

Collision with the a/c ? Caught the floor edge or side on exit ? Piece-launch gone bad ?

The 4-way base had grips before they left the plane, and somehow as the base flattened out, a torque was applied to her arm that caused the dislocation.

She was a small, slender woman, and her reserve looked to be very reasonably sized, so I was surprised at the broken femur.

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Also, has anyone grabbed a toggle with their good arm,
then reached over for the other one and steered with two
toggles in one hand ?

If it ever happened to me, that would be what I would try, in the hope I could flare the landing.

In fact, perhaps the best strategy would be to see if you could reach the opposite toggle before releasing brakes.
If not, then maybe leave both brakes stowed in the interests of a slower landing, and just use one riser for turns.

"There are only three things of value: younger women, faster airplanes, and bigger crocodiles" - Arthur Jones.

[Andy9o8 2]

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If it ever happened to me, that would be what I would try, in the hope I could flare the landing.

In fact, perhaps the best strategy would be to see if you could reach the opposite toggle before releasing brakes.
If not, then maybe leave both brakes stowed in the interests of a slower landing, and just use one riser for turns.

I've been considering the same question: (a) leave the brakes stowed (thus keeping it set at roughly half brakes), use only risers and harness to turn, and then PLF, or (b) unstow the brakes and flare with one hand on both toggles.

I'm still undecided. Other people have used the one hand on both toggles method successfully. But I'm concerned that I might accidentally let go of one toggle at about 50 feet and wind up with my canopy and me hitting the ground at the same time.

[mdrejhon 8]

Broken shoulder/arm....
Upon tests I did at high altitude a couple years ago, I've decided (for MY personal case) under a non-elliptical square that's not heavily loaded at all, I'll be having one hand on both toggles, controls are inversed that way, pulling left turns right, pulling right turns left. I found I would only have the strength to do a 3/4 flare (it's hard to do with one hand), but that'll be enough to do a standup landing on sufficient windy days, with preparation to PLR the landing. I also tested one-toggle-accidentally-released / one-toggle-still-stowed situation by steering differentially with one toggle, but flare is more dangerous.

IIRC, there's a dz.com post someone successfully controlling and landing, flaring with one hand, so seems it has been done before. I think it was a low-timer with dislocated shoulder, but can't remember.

Under a small elliptical, it could potentially spin out of control if I tried to unstow a brake one by one, so be careful. And a student may not understand controlling well enough to aim the canopy safely to landing with just one hand, and easily break legs landing at full glide with no flare, rather than unstowed half brakes... So ignore my post please unless it makes total sense.

[DSE 5]

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But I'm concerned that I might accidentally let go of one toggle at about 50 feet and wind up with my canopy and me hitting the ground at the same time.

Although it wasn't one-handed, letting go of one toggle during the flare (at about 4') is still not a pleasant experience.

[happythoughts 0]

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The 4-way base had grips before they left the plane, and somehow as the base flattened out, a torque was applied to her arm that caused the dislocation.

Having spent a lot of time as outside-center, I can
appreciate the amount of torque that can happen
in a piece launch.

I spent a lot of time with a 5' tall person at point.
Many times, I would reach up and move her a little during
the exit. Nothing strenuous though.

[yeyo 1]

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IIRC, there's a dz.com post someone successfully controlling and landing, flaring with one hand, so seems it has been done before. I think it was a low-timer with dislocated shoulder, but can't remember.

My friend that got me in the sport did exactly that.
It was around his 25th jump. Dislocated right shoulder on exit, tumbling in freefall while he was pushing the pilot chute out of BOC with his left hand. He managed to get the main out and then flying and flaring with both toggles in left hand.
Same shoulder dislocated on another jump after that, and he went straight to reserve. Flew and landed the reserve the same way, both toggles in left hand.
He quit jumping after that.

HISPA #93
DS #419.5